'19 TN RB Eric Gray

SweetasSoda

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I didn't hear what the actual smoke was...

It jerked me the wrong way seeing people unimaginatively disrespect former alumni for with no backing or actual reasoning at all... as far as the "Kamara comparison" people keep rolling their eyes about... he reminded me of him in 2020... maybe not the crazy balance, but the electricity that hit the turf when he got the ball was similar... they're also both 5'10", 209-215 lbs, very similar builds....I did not mean they were the exact same player... Sony Michel also had a similar style... by this I mean that always moving forward, one-cut run style with elite change of direction and great speed/acceleration... the kind that pretty much always makes the first guy miss or at least come into the tackle crooked... I wasn't comparing their compiled yardage, touchdowns, broken tackle tallies, etc... just a straight eyeball test on three different backs that played in three completely different offenses on three completely different teams... who's to say what Walter Payton would have done on the Colts with Peyton Manning with insert <OL here>? Statistics don't necessarily grade an athlete... Chubb was better than Michel... we saw that in action.... Garner was better than Little Man Stewart... we saw that in action... Jamal Lewis was better than an actual bulldozer.... we saw that in action...

Also, not really his fault CJP was giving him sacks of money? (which, reminder, is legal now).... and that stuff was being done long, long before it was legal by every coach we've had... and every coach Alabama's had.... Georgia.... Florida.... LSU.... Texas A&M.... Ohio State... Michigan.... Oregon... Miami... Florida State... Clemson.... pretty much every college football hotspot around the country... let's not be naive here.... so are we mad that was happening? ....or mad CJP did it out in the open unashamedly, got caught, and this kid was one of the players definitely receiving benefits?
Think you still missed my point. Considering the sacks of money, and it highly likely that he was one of the ones that there was proof of it considering he left with the group and being held out in the last game, how likely is it that he would be allowed back even if he wanted to come back? So why do people keep arguing about it? More importantly, why do I have to keep coming here to read it if there’s no chance? 😫
 

Mr French

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Well we did have 2 seasons to watch him play before that.... where, maybe I was the only one at home saying "Man, they need to put Eric Gray in WTF are they doing?"

I don't know what "bad plays" you're taking about? He hasn't lost a fumble his entire career in college, was a finalist for Mr Football out of Division II AA TSSAA both his Junior/Senior year, and there's not much you can do if you run into a wall your OL didn't open any holes for... There's not really a back that exists that's "program changing"... Kamara... Derrick Henry... Ladanian Tomlinson... none were really "program changing".... maybe Adrian Peterson?

He has a ton of film, elite change of direction ability, and way above average speed/acceleration... if you can't see that with your eyeballs, you don't need to be evaluating running backs
HS football doesn't matter, not an irrelevant high school award debate so get out of here with that insignificant stat. You're really going to say Henry isn't program changing? He literally changed the Titans franchise and won every award possible his junior year at Alabama and set school and the SEC rushing record of over 2,100yds in a season.... I said the same thing as you until I saw Gray try to pass protect and immediately knew why he was behind Chandler. What good is a RB that comes in and you know he's running the ball because he sure isn't protecting the QB. That's honestly a big part of the job.
 
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DaddyChad

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I didn't hear what the actual smoke was...

It jerked me the wrong way seeing people unimaginatively disrespect former alumni for with no backing or actual reasoning at all... as far as the "Kamara comparison" people keep rolling their eyes about... he reminded me of him in 2020... maybe not the crazy balance, but the electricity that hit the turf when he got the ball was similar... they're also both 5'10", 209-215 lbs, very similar builds....I did not mean they were the exact same player... Sony Michel also had a similar style... by this I mean that always moving forward, one-cut run style with elite change of direction and great speed/acceleration... the kind that pretty much always makes the first guy miss or at least come into the tackle crooked... I wasn't comparing their compiled yardage, touchdowns, broken tackle tallies, etc... just a straight eyeball test on three different backs that played in three completely different offenses on three completely different teams... who's to say what Walter Payton would have done on the Colts with Peyton Manning with insert <OL here>? Statistics don't necessarily grade an athlete... Chubb was better than Michel... we saw that in action.... Garner was better than Little Man Stewart... we saw that in action... Jamal Lewis was better than an actual bulldozer.... we saw that in action...

Also, not really his fault CJP was giving him sacks of money? (which, reminder, is legal now).... and that stuff was being done long, long before it was legal by every coach we've had... and every coach Alabama's had.... Georgia.... Florida.... LSU.... Texas A&M.... Ohio State... Michigan.... Oregon... Miami... Florida State... Clemson.... pretty much every college football hotspot around the country... let's not be naive here.... so are we mad that was happening? ....or mad CJP did it out in the open unashamedly, got caught, and this kid was one of the players definitely receiving benefits?
I’m not mad at Gray and I would welcome him back. We just live in a reality where that can’t happen.
 

butchna

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1) The most electric player we had on offense 2 years ago, ****by far****, leaves in the portal when the head coach gets fired... (which makes sense, cause they recruited him)
2) We don't have experienced RB depth.... Small is a good back... Wright is not, average at best... everybody past that is freshman or subpar... Gray is NFL quality... nobody we have on roster that I've seen is close to that...
3) What you really mean when you say "I would prefer him not come back".... is "I would prefer Tennessee to be worse next year, because if you leave the program I pay attention to, I don't *like* you anymore, and barring you from ever returning is the only validation of that feeling I have that's acceptable to me"

...its petty
I compare this debate to the one regarding whether VN posters wanted Dan Mullen or not…doesn’t matter. We don’t get a vote. IF the coaches are interested and he reciprocates, he would be back. If not, he won’t and next. 😴
 

PoweredByTheT

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HS football doesn't matter, not an irrelevant high school award debate so get out of here with that insignificant stat. You're really going to say Henry isn't program changing? He literally changed the Titans franchise and won every award possible his junior year at Alabama and set school and the SEC rushing record of over 2,100yds in a season.... I said the same thing as you until I saw Gray try to pass protect and immediately knew why he was behind Chandler. What good is a RB that comes in and you know he's running the ball because he sure isn't protecting the QB. That's honestly a big part of the job.
Well, there were 2 seasons that program-changing Derrick Henry split time as the #2 behind Demarco Murray, a third where he still wasn't trusted at all as a receiving threat, barely broke 1000 yards and racked up some TDs... then, his 4th year in the league, they finally give him a feature role and he was great for 2-1/2 seasons till he broke down from usage... also Alabama had 3 other 5* backs behind Henry that would have picked up similar yardage behind the ridiculous OL they've had for years... so no... I don't think Derrick Henry was program-changing for anybody really... I think he's a great back with bad hands (unless they are being used to stiff-arm linebackers)... he's like 250 lbs and runs a 4.5... I mean... he's a freak of nature.... I enjoy seeing safeties make potentially life-altering decisions on whether to try to tackle him when he gets loose...

But...

Titans record the past 10 seasons, Henry's production, and what coach was active...

2021 12-5 (937 yards, 10 TDs)
2020 11-5 (2027 yards, 17 TDs)
2019 9-7 (1540 yards, 16 TDs)
2018 9-7 (1058 yards, 12 TDs) (Mike Vrabel hired)
2017 9-7 (744 yards, 5 TDs)
2016 9-7 (490 yards, 5 TDs)
2015 3-13 (Mike Mularkey hired)
2014 2-14 (Ken Wisenhunt hired)
2013 7-9
2012 6-10
2011 9-7 (Mike Munchak hired)
Jeff Fisher Era

So unless you're telling me Henry's 490 yards and 5 TDs directly contributed to transforming the Titans from 3-13 to 9-7 in one year... Henry's numbers didn't really correlate to record changes other than having the one 2k season.... but then the next year they do better without him after 8 games...... so... I dunno man... he's a great back with a big hole his game, that he makes up for with the ability to stiff-arm a defensive end :p

All that being said... I think "program-changing running back" is a silly term... This is the same reason RBs don't go #1 overall in the NFL draft... they don't last long even if they are absolute studs and every team that drafts one in the top 10 ends up regretting it, even if they don't turn out extremely disappointing... other than maybe Adrian Peterson... but that boy different.... Zeke Elliot is a good example... great back, he worked out for the most part, has had some good seasons... they probably should have used that pick on something else, though...

There's other blocking solutions than demanding a RB play in pass protection... also.... that's a teachable thing... breaking a man's shins trying to reverse direction to arm-tackle you is not a teachable thing...
 
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I compare this debate to the one regarding whether VN posters wanted Dan Mullen or not…doesn’t matter. We don’t get a vote. IF the coaches are interested and he reciprocates, he would be back. If not, he won’t and next. 😴
you're absolutely correct... like I said.... it hit me the wrong way people were saying he sucked :D
 

Mr French

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Well, there were 2 seasons that program-changing Derrick Henry split time as the #2 behind Demarco Murray, a third where he still wasn't trusted at all as a receiving threat, barely broke 1000 yards and racked up some TDs... then, his 4th year in the league, they finally give him a feature role and he was great for 2-1/2 seasons till he broke down from usage... also Alabama had 3 other 5* backs behind Henry that would have picked up similar yardage behind the ridiculous OL they've had for years... so no... I don't think Derrick Henry was program-changing for anybody really... I think he's a great back with bad hands (unless they are being used to stiff-arm linebackers)... he's like 250 lbs and runs a 4.5... I mean... he's a freak of nature.... I enjoy seeing safeties make potentially life-altering decisions on whether to try to tackle him when he gets loose...

But...

Titans record the past 10 seasons, Henry's production, and what coach was active...

2021 12-5 (937 yards, 10 TDs)
2020 11-5 (2027 yards, 17 TDs)
2019 9-7 (1540 yards, 16 TDs)
2018 9-7 (1058 yards, 12 TDs) (Mike Vrabel hired)
2017 9-7 (744 yards, 5 TDs)
2016 9-7 (490 yards, 5 TDs)
2015 3-13 (Mike Mularkey hired)
2014 2-14 (Ken Wisenhunt hired)
2013 7-9
2012 6-10
2011 9-7 (Mike Munchak hired)
Jeff Fisher Era

So unless you're telling me Henry's 490 yards and 5 TDs directly contributed to transforming the Titans from 3-13 to 9-7 in one year... Henry's numbers didn't really correlate to record changes other than having the one 2k season.... but then the next year they do better without him after 8 games...... so... I dunno man... he's a great back with a big hole his game, that he makes up for with the ability to stiff-arm a defensive end :p

All that being said... I think "program-changing running back" is a silly term... This is the same reason RBs don't go #1 overall in the NFL draft... they don't last long even if they are absolute studs and every team that drafts one in the top 10 ends up regretting it, even if they don't turn out extremely disappointing... other than maybe Adrian Peterson... but that boy different.... Zeke Elliot is a good example... great back, he worked out for the most part, has had some good seasons... they probably should have used that pick on something else, though...

There's other blocking solutions than demanding a RB play in pass protection... also.... that's a teachable thing... breaking a man's shins trying to reverse direction to arm-tackle you is not a teachable thing...
Grays never sniffed 1000 yds. You basically showed why Henry is a future collegiate and NFL HOF running back and i wouldn't say Henry ever broke down like his knees gave out or had a bunch of concussions. He broke a metatarsal in his foot. He was on pace for another 2000 yd season. I would say he absolutely changed the expectations of what was expected of Alabama RB's to unreasonable amounts but the fact he's 250 lbs and running a 4.5 even at Alabama he really doesn't need to do all that. Gray is a good player and if he came back great. He shouldn't be talked about in the same breadth as Kamara, Henry, or Tomlinson because he isn't close to that and right now it's unreasonable expectations.
Edit: there's not been a 5* since Henry who could do what he can do. I get what your trying to say but Henry is a generational running back.
 

DaddyChad

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Well, there were 2 seasons that program-changing Derrick Henry split time as the #2 behind Demarco Murray, a third where he still wasn't trusted at all as a receiving threat, barely broke 1000 yards and racked up some TDs... then, his 4th year in the league, they finally give him a feature role and he was great for 2-1/2 seasons till he broke down from usage... also Alabama had 3 other 5* backs behind Henry that would have picked up similar yardage behind the ridiculous OL they've had for years... so no... I don't think Derrick Henry was program-changing for anybody really... I think he's a great back with bad hands (unless they are being used to stiff-arm linebackers)... he's like 250 lbs and runs a 4.5... I mean... he's a freak of nature.... I enjoy seeing safeties make potentially life-altering decisions on whether to try to tackle him when he gets loose...

But...

Titans record the past 10 seasons, Henry's production, and what coach was active...

2021 12-5 (937 yards, 10 TDs)
2020 11-5 (2027 yards, 17 TDs)
2019 9-7 (1540 yards, 16 TDs)
2018 9-7 (1058 yards, 12 TDs) (Mike Vrabel hired)
2017 9-7 (744 yards, 5 TDs)
2016 9-7 (490 yards, 5 TDs)
2015 3-13 (Mike Mularkey hired)
2014 2-14 (Ken Wisenhunt hired)
2013 7-9
2012 6-10
2011 9-7 (Mike Munchak hired)
Jeff Fisher Era

So unless you're telling me Henry's 490 yards and 5 TDs directly contributed to transforming the Titans from 3-13 to 9-7 in one year... Henry's numbers didn't really correlate to record changes other than having the one 2k season.... but then the next year they do better without him after 8 games...... so... I dunno man... he's a great back with a big hole his game, that he makes up for with the ability to stiff-arm a defensive end :p

All that being said... I think "program-changing running back" is a silly term... This is the same reason RBs don't go #1 overall in the NFL draft... they don't last long even if they are absolute studs and every team that drafts one in the top 10 ends up regretting it, even if they don't turn out extremely disappointing... other than maybe Adrian Peterson... but that boy different.... Zeke Elliot is a good example... great back, he worked out for the most part, has had some good seasons... they probably should have used that pick on something else, though...

There's other blocking solutions than demanding a RB play in pass protection... also.... that's a teachable thing... breaking a man's shins trying to reverse direction to arm-tackle you is not a teachable thing...
Man how TF you do that?? Write a wall to justify a DA point that no one cares about? Knowing 99% won’t even read that wall of BS?
 
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mrMet

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That guy said Henry broke down from usage? Didn’t realize a foot break on a turf field known to cause foot injuries is breaking down from usage but go off chief
 

PoweredByTheT

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Man how TF you do that?? Write a wall to justify a DA point that no one cares about? Knowing 99% won’t even read that wall of BS?
Between Mr French, that keeps "counterpointing" me with things I never said and everybody else just mad the thread still exists... it's all moot point... e.g. nobody in this thread ever compared Eric Gray with Ladanian Tomlinson.... jeezum peets

- Eric Gray has elite change of direction and similar running style/build/quickness/speed to some backs that have been very successful in the SEC...
- if he were to magically reappear on the Tennessee roster, he would be the unquestioned starter for his senior season...
- if he were to get a feature back opportunity anywhere in the country (which he's yet to have), he would put up very good numbers....

.......before people started wigging out about name-dropping, that's all I wanted to say.... I am *super* done here, actually very sorry I popped in... I forgot how this board could be
 

T2P_Priceless

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Well, there were 2 seasons that program-changing Derrick Henry split time as the #2 behind Demarco Murray, a third where he still wasn't trusted at all as a receiving threat, barely broke 1000 yards and racked up some TDs... then, his 4th year in the league, they finally give him a feature role and he was great for 2-1/2 seasons till he broke down from usage... also Alabama had 3 other 5* backs behind Henry that would have picked up similar yardage behind the ridiculous OL they've had for years... so no... I don't think Derrick Henry was program-changing for anybody really... I think he's a great back with bad hands (unless they are being used to stiff-arm linebackers)... he's like 250 lbs and runs a 4.5... I mean... he's a freak of nature.... I enjoy seeing safeties make potentially life-altering decisions on whether to try to tackle him when he gets loose...

But...

Titans record the past 10 seasons, Henry's production, and what coach was active...

2021 12-5 (937 yards, 10 TDs)
2020 11-5 (2027 yards, 17 TDs)
2019 9-7 (1540 yards, 16 TDs)
2018 9-7 (1058 yards, 12 TDs) (Mike Vrabel hired)
2017 9-7 (744 yards, 5 TDs)
2016 9-7 (490 yards, 5 TDs)
2015 3-13 (Mike Mularkey hired)
2014 2-14 (Ken Wisenhunt hired)
2013 7-9
2012 6-10
2011 9-7 (Mike Munchak hired)
Jeff Fisher Era

So unless you're telling me Henry's 490 yards and 5 TDs directly contributed to transforming the Titans from 3-13 to 9-7 in one year... Henry's numbers didn't really correlate to record changes other than having the one 2k season.... but then the next year they do better without him after 8 games...... so... I dunno man... he's a great back with a big hole his game, that he makes up for with the ability to stiff-arm a defensive end :p

All that being said... I think "program-changing running back" is a silly term... This is the same reason RBs don't go #1 overall in the NFL draft... they don't last long even if they are absolute studs and every team that drafts one in the top 10 ends up regretting it, even if they don't turn out extremely disappointing... other than maybe Adrian Peterson... but that boy different.... Zeke Elliot is a good example... great back, he worked out for the most part, has had some good seasons... they probably should have used that pick on something else, though...

There's other blocking solutions than demanding a RB play in pass protection... also.... that's a teachable thing... breaking a man's shins trying to reverse direction to arm-tackle you is not a teachable thing...
Waaaaaaay TLDR
 

BigOrangeTrain

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I didn't hear what the actual smoke was...

It jerked me the wrong way seeing people unimaginatively disrespect former alumni for with no backing or actual reasoning at all... as far as the "Kamara comparison" people keep rolling their eyes about... he reminded me of him in 2020... maybe not the crazy balance, but the electricity that hit the turf when he got the ball was similar... they're also both 5'10", 209-215 lbs, very similar builds....I did not mean they were the exact same player... Sony Michel also had a similar style... by this I mean that always moving forward, one-cut run style with elite change of direction and great speed/acceleration... the kind that pretty much always makes the first guy miss or at least come into the tackle crooked... I wasn't comparing their compiled yardage, touchdowns, broken tackle tallies, etc... just a straight eyeball test on three different backs that played in three completely different offenses on three completely different teams... who's to say what Walter Payton would have done on the Colts with Peyton Manning with insert <OL here>? Statistics don't necessarily grade an athlete... Chubb was better than Michel... we saw that in action.... Garner was better than Little Man Stewart... we saw that in action... Jamal Lewis was better than an actual bulldozer.... we saw that in action...

Also, not really his fault CJP was giving him sacks of money? (which, reminder, is legal now).... and that stuff was being done long, long before it was legal by every coach we've had... and every coach Alabama's had.... Georgia.... Florida.... LSU.... Texas A&M.... Ohio State... Michigan.... Oregon... Miami... Florida State... Clemson.... pretty much every college football hotspot around the country... let's not be naive here.... so are we mad that was happening? ....or mad CJP did it out in the open unashamedly, got caught, and this kid was one of the players definitely receiving benefits?
You are going to severe lengths to take up for a slightly above average RB that screwed us and did absolutely nothing at OU.
 

BigOrangeTrain

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Between Mr French, that keeps "counterpointing" me with things I never said and everybody else just mad the thread still exists... it's all moot point... e.g. nobody in this thread ever compared Eric Gray with Ladanian Tomlinson.... jeezum peets

- Eric Gray has elite change of direction and similar running style/build/quickness/speed to some backs that have been very successful in the SEC...
- if he were to magically reappear on the Tennessee roster, he would be the unquestioned starter for his senior season...
- if he were to get a feature back opportunity anywhere in the country (which he's yet to have), he would put up very good numbers....

.......before people started wigging out about name-dropping, that's all I wanted to say.... I am *super* done here, actually very sorry I popped in... I forgot how this board could be
Lol.

1. If he had elite change of direction, as you think, he would have won the starting job at OU.

2. Making assumptions that he would supplant Small? Why? Especially when Small had better stats with an inferior OL.

3. If he were to get a starting job? If you are a back with elite intangibles you get a starting job.

Just stop dude. Your thoughts of Gray being this game changing player is flat out wrong. Stats say Gray is not as good as Small. Sorry but facts are facts.
 
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walkenvol

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1) The most electric player we had on offense 2 years ago, ****by far****, leaves in the portal when the head coach gets fired... (which makes sense, cause they recruited him)
2) We don't have experienced RB depth.... Small is a good back... Wright is not, average at best... everybody past that is freshman or subpar... Gray is NFL quality... nobody we have on roster that I've seen is close to that...
3) What you really mean when you say "I would prefer him not come back".... is "I would prefer Tennessee to be worse next year, because if you leave the program I pay attention to, I don't *like* you anymore, and barring you from ever returning is the only validation of that feeling I have that's acceptable to me"

...its petty
If Gray is NFL quality, then why enter the portal instead of the draft?
 
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