The Official “Regular Posters of the Basketball Forum” Thread

#30,276
#30,276
sami said:
My answer to the question is that Momcilivic would have been worth $10 million to Pope to avoid a summer of the kind of abuse that spoiled, entitled fan base would have subjected him to. This at least buys him until next March, barring a mid-season meltdown if this roster doesn't provide the 25-27 wins that fan base will now expect.
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Yes, UK definitely needed the name value of Momcilovic, especially in June when they really hadn't made that huge splash UK is accustomed to yet.
 
#30,277
#30,277
bleedingTNorange said:
The hypothetical would probably have made more sense to say, would you prefer:

Juke & Lundblade for $6m or Momcilovic for $6m
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Would that even make a difference if we don't value Mom at $6M to begin with? I'm not sure if the formula you mentioned is for individual players or for the roster as a whole. If the valuation is on the individual level and we don't value him at his asking price, then I don't see how others being on the roster or not would move the needle.
 
#30,278
#30,278
Chris4Vols22 said:
I def think that makes sense. If Momsilovic is not willing to budge from the $5.5M price tag and if the staff/collective is not willing to pay that much, then this hypothetical is entirely moot imo.
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The hypothetical was really more about whether you believe Momcilovic brings 3-4x more talent and ability than Lundblade brings that would align with their NIL values.

I think MM is probably a better player, only because we have seen him perform at the highest level of competition, but I don't believe that he is 3-4x better than Lundblade. They have the exact same strengths and weaknesses.

Now if Lundblade comes in and struggles to perform at the SEC level to the point that he is giving consistent Darlinstone Dubar-level performances, then perhaps I'd back off of that belief. I don't expect that, though.
 
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#30,279
#30,279
cncchris33 said:
In terms of funding, I think you are partly right. Donors are willing to pony up for the right guys. But I don't think it is such a blank check that we are able (or willing) to front the cash for multiple guys commanding the kinds of salaries that Juke Harris and Momcilovic are commanding.

The other issue specific to Lundblade vs Momcilovic is timing. Literally 2 months have passed between Lubdblade committing and Momcilovic committing. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. Lubdblade came at a good value ahead of the rest of the class, addressed an obvious immediate need, and was in the boat before the portal hardly opened. That is significant because we were able to focus on other targets and financial allocations without having to wait around until the very end on a guy who was going to command a huge chunk of our budget, no matter how fluid it may have been.

All that considered, I don't believe Momcilovic brings so much more to the table that the cost and risk associated with him made him more valuable than Lundblade.
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Yeah, I think you bring up good points, especially on the timing.

Ftr, $5.5M sounds like too much to me, despite not truly knowing all of the nuances and even assuming our people would make the funds available.
 
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#30,280
#30,280
cncchris33 said:
The hypothetical was really more about whether you believe Momcilovic brings 3-4x more talent and ability than Lundblade brings that would align with their NIL values.

I think MM is probably a better player, only because we have seen him perform at the highest level of competition, but I don't believe that he is 3-4x better than Lundblade. They have the exact same strengths and weaknesses.

Now if Lundblade comes in and struggles to perform at the SEC level to the point that he is giving consistent Darlinstone Dubar-level performances, then perhaps I'd back off of that belief. I don't expect that, though.
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Yes, your point was not lost on me; I'm just being argumentative. I think you're driving at Momcilovic being overvalued by UK, and I agree. I also doubt that he will be perceptively 3-4x better than Lundblade (though I can't write off that possibility 😬).
 
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#30,282
#30,282
omghulkhands said:
Interesting
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Lots of variables for both players. I don't think it's a given that Momcilovic will keep his shooting quality up to last year's level, just as I don't think it's a given that Lundblade will be effective in the SEC. For all I know, Momcilovic may stink it up at UK while Lundblade is the second coming of Chris Lofton.
 
#30,284
#30,284
Chris4Vols22 said:
Ftr, $5.5M sounds like too much to me, despite not truly knowing all of the nuances and even assuming our people would make the funds available.
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It's too much to us and 99% of the CBB world, but double the price would have been a bargain to Pope as long as the deep pockets donors were willing to pony it up.
 
#30,285
#30,285
bleedingTNorange said:
Funds aren’t unlimited, I said that repeatedly this off season. They also stick very closely to their formula which determines a players value based on their budget, there’s not a player in the country their model would’ve told them to spend ~$6m on.
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I don’t know what their model is or how it evaluates players obviously, but if Tanner had entered the portal I’d say he would have easily been worth the $6 million assuming that money was available. Unlike Milan, he’s a great defender and has proven he can score at all three levels while distributing the basketball. Milan is a traffic cone on defense.

But I agree with the sentiment that there are very few players worth that kind of money.
 
#30,286
#30,286
Is there a TN or otherwise notable CBB player Chris Washington Jr compares to? Play style wise moreso than talent wise. See somebody talk about him like a wing and I’ve seen other people say he’ll be a center. Seems to me almost like a freshman version of Braeden Lue on our own roster
 
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#30,287
#30,287
Vol49er said:
Is there a TN or otherwise notable CBB player Chris Washington Jr compares to? Play style wise moreso than talent wise. See somebody talk about him like a wing and I’ve seen other people say he’ll be a center. Seems to me almost like a freshman version of Braeden Lue on our own roster
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Kind of a Bobby Portis Jr. skill set in a slim Nate Ament-like frame (6'-9, 200 lbs). He obviously won't have the first year impact at Tennessee that Portis had at Arkansas.
 
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#30,288
#30,288
I want to first preface this statement with the caveats that I’m not a scout and never even played basketball, I’m just a random dude, and this could be orange colored glasses and age poorly.

I much prefer Lundblade’s shot and offense, especially for UT’s offense.

Momcilovich had a better 3PT%, but of his games I watched in March and his highlights, his shot and his movement into his shot looks robotic. He seems to really consistently square his shoulders perfectly to the basket before taking a shot. I think this works wonders for his 3PT% because it’s extremely repeatable, but his release is slower and slightly lower than Lundblade’s release to me. He seems to need more space than Lundblade to take a shot. He is like an extremely good spot up shooter with a bit of mobility. I think this is why UT was able to lock him down so effectively.

For Lundblade, I only watched his highlights (not going to pretend I watch Belmont games), but while he squares up for set shots, there is a decent amount of shooting off of screens as well as some shooting off balance or fading away. I know I have read that he is one of the best shooters off of screens. His release seems higher and faster, and his shot looks much more fluid to me. His FT% is higher than Momcilovich as well and is up there with previous 3 PT shooting greats. I have a hard time seeing his offensive skills not being used well in UT’s system or seeing him being a bust offensively.

I get that Momcilovic has done it against better competition, but I still prefer Lundblade’s offense. Now defensively and overall I would choose Momcilovic as he’s bare minimum not a giant liability on defense and had some rebounding ability on Iowa State. Still def not worth 3-4x more for UT
 
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#30,289
#30,289
Lankykong said:
I want to first preface this statement with the caveats that I’m not a scout and never even played basketball, I’m just a random dude, and this could be orange colored glasses and age poorly.

I much prefer Lundblade’s shot and offense, especially for UT’s offense.

Momcilovich had a better 3PT%, but of his games I watched in March and his highlights, his shot and his movement into his shot looks robotic. He seems to really consistently square his shoulders perfectly to the basket before taking a shot. I think this works wonders for his 3PT% because it’s extremely repeatable, but his release is slower and slightly lower than Lundblade’s release to me. He seems to need more space than Lundblade to take a shot. He is like an extremely good spot up shooter with a bit of mobility. I think this is why UT was able to lock him down so effectively.

For Lundblade, I only watched his highlights (not going to pretend I watch Belmont games), but while he squares up for set shots, there is a decent amount of shooting off of screens as well as some shooting off balance or fading away. I know I have read that he is one of the best shooters off of screens. His release seems higher and faster, and his shot looks much more fluid to me. His FT% is higher than Momcilovich as well and is up there with previous 3 PT shooting greats. I have a hard time seeing his offensive skills not being used well in UT’s system or seeing him being a bust offensively.

I get that Momcilovic has done it against better competition, but I still prefer Lundblade’s offense. Now defensively and overall I would choose Momcilovic as he’s bare minimum not a giant liability on defense and had some rebounding ability on Iowa State. Still def not worth 3-4x more for UT
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Also worth noting, while Momcilovic led the nation in 3-pt shooting, last year, it was significantly higher than his career average (nearly 10% higher). Can he maintain that rate, or will he regress to the norm?

Lundblade actually has a higher career 3-pt shooting percentage.
 
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#30,292
#30,292
Chris4Vols22 said:
Yeah, I think you bring up good points, especially on the timing.

Ftr, $5.5M sounds like too much to me, despite not truly knowing all of the nuances and even assuming our people would make the funds available.
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I wouldn’t put it past Kentucky to gladly overpay for a guy just to show their fans that they’re trying “everything”.
 
#30,293
#30,293
Been out of pocket for the last 3 weeks or so and been getting caught back up over the last day or so. Surprised this hasn’t been dropped in here yet. What a funny final piece to this saga.

 
#30,295
#30,295
Lankykong said:
I want to first preface this statement with the caveats that I’m not a scout and never even played basketball, I’m just a random dude, and this could be orange colored glasses and age poorly.

I much prefer Lundblade’s shot and offense, especially for UT’s offense.

Momcilovich had a better 3PT%, but of his games I watched in March and his highlights, his shot and his movement into his shot looks robotic. He seems to really consistently square his shoulders perfectly to the basket before taking a shot. I think this works wonders for his 3PT% because it’s extremely repeatable, but his release is slower and slightly lower than Lundblade’s release to me. He seems to need more space than Lundblade to take a shot. He is like an extremely good spot up shooter with a bit of mobility. I think this is why UT was able to lock him down so effectively.

For Lundblade, I only watched his highlights (not going to pretend I watch Belmont games), but while he squares up for set shots, there is a decent amount of shooting off of screens as well as some shooting off balance or fading away. I know I have read that he is one of the best shooters off of screens. His release seems higher and faster, and his shot looks much more fluid to me. His FT% is higher than Momcilovich as well and is up there with previous 3 PT shooting greats. I have a hard time seeing his offensive skills not being used well in UT’s system or seeing him being a bust offensively.

I get that Momcilovic has done it against better competition, but I still prefer Lundblade’s offense. Now defensively and overall I would choose Momcilovic as he’s bare minimum not a giant liability on defense and had some rebounding ability on Iowa State. Still def not worth 3-4x more for UT
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I tend to agree with this, but as you said we'll really find out when the rubber hits the road. Lundblade looks like he will thrive off the same kind of floppy actions that we used with Knecht and especially Lanier and Gainey, and doesn't need to be completely squared up to deliver the shot. He can thrive in a motion system as well as being a deadly kick-out option.

Bishop wasn't required to chase Momcilivic around the floor, as Iowa St. was primarily trying to screen him open, and Boswell did a great job fighting through the screens and not giving him the room he needs. I see Momcilivic more as a spot up shooter benefiting from lane touch kick-outs than having motion actions run for him. The key with him is to resist doubling and stay home.
 
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#30,297
#30,297
berryvol said:
Been out of pocket for the last 3 weeks or so and been getting caught back up over the last day or so. Surprised this hasn’t been dropped in here yet. What a funny final piece to this saga.

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I think that is really his only legitimately reasonable reply after the fact. Pretend it was never a thing and try to move on.
 
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#30,298
#30,298
cncchris33 said:
The hypothetical was really more about whether you believe Momcilovic brings 3-4x more talent and ability than Lundblade brings that would align with their NIL values.

I think MM is probably a better player, only because we have seen him perform at the highest level of competition, but I don't believe that he is 3-4x better than Lundblade. They have the exact same strengths and weaknesses.

Now if Lundblade comes in and struggles to perform at the SEC level to the point that he is giving consistent Darlinstone Dubar-level performances, then perhaps I'd back off of that belief. I don't expect that, though.
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I don’t see MM performing that well in the SEC. We pretty much shut him down completely in the tournament just by having someone consistently in his space. That’s going to be every conference game next year.
 
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#30,299
#30,299
cncchris33 said:
I think that is really his only legitimately reasonable reply after the fact. Pretend it was never a thing and try to move on.
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Right, vols fans should not be offended this is what guys always say when they go back to the original school. Who knows how close things truly were but regardless move on and enjoy current team.
 
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#30,300
#30,300
cncchris33 said:
I think that is really his only legitimately reasonable reply after the fact. Pretend it was never a thing and try to move on.
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Yeah. I mean he never entered the portal so admitting he was close to coming to Tennessee would be basically self reporting yourself for a violation so it’s not a surprise he framed it as a non-issue.
 
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