Recruiting forum off topic thread (no politics, covid, or hot button issues)

scienceteaching_vol

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My worldview and personal philosophy has evolved over the last few years... i'd say.

So, for fun, how has Darwinian evolution been substantiated? And, what do you think about isms such as determinism, moral relativism, materialism...? ism, ism, ism... all we are saying is give peace a chance... but, whatevs, i'm willing to entertain any hypothesis.

nb4 moved to off topic or deleted outright.
It's interesting that no one bats an eye at the idea that humans can shape a Chihuahua from a wolf by selecting desirable traits over a few thousand years but when you suggest environments over millions of years can do the same its crazy town.
 

Unimane

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My worldview and personal philosophy has evolved over the last few years... i'd say.

So, for fun, how has Darwinian evolution been substantiated? And, what do you think about isms such as determinism, moral relativism, materialism...? ism, ism, ism... all we are saying is give peace a chance... but, whatevs, i'm willing to entertain any hypothesis.

nb4 moved to off topic or deleted outright.
Yeah, we are walking towards a deletion, but evolution is one of the most tested scientific theories in science and it has held up for 150 years across many different scientific disciplines. The only reason it is questioned is some people have difficulty rationalizing it with their religious beliefs (But, many can). Scientifically, there isn't really such a consternation over evolution.

I'll stop here on this to avoid the hammer coming down on these posts...
 

Big Sun

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It's interesting that no one bats an eye at the idea that humans can shape a Chihuahua from a wolf by selecting desirable traits over a few thousand years but when you suggest environments over millions of years can do the same its crazy town.
So humans have been shaped by higher beings over millions of years? That is definitely a theory. Been, what, 7 seedings now?

FWIW, i have a Master of Science degree... i've been indoctrinated. Now let's see some evidence.. that's all i'm saying. No emotions, just data.
 

ABINGDON VOL FAN

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My position is that evolution is a complete fairy tale. And no I’m not going to engage in a conversation about it in a thread for Deandre Butler.

I’ve had multiple religious discussions on VN in the past. Not interested in another one today.
I’m on your side Bass.

Macro evolution-no evidence. Micro evolution - Yes.
 

Jackcrevol

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What is WETS? Love Hartford... one of my all-time favorites. I grew up hanging out at Museum of Appalachia, so i had a chance to see him, Monroe, Mark O'Conner among others.
Mark Oconnor is a genius.

Most people would never realize his steps are clogging steps. awesome you got to see him.

public radio station, studio one.
 
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Ulysees E. McGill

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My ex-wife honestly believes Dinosaurs never existed. Moran........:rolleyes:
I don't understand everything and I don't think anyone truly does...but I have seen their bones being dug out of the ground in places out west. I don't have to understand everything to have faith...that's why it is called faith. I am not, and man as a whole is not owed an explanation by God...Job 38 is enough for me.
 
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Rishvol

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It's interesting that no one bats an eye at the idea that humans can shape a Chihuahua from a wolf by selecting desirable traits over a few thousand years but when you suggest environments over millions of years can do the same its crazy town.
Like @Big Sun said what you just described was intelligent design not evolution
 

scienceteaching_vol

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Like @Big Sun said what you just described was intelligent design not evolution
No it absolutely wasn't. Think the point was missed. I was showing that outside pressures can shape changes in a population. In the dog's case that's absolutely intelligent design. Human design.

I said environments over millions of years could similarly shape changes in a population. That's not intelligent design.
 
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scienceteaching_vol

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So humans have been shaped by higher beings over millions of years? That is definitely a theory. Been, what, 7 seedings now?

FWIW, i have a Master of Science degree... i've been indoctrinated. Now let's see some evidence.. that's all i'm saying. No emotions, just data.
Ha. No. I said environments could do something similar naturally. I was not suggesting people had been cultivated in a similar fashion as wolves.
 
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Rishvol

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No it absolutely wasn't. Think the point was missed. I was showing that outside pressures can shape changes in a population. In the dog's case that's absolutely intelligent design. Human design.

I said environments over millions of years could similarly shape changes in a population. That's not intelligent design.
Outside stimuli shaping how something will become? Sounds like design to me. I understand where your coming from I've had multiple evolution classes myself. But this is always an argument that is used as a "gotcha" moment but it gives more evidence towards intelligent design. Another experiment that trust to show change due to environment is the mouse tail experiment. Scientist cut the tails of mice and over generations the tail will shrink until it reaches the common length of cut tail. The problem with this experiment is that it also shows that generations after the stimulus is removed the tail length will return to normal. By normal I mean the length before the experiment.

Now you will come back with "well the stimulus wasn't continuous" and you would be correct. Imo the environment that is needed to create this evolutionary change will not be in existence long enough to create the vast amount of species diversity that evolutionists claim the evolutionary process is capable of.
 

scienceteaching_vol

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Outside stimuli shaping how something will become? Sounds like design to me. I understand where your coming from I've had multiple evolution classes myself. But this is always an argument that is used as a "gotcha" moment but it gives more evidence towards intelligent design. Another experiment that trust to show change due to environment is the mouse tail experiment. Scientist cut the tails of mice and over generations the tail will shrink until it reaches the common length of cut tail. The problem with this experiment is that it also shows that generations after the stimulus is removed the tail length will return to normal. By normal I mean the length before the experiment.

Now you will come back with "well the stimulus wasn't continuous" and you would be correct. Imo the environment that is needed to create this evolutionary change will not be in existence long enough to create the vast amount of species diversity that evolutionists claim the evolutionary process is capable of.
I'm actually not familiar with that experiment. I'll have to look it up.

So is it your opinion the earth isn't very old or that the environment has been changing too quickly to shape life in an evolutionary way?
 

Rishvol

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I'm actually not familiar with that experiment. I'll have to look it up.

So is it your opinion the earth isn't very old or that the environment has been changing too quickly to shape life in an evolutionary way?
Does both make sense? I don't think the Earth is millions of years old but if it was I think that environments change too rapidly to allow permanent change
 
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Rishvol

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I'm actually not familiar with that experiment. I'll have to look it up.

So is it your opinion the earth isn't very old or that the environment has been changing too quickly to shape life in an evolutionary way?
My evolution professor liked using that experiment to show genetic change from generation to generation to adapt to an environment
 

scienceteaching_vol

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Yep, i saw you said environments. So, environmental determinism then? Okay, where's the evidence... i have no horse in this race.
You could point to the fossil record. Even if you don't believe in macro evolution the evidence is there that organisms once roamed the earth that are no longer with us. They didn't survive. Something in the environment they weren't able to get past. I guess you could claim a higher power wiped them out but I imagine finding the evidence for that would be pretty tough.
 

SSVol

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All you need to do is watch the miracle of childbirth, followed by the mother nursing her child, and consider how many different things that had to go perfectly right or procreation fails…it’s a stunningly large number…and it takes 10x the faith to believe in evolution over design. As an engineer who creates products, I know how hard it is to create complex systems that work correctly in the most controlled environments, much less self reproduce and adapt to their environment, and I simply do not have the faith to believe it made itself randomly.
 

SSVol

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You could point to the fossil record. Even if you don't believe in macro evolution the evidence is there that organisms once roamed the earth that are no longer with us. They didn't survive. Something in the environment they weren't able to get past. I guess you could claim a higher power wiped them out but I imagine finding the evidence for that would be pretty tough.
Something like a global flood might kill large numbers of animals while rapidly laying down sedimentary layers. If only there were some evidence of that.
 
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Does both make sense? I don't think the Earth is millions of years old but if it was I think that environments change too rapidly to allow permanent change
I hear you. I'm not here to change anyone's minds. I just enjoy cordial conversations with intelligent people.

Why do you think Australia has such weird odd ball organisms if not because they were isolated over time?
 
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