To Protect and to Serve...

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#1,026
#1,026
I don't think the cigarette thing is the issue here, its his resistance to their efforts to cite him or get control of the situation that caused the take-down in an effort to arrest.

You can debate the take down since it was a choke hold and those apparently are banned in NYC. But, it appears from me from a false arrest perspective they definitely had probable cause to arrest him, either for the cig thing or for resisting or obstructing.
 
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#1,027
#1,027
lawgator1 said:
I don't think the cigarette thing is the issue here, its his resistance to their efforts to cite him or get control of the situation that caused the take-down in an effort to arrest.

You can debate the take down since it was a choke hold and those apparently are banned in NYC. But, it appears from me from a false arrest perspective they definitely had probable cause to arrest him, either for the cig thing or for resisting or obstructing.
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...

That's really all I can say.
 
#1,028
#1,028
lawgator1 said:
I don't think the cigarette thing is the issue here, its his resistance to their efforts to cite him or get control of the situation that caused the take-down in an effort to arrest.

You can debate the take down since it was a choke hold and those apparently are banned in NYC. But, it appears from me from a false arrest perspective they definitely had probable cause to arrest him, either for the cig thing or for resisting or obstructing.
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You only think this because you are a racist. :p

- there is no good reason for banning this kind of entrepreneurship
- there is no good reason for wasting law enforcement resources on this type of crime
- there is no reason to escalate a non-violent situation into a lethal one

The cops and EMTs involved should lose their jobs for negligence. His life could have been saved in the aftermath. The cop who applied the choke-hold should go to jail for a long time.

Anybody that takes the side of the officers is pure evil.
 
#1,029
#1,029
lawgator1 said:
I don't think the cigarette thing is the issue here, its his resistance to their efforts to cite him or get control of the situation that caused the take-down in an effort to arrest.

You can debate the take down since it was a choke hold and those apparently are banned in NYC. But, it appears from me from a false arrest perspective they definitely had probable cause to arrest him, either for the cig thing or for resisting or obstructing.
Click to expand...

I didn't see much resistance. That was a big guy. If he really wanted to resist, it would be a lot more obvious.
 
#1,030
#1,030
I don't know why people still smoke cigarettes now days anyway. The laws that are in place now alone make it rough. You can't smoke here there or out on the sidewalk. The only place to smoke is in your car but you better not have one of your kids there in the car w/you. I quit smoking 20 years ago after 30 years of smoking because there were new laws coming out to make it hard for smokers & I didn't want to deal & have to put up w/all the hassle from friends plus at the workplace it was doing away with it as well.
 
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#1,031
#1,031
W.TN.Orange Blood said:
I don't know why people still smoke cigarettes now days anyway. The laws that are in place now alone make it rough. You can't smoke here there or out on the sidewalk. The only place to smoke is in your car but you better not have one of your kids there in the car w/you. I quit smoking 20 years ago after 30 years of smoking because there were new laws coming out to make it hard for smokers & I didn't want to put up w/all the hassle plus at the workplace it was doing away with it as well.
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I'm a rebel. I smoke where I want. Except restaurants.
 
#1,033
#1,033
W.TN.Orange Blood said:
I don't know why people still smoke cigarettes now days anyway. The laws that are in place now alone make it rough. You can't smoke here there or out on the sidewalk. The only place to smoke is in your car but you better not have one of your kids there in the car w/you. I quit smoking 20 years ago after 30 years of smoking because there were new laws coming out to make it hard for smokers & I didn't want deal & have to put up w/all the hassle plus at the workplace it was doing away with it as well.
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I agree. It's pretty bull**** how smokers are treated (I don't/never smoked). By the law, and by custom, they are treated like second-class citizens.
 
#1,037
#1,037
Obsessed said:
Y'all should be thankful for smokers. We pay more taxes than anybody.
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And you collect less Social Security.

Hell, you were paying more than your share of gasoline tax, with your lawn care business, too. You're getting gouged every which way. :hi:
 
#1,038
#1,038
n_huffhines said:
And you collect less Social Security.

Hell, you were paying more than your share of gasoline tax, with your lawn care business, too. You're getting gouged every which way. :hi:
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Oh I know. I think I'm going back in to business too. It's been 5 years and my no show clause is up.

I need 6 figures again.
 
#1,044
#1,044
The Stealing Of America By The Cops, The Courts, The Corporations And Congress | Zero Hedge

"$34 billion for police departments to add to their arsenals of weapons and equipment. Since President Obama took office, police departments across the country “have received tens of thousands of machine guns; nearly 200,000 ammunition magazines; thousands of pieces of camouflage and night-vision equipment; and hundreds of silencers, armored cars and aircraft.” While police departments like to frame the acquisition of military surplus as a money-saving method, in a twisted sort of double jeopardy, the taxpayer ends up footing a bigger bill. First, taxpayers are forced to pay millions of dollars for equipment which the Defense Department purchases from megacorporations only to abandon after a few years. Then taxpayers find themselves footing the bill to maintain the costly equipment once it has been acquired by the local police."
 
#1,047
#1,047
The New York case is getting more interesting.

One of the questions raised is whether the police overreacted, first by the presence of six officers who end up dealing with a guy selling cigarettes, and then with the choke hold take down.

As to the latter, it seems to me there is a problem there and its going to result in at least civil sanctions. I don't know that it rises to the level of criminal by the officer, I tend to doubt it, but he's probably out of a job and the city is going to have to write a sizeable check.

As to the number of officers, the police chief there subscribes to a theory called "broken windows." That is, if there is an abandoned house and it has broken windows that just sit there, then criminals know that no one cares. Prostitutes, drug users, flock to it. So the theory is to enforce the law and have a presence, maybe even over-presence, even for minor things.

The result is that they are arresting people for subway performing, etc., in big numbers. But get this -- murders are down from 2400 to 300. So while this incident sparks protest, and understandably so as to the choke hold, there may be value to the theory of police presence as a deterrent in and of itself that shouldn't be lost in the noise.


Opinion: What led to choke hold death - CNN.com
 
#1,048
#1,048
lawgator1 said:
The New York case is getting more interesting.

One of the questions raised is whether the police overreacted, first by the presence of six officers who end up dealing with a guy selling cigarettes, and then with the choke hold take down.

As to the latter, it seems to me there is a problem there and its going to result in at least civil sanctions. I don't know that it rises to the level of criminal by the officer, I tend to doubt it, but he's probably out of a job and the city is going to have to write a sizeable check.

As to the number of officers, the police chief there subscribes to a theory called "broken windows." That is, if there is an abandoned house and it has broken windows that just sit there, then criminals know that no one cares. Prostitutes, drug users, flock to it. So the theory is to enforce the law and have a presence, maybe even over-presence, even for minor things.

The result is that they are arresting people for subway performing, etc., in big numbers. But get this -- murders are down from 2400 to 300. So while this incident sparks protest, and understandably so as to the choke hold, there may be value to the theory of police presence as a deterrent in and of itself that shouldn't be lost in the noise.


Opinion: What led to choke hold death - CNN.com
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Rule by fear...subway performers were by large my favorite part of new York.

Also that police officer needs to be arrested for murder. A choke hold is never necessary.
 
#1,049
#1,049
Fantastic. It's okay that a few people die in a demonstration of forceful police presence, as long as the numbers look better for the politicians.
 
#1,050
#1,050
MercyPercy said:
Fantastic. It's okay that a few people die in a demonstration of forceful police presence, as long as the numbers look better for the politicians.
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As someone who is generally pro law enforcement, I'm inclined to side with you on this one. This was clear cut overreach and abuse of power.
 
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