Sick of this crap

[jwells]

I'm really getting sick of a lot of so-called "UT Fans." Everytime something bad happens, all of a sudden it's time to fire everyone.

Going 10-3 isn't good enough for you all...hell anything less than a NC ring, you want someone's head. OU just came off a NC game, now they're 1-2, coming off a loss to unranked UCLA...would you all like that? I mean, is it worth it to go to the big game..and then suck really bad right after? I don't think so. I'll take the 10-3 season, with a Cotton Bowl victory.

I think some people really need a reality check. It's almost impossible to win as many games as we do, in the conference we're in. Hell, SOMEONE has to win the game each week, and sometimes it's the opponent! We lost to Florida because of some mistakes. And, even through that...Fulmer has the best winning percentage in college football for an active coach..but, that's not good enough...let's fire his ass!

While i'm on the subject, a lot of these people calling for firing Fulmer, Sanders, etc.. really don't understand the game of football. You all want some new exciting game plan..well, Florida supposedly has that...where did that get them? A lucky win and 275 yards total offense??

Spurrier has that exciting offense and he's 1-2.
Boise State has it...they are getting blown out of the water.

The issue here is not the offense, it is execution. Our players are not stepping up to the plate, to their full potential and making the plays. That's the difference. The talent is there, the coaching is there...sometimes these guys look unstoppable..but they jsut can't connect. That TD drive by Ainge last week looked VERY impressive. We just didn't do it again, kept shooting ourselves in the foot. When you're backed up in bad field position, its hard to take the chance on the big play..because there is NO CONSOLATION if it doesn't work. If you have to punt, or its intercepted, you've just put the opponent in a very good position to score. Our last drive was looking good, until the ball was thrown by Ainge's feet 15yards back. That isn't coaching. That's a bad snap.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that I'd rather have 50,000 fans come to each game that TRULY love the team, than 100,000 people, with half being you fair-weather fans. :twocents:

 

[surrealvol]

If Norm Chow had our offense, we would be 2-0, ranked #2 in the country, and only a couple months away from playing his ex-team for the NC.

Knowing that RS is NOT a NC caliber OC does not make me a fair-weather fan. I was supporting the Vols before you were born!

 

[holdemvol]

Thank You!!!! Even Swain says it has been a lack of communication and . Everyone screams about not throwing downfield enough, but our wideouts got behind the FLA secondary at least 5-6 times and we did not get them the ball once. Yes our gameplans are simple, but if we execute them we win.

 

[holdemvol]

It does not matter who is OC or what plays we call if our players do not make good throws and catch the ball. GO BACK AND WATCH THE GAMES AGAIN! If we execute we win!

 

[YAZ]

We hear these same damned excuses every year.

"We have the talent, We have the coaching"

But we just can't execute? Year after year after year?

C'mon man. Lets put a bit more logic to this.

WE NEED CHANGES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

At this point I am not 100% sure what they are, but something has got to change.

Being that the coaches are the only constant in the equation EVERY year. Logic points in their direction.

I think many of you do not really understand the concept of a "fairweather" fan. Expressing your opinion(s) on factors that you feel need changed in order to BETTER the team is not being a fairweather fan. If it means you have to criticize some coaches and/or players in the process then oh well. If you have any character to begin with, criticism should be welcomed as a means of improving. Remember, it's always easier to see negatives when you are on the outside looking in.

There will always be critics, even if were to go undefeated. It's part of it. Don't come to a message board if you can't stand criticism. These boards thrive off criticism.

Everyone on here is a fan of college football. Maybe not the Vols, maybe not as much of a fan as you or I. But who cares? Let's just feed of each other and enjoy it. QUIT WHINING!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[allvol]

The only way Norm Chow would be at Tennessee was if he was the head coach. The only way anybody but RS was the OC would be if CPF was gone. If you really want CPF and his 80% winning pct to go, then I would consider that "fair weather".

 

[mikey]

Originally posted by jwells@Sep 20, 2005 12:15 PM
I'm really getting sick of a lot of so-called "UT Fans." Everytime something bad happens, all of a sudden it's time to fire everyone.

Going 10-3 isn't good enough for you all...hell anything less than a NC ring, you want someone's head. OU just came off a NC game, now they're 1-2, coming off a loss to unranked UCLA...would you all like that? I mean, is it worth it to go to the big game..and then suck really bad right after? I don't think so. I'll take the 10-3 season, with a Cotton Bowl victory.

I think some people really need a reality check. It's almost impossible to win as many games as we do, in the conference we're in. Hell, SOMEONE has to win the game each week, and sometimes it's the opponent! We lost to Florida because of some mistakes. And, even through that...Fulmer has the best winning percentage in college football for an active coach..but, that's not good enough...let's fire his ass!

While i'm on the subject, a lot of these people calling for firing Fulmer, Sanders, etc.. really don't understand the game of football. You all want some new exciting game plan..well, Florida supposedly has that...where did that get them? A lucky win and 275 yards total offense??

Spurrier has that exciting offense and he's 1-2.
Boise State has it...they are getting blown out of the water.

The issue here is not the offense, it is execution. Our players are not stepping up to the plate, to their full potential and making the plays. That's the difference. The talent is there, the coaching is there...sometimes these guys look unstoppable..but they jsut can't connect. That TD drive by Ainge last week looked VERY impressive. We just didn't do it again, kept shooting ourselves in the foot. When you're backed up in bad field position, its hard to take the chance on the big play..because there is NO CONSOLATION if it doesn't work. If you have to punt, or its intercepted, you've just put the opponent in a very good position to score. Our last drive was looking good, until the ball was thrown by Ainge's feet 15yards back. That isn't coaching. That's a bad snap.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that I'd rather have 50,000 fans come to each game that TRULY love the team, than 100,000 people, with half being you fair-weather fans.  :twocents:

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OMG!!!! ......... A-FRIGGIN-MEN!!!!!!!!!
:bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow:

 

[holdemvol]

I just don't understand how winning 80% of our games in arguably the toughest conference in the nation equates to needing a coaching change. No other program has that winning percentage sivce CPF has been HC. What IS acceptable, a 95% winning record? Most schools would kill to have such a "terrible" coaching staff. I will ask again...who do you want as coach? Nobody else has won as much as Fulmer...maybe you don't like HOW we win games, but if you need 40 point blowouts every week I suggest you stick to playstation.

 

[allvol]

Fulmer recruits so well partly because he has a reputation for having a stable coaching staff. A big part of his 80% winning percentage is due to recruiting. If Fulmer was to be fired, what coach would come in and be able to better the record that Fulmer has? They may be a better x's and o's coach, but where is the talent going to come from? We see now that even Spurrier can't win without talent.

I see Nebraska as the example of what happens when a winner is fired.

 

[mikey]

Originally posted by holdemvol@Sep 20, 2005 1:05 PM
I just don't understand how winning 80% of our games in arguably the toughest conference in the nation equates to needing a coaching change.  No other program has that winning percentage sivce CPF has been HC.  What IS acceptable, a 95% winning record?  Most schools would kill to have such a "terrible" coaching staff.  I will ask again...who do you want as coach?  Nobody else has won as much as Fulmer...maybe you don't like HOW we win games, but if you need 40 point blowouts every week I suggest you stick to playstation.

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and to you......another A-FRIGGIN-MEN
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[holdemvol]

Originally posted by YAZ@Sep 20, 2005 12:38 PM
Being that the coaches are the only constant in the equation EVERY year. Logic points in their direction.

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EXACTLY! The coaches are the only constant and they consistently win 9-10 games a year. If you want to talk about logic what in the hell kind of logic says that the best winning % in the country is not good enough? What is it that you want? I have stated many times that I am not always a fan of UT's playcalling but the bottom line is they get the job done at the end of the day. We lose one road game against a top ten rival that we would have won if our players execute and it's off with Phil's head. What the hell?

 

[mikey]

Originally posted by allvol@Sep 20, 2005 1:09 PM
Fulmer recruits so well partly because he has a reputation for having a stable coaching staff.  A big part of his 80% winning percentage is due to recruiting.  If Fulmer was to be fired, what coach would come in and be able to better the record that Fulmer has? They may be a better x's and o's coach, but where is the talent going to come from?  We see now that even Spurrier can't win without talent.

I see Nebraska as the example of what happens when a winner is fired.

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AND YET ANOTHER......A-FRIGGIN-MEN!!! What is this titled? "The intelligent people's thread"
Y'all have a good afternoon.

 

[holdemvol]

Originally posted by allvol@Sep 20, 2005 1:09 PM
Fulmer recruits so well partly because he has a reputation for having a stable coaching staff.  A big part of his 80% winning percentage is due to recruiting.  If Fulmer was to be fired, what coach would come in and be able to better the record that Fulmer has? They may be a better x's and o's coach, but where is the talent going to come from?  We see now that even Spurrier can't win without talent.

I see Nebraska as the example of what happens when a winner is fired.

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Amen! Tennessee is not exactly a hot bed of talent, and pulling top recruits away from FLA, FSU, UM, and USC to come to Tennessee is not something most coaches could do. Look at the rest of the top programs around the country....They all have talent right in thier back yards. UT and Oklahoma are the only two schools I can think of that don't have talent in state but still manage to bring in a top class year in and year out.

 

[OWB]

I'm really getting sick of a lot of so-called "UT Fans." Everytime something bad happens, all of a sudden it's time to fire everyone.

Ok, I get your point, you're a TRUE fan. Congrats!

Going 10-3 isn't good enough for you all...hell anything less than a NC ring, you want someone's head.

10 - 3 is great, but if that's what we are shooting for why even worry about an SECCG or the National Championship? My bad, I thought that was what EVERYONE was playing for.

And, even through that...Fulmer has the best winning percentage in college football for an active coach..but, that's not good enough...let's fire his ass!

I agree with you here. His winning record in the SEC is amazing. A few more wins in the big games and he would have more championships too. I haven't really seen anyone on this board say that Fulmer needs to go. Just his little buddy Gilligan.

While i'm on the subject, a lot of these people calling for firing Fulmer, Sanders, etc.. really don't understand the game of football. You all want some new exciting game plan..well, Florida supposedly has that...where did that get them? A lucky win and 275 yards total offense??

So we don't understand the game of Football because we question things and refuse to become complacent like you are? I don't want a new and exciting gameplan, I want our "talented players" to go out there and play good football and win some big games and play like they have been coached. I think it's funny that you are accusing some of not understanding football and then you turn around and call UF's win lucky!!

Spurrier has that exciting offense and he's 1-2.

Spurrier would LOVE to get his hands on Ainge.

The issue here is not the offense, it is execution.

That might be the case, but that is ALWAYS the case. At some point you have to put 2 and 2 together and realize that maybe there is an alternative reason as to why the players aren't executing the way they should be. It is a fixable problem you know?

I guess what I'm getting at here is that I'd rather have 50,000 fans come to each game that TRULY love the team, than 100,000 people, with half being you fair-weather fans.

Well jwells, we all want the same outcome for our team. Some of us are bothered by a loss more than others. You would think that the ones who are really bothered by it are the the ones that care the MOST wouldn't you?

The thing that we can all agree on is that losing to UF sucks big time and we probably shouldn't have lost that game. We all want our team to prosper. The ones that disappear after a loss are the fairweather fans, last I checked, we're all still here. So I'll go about getting over it my way and you follow your way and hopefully we can meet in middle and celebrate a win over LSU.

 

[YAZ]

I do not disagree with anything said below my last post. All EXTREMELY valid points.

To clarify my personal position a bit. I do not feel the 'entire' coaching staff needs to be changed. Offensive coaching DOES need a change. That may or may not mean replacement of a coach. I really am not sure about that myself. We do have excellent winning percentages practically EVERY year and I think that we all are a bit spoiled by that. My biggest gripe is the way we continuously play up or down to the level of our competition. We do this EVERY season. No I don't have to have a 40 point victory to be satisfied. A win is a win. The problem is that this consistency to play equal to our level of competition results in unecessary and very costly losses as it did last Saturday. We all see the potential thats out there on the field but it is NEVER consistent. This trend has continued through many classes of students now with, again, the coaches remaining the only constant. I can't give you the answer or really even a very educated guess as to what the exact change is but it has become obvious that there is a problem.
Maybe they just need somebody to light more of a fire under their asses and keep it burning. If we have the talent, and I think we do, then yes, I would love to see them blow teams out. But its not a requirement. Just a waste of talent that we obviously have.

 

[YAZ]

Well said OrangeWhiteBlood!

 

[GAVol]

I don't think it's up to anybody to decide who is a real fan and who is not, but I understand the frustration. It is comical to watch and listen to some people after a loss. There are definitely valid criticisms to be made, but in my mind calling for people's jobs is oversimplifying things.

 

[volinbham]

I'm sick of being told I'm a fair weather fan if I level criticism at the coaching staff and speculate about the impact of changes at some coaching positions

Seriously, if you contend that calling for coaching changes is too simplistic then you must acknowledge that saying the coaching is fine and its just an execution problem is also too simplistic.

Doesn't execution come from coaching? RS's offensive coaching role models are Fulmer and Cutcliffe. How far back does that go? Late 80's? Is it unreasonable to think that maybe some fresh ideas would be needed after 15 or so years?

 

[OrangeAndBlue]

Just because you lose a game and you're mad about it, and criticize the coaching staff, doesn't make you a fairweather fan. All fans do that, it means they actually care about their team and it's performance. While some of it may be irrational, thats to be expected because emotions are involved. Being a fairweather fan, means you only support your team when it wins.

 

[GAVol]

Originally posted by volinbham@Sep 20, 2005 3:04 PM
Seriously, if you contend that calling for coaching changes is too simplistic then you must acknowledge that saying the coaching is fine and its just an execution problem is also too simplistic.

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You're exactly right . . . and I sure don't mean to say that anybody is stupid for calling for a coaching change.

I'm not talking about people making logical arguments about overall performances, I'm talking more about the people who call for an assistant's job every time ANYTHING negative happens. I'm talking about the people who sit in the stadium and start screaming about firing a secondary coach every time a pass is completed.

 

[allvol]

10 - 3 is great, but if that's what we are shooting for why even worry about an SECCG or the National Championship? My bad, I thought that was what EVERYONE was playing for.

10-3 is great. Not every team shoots for a National Championship.... Vanderbilt just wants to go to a bowl. But the Vols under Fulmer have a pretty good track record of having the National Championship as a major Goal. If the NC is a team's goal every season, but they don't reach it every season.... is that really so bad? I don't know any team that has won 4 or 5 NCs in a row? All I ask for as a fan is a real chance to win the NC every season. And most seasons the Vols have a chance. But in the current BCS system, it sometimes only takes 1 bad game to end a team's run at a NC.

1995 The Vols rose to #4 prior to the Kentucky game. Nebraska and Florida finish the regular season undefeated. Vols defeat Ohio State and finish #2.

1996 The 6-1 Vols rose to #6 in the polls, but lost on Nov 9 to Memphis. The loss was crucial because Florida got another shot at Florida State in NC game even though Florida State had just beaten them. A 10-1 Vols would have played undefeated Florida State.

1997 The Vols play Nebraska in Bowl Alliance Championship Game. Had Washington State beaten Michigan the night before, the Vols would have been playing for more than just pride.

1998 Vols win the first BCS undisputed national championship.

1999 Vols lost at Florida earlier in the season. With a chance to move up to #2 in the BCS standings mid-November, the #3 Vols gave up 2 critical late TDs on the road against Arkansas and lost 24-28, ending any BCS Championship run. Vols do end up playing in a BCS bowl.

2001 #5 Vols go to Gainesville and beat #2 Florida to gain the #2 spot in the BCS standings and a spot in the SECCG. With a shot at playing for the National Championship, the Vols turn the ball over twice in the 4th quarter of the SECCG and lose to LSU 20-31.

2003 Back to back losses to Auburn and Georgia in October end the Vols run at a National Championship. The Vols do rise to #6 in the polls at the end of the regular season.

2004 Vols move up to #8 in the BCS and lost to unranked Notre Dame on Nov 6th.

The Vols have been ranked in every BCS ranking since its inception:
1998 #1
1999 #5
2000 #21
2001 #6
2002 #25
2003 #8
2004 #15

 

[jwells]

I guess maybe I should clarify the reasons for writing my post..

I was reading through, and I kept hearding "fire him" "Change this" "we're going to lose again to LSU"

And at the game saturday I kept hearing the same stuff, plus "8-5 Peach Bowl, here we come" OVER AND OVER. I can't handle that kind of stuff..I find it insane that a close loss to a top 5 team equates to an 8-5 season...I just can't figure it out.

There were positives in the loss saturday..but noone can see them, because they all of a sudden got a reality check that talking up a team can't win a championship..I think even the players got the same thing.

From the beginning, everyone has looked to Florida, Lsu. NOT Beat Florida. THEN beat LSU. It's almost like they've become one big game, and because we lost the 1st part, we're destined to be blown out at Tiger Stadium.

 

[donsargegolf]

Originally posted by volinbham@Sep 20, 2005 2:04 PM
I'm sick of being told I'm a fair weather fan if I level criticism at the coaching staff and speculate about the impact of changes at some coaching positions 

Seriously, if you contend that calling for coaching changes is too simplistic then you must acknowledge that saying the coaching is fine and its just an execution problem is also too simplistic.

Doesn't execution come from coaching?  RS's offensive coaching role models are Fulmer and Cutcliffe.  How far back does that go?  Late 80's?  Is it unreasonable to think that maybe some fresh ideas would be needed after 15 or so years?

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Everything you said is PERFECTLY correct. You left out one small matter that seems to always be thrown up at me. Sanders played for Majors. The football lineage then is Morristown, Majors, Fulmer, Cutcliffe, himself. I'd hire him wouldn't you? :yahoo:

 

[holdemvol]

I agree that falls ultimately on the shoulders of the coaching staff, and of course I would like to see our talent better utilized. I just don't think you can justify coaching changes with our win record. It would be great if we scored 70 ppg but I would bet that if you go on any fan board of any team you will here about how some coach sucks. I think maybe UT fans are spoiled because of the success we have had and need to come to the realization that this coaching staff has done a better job than any other since Fulmer took over. No coaching staff is perfect, there will always be strengths and weaknesses. My problem much like jwells is that anytime ANYTHING does not go our way there are an amazing number of posters calling for Randy Sanders' head. Yesterday for instance I read on this board that the special teams errors saturday were RS fault because "his offense broke down...special teams should not have had to kick" Now how ridiculous is that? Special teams should never have to play? If you go back and watch the games most of the games we lost have been because of lack of execution and stupid mistakes. I do realize that this is in the end the responsibility of the coaching staff, but that ends with Fulmer, not Sanders. Anyone who wants Fulmer gone needs thier head examined, and while there are not as many Fulmer bashers on here as Sanders bashers there are more than enough. Someone made a good example out of Nebraska on another thread...they let a winning coach go and look where they are now....a joke. I am just tired of win or lose hearing about how our coaching sucks. There are some on this very board who even if we hang up 60 on LSU will still find a reason to start a "fire Sanders" thread. I guess it just gets old.

 

[holdemvol]

Sorry for the double post!