The reason most job postings end with “Experienced Required”

#1
volzfanz

volzfanz

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#1
This is NOT to bash Tee Martin. I am a big fan of Tee. I mean the guy won us a natl championship. But nowhere else can a person be considered for a major management job with zero experience. And I know you have to have a chance to get said experience, but you start small like an OC which he did. Then you cut your teeth in the smaller schools comparing wits with guys on your experience level. Tee is a great recruiter and a better than average OC. Being African American doesn’t hurt anything either. I’d say that’s a plus in this case. And please don’t make this about race. But any good business person wants some sense of security when making a hire this big and experience with a proven track record provides that sense of security. Especially after the last decade and the fiasco that has followed since. But IMO a resume that is blank when it comes to the job in question is probably not the best thing for this situation. I’m sure I’m in the minority when it comes to hiring Tee, but hiring with your heart instead of your head usually turns out to be a bad idea. JMO
 
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#2
#2
I hope Tee would come as an OC, but at this point I think he may be offended by that notion. But I could be totally off base on that and I hope I am.
 
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#4
#4
volzfanz said:
I hope Tee would come as an OC, but at this point I think he may be offended by that notion. But I could be totally off base on that and I hope I am.
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I see no chance of that. He has the #1 draft pick likely returning next year or take over at UT as OC. It’s a no brainer. He is on a path to be a HC very soon at USC. Only way he comes is HC.
 
#5
#5
BP4Prez said:
I see no chance of that. He has the #1 draft pick likely returning next year or take over at UT as OC. It’s a no brainer. Only way he comes is HC.
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I think that’s prob correct. But I don’t know any administrators that would hire someone with no experience at the most crucial moment in the history of their company. But I still think you are correct. And Darnold may be a factor.
 
#6
#6
David Shaw
Dabo Swinney
Mark Richt
Phil Fulmer
Mike Gundy
Jimbo Fisher
Lincoln Riley
Kirby Smart
Dan Mullen

All took over P5 programs with no head coaching experience. All have been successful. This narrative that you have to spend 8 years at Eastern Michigan and San Diego State before being successful as a head coach at a P5 school is simply false. This type of thinking gets you coaches like Derek Dooley and Butch Jones, rather than top-notch assistants like Tee Martin and Brent Venables.
 
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#7
#7
volzfanz said:
This is NOT to bash Tee Martin. I am a big fan of Tee. I mean the guy won us a natl championship. But nowhere else can a person be considered for a major management job with zero experience. And I know you have to have a chance to get said experience, but you start small like an OC which he did. Then you cut your teeth in the smaller schools comparing wits with guys on your experience level. Tee is a great recruiter and a better than average OC. Being African American doesn’t hurt anything either. I’d say that’s a plus in this case. And please don’t make this about race. But any good business person wants some sense of security when making a hire this big and experience with a proven track record provides that sense of security. Especially after the last decade and the fiasco that has followed since. But IMO a resume that is blank when it comes to the job in question is probably not the best thing for this situation. I’m sure I’m in the minority when it comes to hiring Tee, but hiring with your heart instead of your head usually turns out to be a bad idea. JMO
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Hold on did you just say being African-American doesn't hurt either.....?
 
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#9
#9
DiderotsGhost said:
David Shaw
Dabo Swinney
Mark Richt
Phil Fulmer
Mike Gundy
Jimbo Fisher
Lincoln Riley
Kirby Smart
Dan Mullen

All took over P5 programs with no head coaching experience. All have been successful. This narrative that you have to spend 8 years at Eastern Michigan and San Diego State before being successful as a head coach at a P5 school is simply false. This type of thinking gets you coaches like Derek Dooley and Butch Jones, rather than top-notch assistants like Tee Martin and Brent Venables.
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That’s a good list. But where is the list of the ones that tried and failed? I bet it’s a bit longer. And I’m not saying Tee would fail. I’m saying most important jobs require experience. So if you’re gonna list the exceptional ones then give me the list of failures and let’s see which is longer. It’s not impossible. Just less likely for no experience to succeed on their first job. Especially if that job pits you against the very best in the business.
 
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#12
#12
Caleb59seal said:
Hold on did you just say being African-American doesn't hurt either.....?
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Yes I did. I’ve heard more than one VFL
say on national radio broadcasts that TN would not offer Tee because he is African American. My response is that does not hurt his chances whatsoever. IMO. So don’t make it a racial issue. This is just about a coach and his experience. Nothing more.
 
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#15
#15
DiderotsGhost said:
David Shaw
Dabo Swinney
Mark Richt
Phil Fulmer
Mike Gundy
Jimbo Fisher
Lincoln Riley
Kirby Smart
Dan Mullen

All took over P5 programs with no head coaching experience. All have been successful. This narrative that you have to spend 8 years at Eastern Michigan and San Diego State before being successful as a head coach at a P5 school is simply false. This type of thinking gets you coaches like Derek Dooley and Butch Jones, rather than top-notch assistants like Tee Martin and Brent Venables.
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+1

This narrative of hiring a sitting head coach is not something Fulmer will limit himself to, thankfully. Tee checks all the boxes of what you look for in an OC moving to HC. If he wants to come I'd love to have him.
 
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#16
#16
volzfanz said:
That’s a good list. But where is the list of the ones that tried and failed? I bet it’s a bit longer. And I’m not saying Tee would fail. I’m saying most important jobs require experience. So if you’re gonna list the exceptional ones then give me the list of failures and let’s see which is longer. It’s not impossible. Just less likely for no experience to succeed on their first job. Especially if that job pits you against the very best in the business.
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The list of people with head coaching experience who "tried and failed" is also longer than the list of those who have succeeded. By definition, the number of people who succeed is smaller than the number of people who fail. Yet, you look at the history of these hires, there's not a very good argument that hiring an "experienced" mid-major coach works better than hiring a coordinator at a P5 school.

In fact, you are blatantly emphasizing one type of experience (head coaching) over another (Power 5, top-level competition). I'd argue that it's the latter type of experience that's more important. I'm more impressed by a guy who runs a successful offense at USC against elite competition than I am a guy who wins at Arkansas State against inferior competition.
 
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#17
#17
volzfanz said:
Yes I did. I’ve heard more than one VFL
say on national radio broadcasts that TN would not offer Tee because he is African American. My response is that does not hurt his chances whatsoever. IMO. So don’t make it a racial issue. This is just about a coach and his experience. Nothing more.
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Ohhhh wasn't aware if that....
 
#19
#19
DiderotsGhost said:
The list of people with head coaching experience who "tried and failed" is also longer than the list of those who have succeeded. By definition, the number of people who succeed is smaller than the number of people who fail. Yet, you look at the history of these hires, there's not a very good argument that hiring an "experienced" mid-major coach works better than hiring a coordinator at a P5 school.

In fact, you are blatantly emphasizing one type of experience (head coaching) over another (Power 5, top-level competition). I'd argue that it's the latter type of experience that's more important. I'm more impressed by a guy who runs a successful offense at USC against elite competition than I am a guy who wins at Arkansas State against inferior competition.
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Good point. Actually a very good point. But with a candidate that has had success at a power 5 school with an impressive winning percentage and maybe say a national championship on his resume, then why is not even in the conversation before someone with no experience at the HC level?
 
#21
#21
And throw in a coach of the year award as well. Although I think those are given out like candy sometimes.
 
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#22
#22
DiderotsGhost said:
The list of people with head coaching experience who "tried and failed" is also longer than the list of those who have succeeded. By definition, the number of people who succeed is smaller than the number of people who fail. Yet, you look at the history of these hires, there's not a very good argument that hiring an "experienced" mid-major coach works better than hiring a coordinator at a P5 school.

In fact, you are blatantly emphasizing one type of experience (head coaching) over another (Power 5, top-level competition). I'd argue that it's the latter type of experience that's more important. I'm more impressed by a guy who runs a successful offense at USC against elite competition than I am a guy who wins at Arkansas State against inferior competition.
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I have to admit this is a very good point. A good post that has really changed my way of thinking. But I still think experience is important.
 
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#23
#23
Bauce said:
It seems Experience is not required to be an AD:zeitung_lesen:
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Actually it is, but not the kind you think. The successful Tennessee ADs were coaches first; as such, they learned coaching and management. They learned to evaluate people - players and other coaches. They learned how to successfully manage a program.

ADs with management degrees never learned the business - they were simply taught how to administer. Everything else is OJT, but that's screwed up when it doesn't start at the bottom with the nuts and bolts of the business.

The most important part of the UTAD is keeping the football program running smoothly - that's the bread and butter; and there's no way that works successfully without good coaching. No one evaluates professionals better than an experienced professional in that profession. The AD simply has to come from the football coaching ranks, and the last three failed iterations leave little doubt.
 
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#24
#24
DiderotsGhost said:
David Shaw
Dabo Swinney
Mark Richt
Phil Fulmer
Mike Gundy
Jimbo Fisher
Lincoln Riley
Kirby Smart
Dan Mullen

All took over P5 programs with no head coaching experience. All have been successful. This narrative that you have to spend 8 years at Eastern Michigan and San Diego State before being successful as a head coach at a P5 school is simply false. This type of thinking gets you coaches like Derek Dooley and Butch Jones, rather than top-notch assistants like Tee Martin and Brent Venables.
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And every single one of those coaches were assistants for YEARS before getting their chance at being a head coach...Once again, Tee Martin is NOT ready to be a head coach...If he gets offered and takes the job then it will be a huge mistake and possibly career suicide if he fails and odds are he will fail...I love the guy and hope he will be UT's coach one day but how about paying your dues first and then go for the glory.
 
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#25
#25
I would consider Venables just as qualified as Tee if not more. But would we have to bring his sideline handler as a package deal?
 
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