Roster Breakdown CJP and Butch

[BlinghamptonVol]

So, hearing the back and forth of CJP’s players vs Butch’s players, needing time vs ‘GA State!’, and lack of talent vs. ‘GA State!’, I looked at this article:
Roster Analysis: Makeup of Vols' Team After More Transfers | RTI

An interesting thing to consider is that of the 77 current scholarship players, only 16 of them (20% of the roster) have definitely spent more time under Butch than they have under CJP. True juniors and younger and transfers all have more time with CJP. Redshirt juniors and true seniors are approaching equal time between the two coaches. At the end of this season, redshirt seniors will finish their careers this year as the only players with more time under Butch than CJP.

As far as players signed by Pruitt vs Butch, CJP signed 45 and Butch signed 32. Pruitt signed 58% of the roster, Jones 42%. Pruitt signed 20 out of the 34 (59%) 4 and 5 star players. 3 star and below are about 50/50 between the two coaches.

4 and 5 stars constitute 44% of the roster. According to this article: Blue-Chip Ratio 2019 , only 20 teams have a blue chip ratio of 38% or higher.

I’m sure each side of the argument will use these numbers to support their stance, just wanted to get some numbers out there so we can all have the same starting point. What do you think when you see these numbers?

 

[EZE]

There is enough talent on this team to be 3-1 at this point and at least 6-6 for the season. All of the OOC games should have been victories, and at least 5 of the 8 SEC opponents are mediocre at best.

Instead, this season is a raging dumpster fire.

Coaching is a failure to this point.

 

[Chicago Vols 14]

So, hearing the back and forth of CJP’s players vs Butch’s players, needing time vs ‘GA State!’, and lack of talent vs. ‘GA State!’, I looked at this article:
Roster Analysis: Makeup of Vols' Team After More Transfers | RTI

What do you think when you see these numbers?

Time to fire Coach Pruitt and move on.

 

[peerless98]

So, hearing the back and forth of CJP’s players vs Butch’s players, needing time vs ‘GA State!’, and lack of talent vs. ‘GA State!’, I looked at this article:

Stopped reading after this because nobody claimed this, period. It's just another false statement to fit the SAC's narrative.

 

[landscapingvol]

So, hearing the back and forth of CJP’s players vs Butch’s players, needing time vs ‘GA State!’, and lack of talent vs. ‘GA State!’, I looked at this article:
Roster Analysis: Makeup of Vols' Team After More Transfers | RTI

An interesting thing to consider is that of the 77 current scholarship players, only 16 of them (20% of the roster) have definitely spent more time under Butch than they have under CJP. True juniors and younger and transfers all have more time with CJP. Redshirt juniors and true seniors are approaching equal time between the two coaches. At the end of this season, redshirt seniors will finish their careers this year as the only players with more time under Butch than CJP.

As far as players signed by Pruitt vs Butch, CJP signed 45 and Butch signed 32. Pruitt signed 58% of the roster, Jones 42%. Pruitt signed 20 out of the 34 (59%) 4 and 5 star players. 3 star and below are about 50/50 between the two coaches.

4 and 5 stars constitute 44% of the roster. According to this article: Blue-Chip Ratio 2019 , only 20 teams have a blue chip ratio of 38% or higher.

I’m sure each side of the argument will use these numbers to support their stance, just wanted to get some numbers out there so we can all have the same starting point. What do you think when you see these numbers?

We either have a disproportionate number of complete busts compared to every other team in the country, Pruitt is doing a poor job of preparing them, or both. There is certainly enough talent on the roster to beat Ga State, BYU, and not get embarrassed by UF.

 

[volfannbama]

They are all pruitts players

 

[jackieaprilesr]

So, hearing the back and forth of CJP’s players vs Butch’s players, needing time vs ‘GA State!’, and lack of talent vs. ‘GA State!’, I looked at this article:
Roster Analysis: Makeup of Vols' Team After More Transfers | RTI

An interesting thing to consider is that of the 77 current scholarship players, only 16 of them (20% of the roster) have definitely spent more time under Butch than they have under CJP. True juniors and younger and transfers all have more time with CJP. Redshirt juniors and true seniors are approaching equal time between the two coaches. At the end of this season, redshirt seniors will finish their careers this year as the only players with more time under Butch than CJP.

As far as players signed by Pruitt vs Butch, CJP signed 45 and Butch signed 32. Pruitt signed 58% of the roster, Jones 42%. Pruitt signed 20 out of the 34 (59%) 4 and 5 star players. 3 star and below are about 50/50 between the two coaches.

4 and 5 stars constitute 44% of the roster. According to this article: Blue-Chip Ratio 2019 , only 20 teams have a blue chip ratio of 38% or higher.

I’m sure each side of the argument will use these numbers to support their stance, just wanted to get some numbers out there so we can all have the same starting point. What do you think when you see these numbers?

Pruitt is underachieving. anyone who thinks differently is a true Vols fans and we thank you for your blind loyalty

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

There is enough talent on this team to be 3-1 at this point and at least 6-6 for the season. All of the OOC games should have been victories, and at least 5 of the 8 SEC opponents are mediocre at best.

Instead, this season is a raging dumpster fire.

Coaching is a failure to this point.

Player execution is a massive failure to this point. But dont let facts and logic get in the way of your blame everything on coaching crap.

 

[rjd970]

So, hearing the back and forth of CJP’s players vs Butch’s players, needing time vs ‘GA State!’, and lack of talent vs. ‘GA State!’, I looked at this article:
Roster Analysis: Makeup of Vols' Team After More Transfers | RTI

An interesting thing to consider is that of the 77 current scholarship players, only 16 of them (20% of the roster) have definitely spent more time under Butch than they have under CJP. True juniors and younger and transfers all have more time with CJP. Redshirt juniors and true seniors are approaching equal time between the two coaches. At the end of this season, redshirt seniors will finish their careers this year as the only players with more time under Butch than CJP.

As far as players signed by Pruitt vs Butch, CJP signed 45 and Butch signed 32. Pruitt signed 58% of the roster, Jones 42%. Pruitt signed 20 out of the 34 (59%) 4 and 5 star players. 3 star and below are about 50/50 between the two coaches.

4 and 5 stars constitute 44% of the roster. According to this article: Blue-Chip Ratio 2019 , only 20 teams have a blue chip ratio of 38% or higher.

I’m sure each side of the argument will use these numbers to support their stance, just wanted to get some numbers out there so we can all have the same starting point. What do you think when you see these numbers?

I’m not really counting the full 2018 class as CJP. He really has one full class he recruited and brought in. That is not a popular view but it’s the way I see it.

 

[Dudleys87]

They are all pruitts players

Lol

 

[DonDiego]

So, hearing the back and forth of CJP’s players vs Butch’s players, needing time vs ‘GA State!’, and lack of talent vs. ‘GA State!’, I looked at this article:
Roster Analysis: Makeup of Vols' Team After More Transfers | RTI

An interesting thing to consider is that of the 77 current scholarship players, only 16 of them (20% of the roster) have definitely spent more time under Butch than they have under CJP. True juniors and younger and transfers all have more time with CJP. Redshirt juniors and true seniors are approaching equal time between the two coaches. At the end of this season, redshirt seniors will finish their careers this year as the only players with more time under Butch than CJP.

As far as players signed by Pruitt vs Butch, CJP signed 45 and Butch signed 32. Pruitt signed 58% of the roster, Jones 42%. Pruitt signed 20 out of the 34 (59%) 4 and 5 star players. 3 star and below are about 50/50 between the two coaches.

4 and 5 stars constitute 44% of the roster. According to this article: Blue-Chip Ratio 2019 , only 20 teams have a blue chip ratio of 38% or higher.

I’m sure each side of the argument will use these numbers to support their stance, just wanted to get some numbers out there so we can all have the same starting point. What do you think when you see these numbers?

I just don't see the relevance of how much time players have spent under each coach. It doesn't speak to the facts of would CJP have even recruited those players, how are those players responding to the new staff, etc.

 

[Bigun]

Player execution is a massive failure to this point. But dont let facts and logic get in the way of your blame everything on coaching crap.

So if the coaches arent to blame then who is? The players that were brought in by the coaches?

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

So if the coaches arent to blame then who is? The players that were brought in by the coaches?

Yes. A coach can only do so much. Look at the Clemson/UNC game. The disparity in talent is gargantuan. But what happened? TL was off on many throws. The normal extremely stout Clemson defense gave up huge plays they usually dont. The OL didnt play well. Is that on the coaches? No it isnt.

Dsbo is clearly one of the best in the business as is DC Venables. So you think they just all of a sudden forgot how to prepare and call a game? Not a chance. Simply put, the players didnt execute Dabos gameplan as they normally do. If they had, Clemson blows UNC out.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

I just don't see the relevance of how much time players have spent under each coach. It doesn't speak to the facts of would CJP have even recruited those players, how are those players responding to the new staff, etc.

Thats pretty interesting actually. I wonder, out of the 2016 and 2017 classes, had Pruitt been the HC, how many of those guys would he have recruited? I never really thought of that.

 

[GetYouSomeofThat]

Player execution is a massive failure to this point. But dont let facts and logic get in the way of your blame everything on coaching crap.

Who id tesponsible for teaching and demanding.executuon? Who is responsible for practice time to ensure execution in game time
..

 

[Volfan2012]

Unless something great happens in the next couple months this years Pruitt class is not looking that great. He needed to be top ten every year. I just don't buy it is all recruiting maybe to compete in the SEC were a little weak but no way Georgia State and BYU have out recruited us. The fact that we couldn't win those two games at home still tells me there are plenty of other problems at Tennessee than just the players.

 

[VolForLife83]

So if the coaches arent to blame then who is? The players that were brought in by the coaches?

It's a little bit of everything, but the main thing holding us back is qb play. The defense hasn't been great, but good enough to win with an offense that can score. The issue is poor execution on defense, followed by youth.

Let's say I take you hunting, put you up in a tree stand, tell you what time that deer will step out and from where. Not only that, but I make sure you know how to shoot and show you exactly where to aim for a proper kill. All you have to do is shoot the deer when it shows up. Eventually the deer comes out, comes in to you on a string and you miss your shot. Is that your fault or my fault?

 

[Vol524]

It's a little bit of everything, but the main thing holding us back is qb play. The defense hasn't been great, but good enough to win with an offense that can score. The issue is poor execution on defense, followed by youth.

Let's say I take you hunting, put you up in a tree stand, tell you what time that deer will step out and from where. Not only that, but I make sure you know how to shoot and show you exactly where to aim for a proper kill. All you have to do is shoot the deer when it shows up. Eventually the deer comes out, comes in to you on a string and you miss your shot. Is that your fault or my fault?

BINGO we have a winner! Great example of what is going on. Only thing you left out is he fell out of the tree stand after the missed shot.

 

[BlinghamptonVol]

Stopped reading after this because nobody claimed this, period. It's just another false statement to fit the SAC's narrative.

I’m not sure what you’re saying nobody claimed. People are arguing over Pruitt’s players or Butch’s players. I’ve seen multiple times when someone says there isn’t enough talent, the response is that we have more talent than Ga State. I’ve also seen multiple times when someone says Pruitt needs more time, the response is he had plenty of time to prepare for and beat Ga State. Not trying to be a smartass, really asking you what you’re referring to.

 

[peerless98]

I’m not sure what you’re saying nobody claimed. People are arguing over Pruitt’s players or Butch’s players. I’ve seen multiple times when someone says there isn’t enough talent, the response is that we have more talent than Ga State. I’ve also seen multiple times when someone says Pruitt needs more time, the response is he had plenty of time to prepare for and beat Ga State. Not trying to be a smartass, really asking you what you’re referring to.

needing time vs ‘GA State!’, and lack of talent vs. ‘GA State!’

The bolded part is from your original post. This has never been claimed!

 

[BlinghamptonVol]

I’m not really counting the full 2018 class as CJP. He really has one full class he recruited and brought in. That is not a popular view but it’s the way I see it.

I can understand that he might not have necessarily recruited all the players that signed had he had more time. Thinking more that they all signed knowing he was the coach, so they shouldn’t have any of Butch’s coaching or culture to affect their performance.

 

[BlinghamptonVol]

needing time vs ‘GA State!’, and lack of talent vs. ‘GA State!’

The bolded part is from your original post. This has never been claimed!

I’m not meaning that anyone claimed we didn’t have enough talent or time to beat Ga State, just in the overall discussion that Pruitt needs better talent on this team before deciding if he’s a good coach, responses center around having plenty of talent to beat Ga State. Most instances of that response I’ve seen recently on the board are simply ‘GA State’ with no further explanation. Generally the same idea with Pruitt needing more than 16 games before people decide if he’s good or not.

 

[EZE]

Player execution is a massive failure to this point. But dont let facts and logic get in the way of your blame everything on coaching crap.

Who teaches the players?

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

Who teaches the players?

Coaches. But tell me something. This staff is full of guys with SEC and some NFL experience. Many have reputations as really good coaches. So do you believe that all of these coaches just somehow forgot how to develop? Does that make sense?

Also, who executes? Let’s say you are a coach. You practice and teach to your best. Yet for some reason your players do not execute as well as you want or expect. Is that your fault? No. Take a physician. Goes to medical school and residency and performs well. Yet when that doctor starts to practice, he/she ends up being terrible. Is that the fault of those that taught? Absolutely not.

 

[EZE]

Coaches. But tell me something. This staff is full of guys with SEC and some NFL experience. Many have reputations as really good coaches. So do you believe that all of these coaches just somehow forgot how to develop? Does that make sense?

Also, who executes? Let’s say you are a coach. You practice and teach to your best. Yet for some reason your players do not execute as well as you want or expect. Is that your fault? No. Take a physician. Goes to medical school and residency and performs well. Yet when that doctor starts to practice, he/she ends up being terrible. Is that the fault of those that taught? Absolutely not.

Here is the thing. If it was a breakdown here and there, I would see that. But, in our case, we have breakdowns in nearly every position group on both sides of the ball. Including the inability to substitute and line up properly.

We have a lot of 4-5 star players on this team. You cannot convince me that they all forgot how to play once they got to Knoxville.