Vols offense looked at as gimmick

#126
#126
VolForLife83 said:
If the gimmicky offense article wasn't enough, we now have, Sam Monson puking all over us. It's angering, yet funny at the same time.



https://www.google.com/amp/s/atozsp...le/news-tennessee-vols-offense-heupel-milton/
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That's not upsetting. It's funny.

They belittle the offense out of a need for self preservation. They need to be able to pretend to be smarter than everyone else, otherwise, they're just 2 obscure guys watching football like the rest of us. They need complicated progressions and juicy film in order to be relevant. Nevermind that on most plays, QBs are just finding single coverage, making a high/low read and then going to a safety valve. It's not the rocket science they pretend it is.
 
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#127
#127
It’s like a lot of things. They don’t ask how, they just ask how many. As in, how many points did you score? And this offense does a fabulous job of that to the point that it frustrates the opposition. Could care less what any coach, pundit or fan thinks about it. If you don’t like it, come up with a better defense.
 
#128
#128
Vol865 said:
They only have 53 players and some of them are in their 30s. They're not gonna run tempo like we do.
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Depends on what wins games. The age thing is no different than running as a QB. Tempo though could extend careers since it capitalizes on the head as much as the arm.
 
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#129
#129
I seem to recall both colleges and pros duplicating the no huddle offense. Isn't this a tempo tactic?
Oh well, hypocrites, gonna hypocrite, I suppose.
 
#130
#130
Pennheel said:
There's nothing wrong with having a gimmick offense. It's highly entertaining and lead to a 11-2 record, a bowl win and a coach getting an extension.
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The thing about gimmicky offenses, some coaching staff will eventually figure out how to defend it. Heupel has been offensive coordinator at Oklahoma and Missouri. Look at the offenses he had with each. Big numbers. Head coach at UCF, and once again, bick offensive numbers. His offense, in my opinion, is not a gimmick. It's very well thought out and planned. Another year of signing another level athlete, and it will be interesting to see what happens.
 
#131
#131
WoodsmanVol said:
I seem to recall both colleges and pros duplicating the no huddle offense. Isn't this a tempo tactic?
Oh well, hypocrites, gonna hypocrite, I suppose.
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Jim Kelly and the Buffalo Bills were running almost exclusively no huddle 30 years ago. Nothing is new. It’s just recycled and modified.
 
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#132
#132
sjt18 said:
Depends on what wins games. The age thing is no different than running as a QB. Tempo though could extend careers since it capitalizes on the head as much as the arm.
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I promise you 30 yr old NFL vets are not going to want to run 90 plays a game. They're probably not going to buy in and that coach won't be there long. A system is only works when people are bought into the system
 
#133
#133
Vol865 said:
I promise you 30 yr old NFL vets are not going to want to run 90 plays a game. They're probably not going to buy in and that coach won't be there long. A system is only works when people are bought into the system
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You can "promise" whatever you want to promise. The same "vets" don't run the ball either but some teams are. If you offer them a way to win while not having to run then you've offered them something of great value.
 
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#134
#134
sjt18 said:
You can "promise" whatever you want to promise. The same "vets" don't run the ball either but some teams are. If you offer them a way to win while not having to run then you've offered them something of great value.
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Don't run the ball? What are you talking about?

And more plays means more chances for injury and less dollars in their pockets so let me know how that goes
 
#135
#135
I preface this by saying I dislike the NFL style of football. I find it very boring but, its style is likely a product of the player's athleticism and experience.

Heupel's offense puts a lot of stress on defenses by spreading the field and then running between the tackles. Going fast may not work as well in the NFL because of the experience factor but college football is a very different animal.

The UGA game may have been different had it been played in Knoxville. The noise factor alone gives the defense that small time advantage, when the ball is snapped, that is a difference maker.

We'll see how that game goes in Knoxville this year but the Bama game gets even more difficult for the same reason.
 
#136
#136
iuvol said:
I thought time of possession was the name of the game LOL. According to a beat writer who covers Notre Dame it was.
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Yeah, those 11 wins and top 5-6 in the country ranking really pale in comparison knowing we were probably last in the country in TOP. What was I thinking? Lol

Edit-almost forgot pulling down LSUs britches and spanking them at their house. Honestly, barely even remember us having the ball much in that game so I guess we really lost?
 
#137
#137
bigorangepoppa said:
The thing about gimmicky offenses, some coaching staff will eventually figure out how to defend it. Heupel has been offensive coordinator at Oklahoma and Missouri. Look at the offenses he had with each. Big numbers. Head coach at UCF, and once again, bick offensive numbers. His offense, in my opinion, is not a gimmick. It's very well thought out and planned. Another year of signing another level athlete, and it will be interesting to see what happens.
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Don't forget that one year sojourn at the powerhouse that is Utah State !
 
#140
#140
Who the f***k really cares what people think or say? Seriously, why would anyone feel a need to defend the program and offense against clearly ignorant comments by idiots on social media (an oxymoron?) who see ESPN highlights and nothing more?

Opposing coaches and players watch the offense and have to prepare for it and play against it, and other than a fool like Levis are the people to listen to regarding what this system is, not some yahoo fans and media hacks spouting off on Twitter.
 
#142
#142
Vol865 said:
Don't run the ball? What are you talking about?

And more plays means more chances for injury and less dollars in their pockets so let me know how that goes
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About QB's running more in the NFL now than they used to and the risks associated with that vs running tempo.

More successful plays means better stats and MORE dollars in their pockets.
 
#143
#143
sjt18 said:
About QB's running more in the NFL now than they used to and the risks associated with that vs running tempo.

More successful plays means better stats and MORE dollars in their pockets.
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The difference is running QBs were afforded an opportunity they wouldn't have had in the league by that innovation so injury risk is negligible to a degree for them. NFL has 53 guys, some playing multiple roles and not near the depth a college team has for their levels of play respectively. That means significant drop off if you rotate guys to keep them fresh or keeping a guy in a bunch of extra plays adding wear and tear to his body of a 17+ game season. Most are going to forego that and sign with teams that don't use tempo.

Can the offense work at that level from an Xs and Os and philosophy perspective? Absolutely.

Things change when you factor in everything else.

However there are ways to simulate tempo with late motions/shifts, sugar huddles, and the occasional, strategic use of actual tempo.
 
#144
#144
cherokeeeVOL said:
Opposing fans think it's a gimmick but opposing coaches know it's not and struggle to defend it. It's also a tired narrative that all this offense does is go fast and chuck the ball down the field. It's much more than that and starts with the run game. If it's such a gimmick then why has UT been one of the top teams in total offense two years in a row? Also, I want opposing fan bases to hate us again. Maybe that's returning.
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LOL that is why Kirby Smart spent a significant amount of time preparing for it in the offseason. He knew it was going to be a beast to defend and gave it extra attention.
 
#146
#146
Vol865 said:
The difference is running QBs were afforded an opportunity they wouldn't have had in the league by that innovation so injury risk is negligible to a degree for them. NFL has 53 guys, some playing multiple roles and not near the depth a college team has for their levels of play respectively. That means significant drop off if you rotate guys to keep them fresh or keeping a guy in a bunch of extra plays adding wear and tear to his body of a 17+ game season. Most are going to forego that and sign with teams that don't use tempo.

Can the offense work at that level from an Xs and Os and philosophy perspective? Absolutely.

Things change when you factor in everything else.

However there are ways to simulate tempo with late motions/shifts, sugar huddles, and the occasional, strategic use of actual tempo.
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You could have just said, "Maybe it could work" rather than railing that it cannot. Someone should and probably will try it. Particularly when you consider that it isn't all about speed even with Heupel. It is about control. Tiring a D out helps. But you also prevent situational subs and complicate communication on D. Those things are beneficial whether you snap it with 1 second on the clock or 20.
 
#149
#149
It doesn't matter if you have a gimmick offense. What matters is how easy it is to prep for. The gimmick offenses that are easy to prep for tend to do poorly in season openers and bowl games (because teams have weeks to prepare for the gimmick)....we're averaging 38 ppg in our bowls and openers (not counting mid-major tune-ups as first game...I'm talking first game against a major school).
 
#150
#150
sjt18 said:
You could have just said, "Maybe it could work" rather than railing that it cannot. Someone should and probably will try it. Particularly when you consider that it isn't all about speed even with Heupel. It is about control. Tiring a D out helps. But you also prevent situational subs and complicate communication on D. Those things are beneficial whether you snap it with 1 second on the clock or 20.
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Schematically, yes. Can it work with 53 old dudes? Probably not
 
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