Player development

#27
#27
cwbytruckers said:
You cant blame the coach for a guy not making his shot
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You can if an inordinate amount of time is spent working on defense.

Lots of coaching aspects can affect a players performance. We’re seeing a theme here. I’m looking for a common denominator.
 
#28
#28
I don't get to watch the games live unless the wife isn't home, but watch the replays on SEC Network when I can. Saturday's game looked like a lot of good defense from both teams, but some passed up shots from the good guys. Phillips has a decent three point shot, but lately hasn't taken it when he had the opportunity. Don't know what is up with Key, saw Barnes talking to him Saturday when he came out of the game. I suspect it may have been for not taking shots that were there. How about a ball fake by the bigs down low to get the defender off their feet and open the basket for a lay up, plus possibly a foul shot? I'm not a basketball guru at all, but just some of the things I observed. And I think Vescovi's shoulder is still not 100%.
 
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#30
#30
VolGee4 said:
Admiral went up in points, assists, fg%, and 3 point % his senior year. So, he didn’t regress. I didn’t realize that he shot 42% from 3 in his senior year.

Kyle went up in points and rebounds his senior year and shot the 3 pretty well.

Not sure which of the 6 years you want to call Fulkerson’s junior year. His best year was year 4, but then got Covid the next year, and we added talent. He had to be a go-to player on that team in year 4.

Vescovi is only down 1.4 points but up in steals. His shooting is obviously down, and it’s probably part getting defended well and part injury.

I don’t think the numbers bear out your hypothesis.
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Agree, Santi also had the benefit of playing with Chandler last year, who certainly managed to create good looks for others. Josiah's numbers are essentially the same, even despite coming back from an injury.
 
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#31
#31
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#32
#32
WaywardVol said:
Still a top 20 team.
I don’t care if he’d done it against sisters of the poor. The point is he has been a dead eye shooter all his life. This is a guy that had already eclipsed 1,000 points in his college career, led his league in scoring, and in high school set the season record for scoring in Tennessee. Upon arrival he appeared to be an unconscious shooter. A few months with Barnes and he’s infected with same horrible offensive sickness. I don’t think that’s a coincidence. The longer he’s been here the worse he’s become. It’s not like Barnes was inheriting a guy who had to rebuild his shot. He’s a plug and play guy.
Early in Barnes UT career we saw the opposite. Something has changed offensively and it’s not a good trend.
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Tennessee has won 25 games in a season on 6 different occasions in the program’s entire history and Barnes has half of those. And he’s well on his way to having 4 out of the 7 such seasons. People need to get real and stop crying.
 
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#33
#33
WaywardVol said:
Vescovi looks slower. Again, this was a guy that was an unconscious shooter when he got here and could score like crazy. It’s like he’s got a rucksack on him.
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I think he is exhausted. He works hard to get open and plays tough defense. Barnes needs to figure out how to give min to others or this team won’t have fresh legs in March.
 
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#34
#34
rdk4121 said:
Agree, Santi also had the benefit of playing with Chandler last year, who certainly managed to create good looks for others. Josiah's numbers are essentially the same, even despite coming back from an injury.
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Great point on playing with Chandler👍
 
#35
#35
Barnes is doing a great job developing players. And as for Key, he is facing much tougher competition than he faced in the Missouri Valley Conference and out at Clay Co. HS. He is going to be okay. When our posts become more consistently efficient around the basket, Key will get some better looks.
 
#36
#36
Putbacks said:
Barnes is doing a great job developing players. And as for Key, he is facing much tougher competition than he faced in the Missouri Valley Conference and out at Clay Co. HS. He is going to be okay. When our posts become more consistently efficient around the basket, Key will get some better looks.
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Sure, but we’re not asking him to lead the team and conference in scoring either, which he did btw.
 
#38
#38
WaywardVol said:
How so? My point was that he was getting worse and the stats show that to be true.
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They certainly don't support your idea "this was a guy that was an unconscious shooter when he got here and could score like crazy."

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#39
#39
VolGee4 said:
Admiral went up in points, assists, fg%, and 3 point % his senior year. So, he didn’t regress. I didn’t realize that he shot 42% from 3 in his senior year.

Kyle went up in points and rebounds his senior year and shot the 3 pretty well.

Not sure which of the 6 years you want to call Fulkerson’s junior year. His best year was year 4, but then got Covid the next year, and we added talent. He had to be a go-to player on that team in year 4.

Vescovi is only down 1.4 points but up in steals. His shooting is obviously down, and it’s probably part getting defended well and part injury.

I don’t think the numbers bear out your hypothesis.
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Clearly he meant Fulkerson's 2nd junior year (6th). We all know he left early.
 
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#40
#40
WaywardVol said:
Key is a great example. He scored like 27 in that Gonzaga game. I had a friend that knows the game tell me how happy we’d be with Key because of his offense. He’s been beaten into a shell of himself under Barnes. There’s some players that do well under Barnes, but it’s pretty clear that Key has gotten worse the more times he’s been under Barnes coaching. His confidence is shot.
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All it takes are a couple of makes and he is off and running. Hopefully it happens and happens soon.
 
#42
#42
Vols till I fall said:
Is it me or does it seem like some Tennessee basketball players hit their peak their Junior years and then once they become seniors, they kind of drop off?

I thought Admiral, Kyle Alexander, Santi, JJJ and Nkahmoua were all better during their 3rd year?
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meh. Hard to call 5 dudes a trend.... especially with so many variables in play.

Are you really surprised Santi was better when he was on the floor with Chandler?

Or that JJJ isn't quite up to par after a knee injury?

Considering Nkahmoua was injured for a big part of last year, I'm not sure it's even accurate to say he regressed.

So.... yes, it most likely is just you.
 
#43
#43
I think Barnes is outstanding at developing guards/wings but I see nothing special in his ability to develop post players.
 
#44
#44
Vols till I fall said:
Is it me or does it seem like some Tennessee basketball players hit their peak their Junior years and then once they become seniors, they kind of drop off?

I thought Admiral, Kyle Alexander, Santi, JJJ and Nkahmoua were all better during their 3rd year?
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How?

Admiral as a JR: 13.9 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 1.5 apg, 1.0 spg
Admiral as a SR: 16.5 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 2.0 apg, 0.9 spg

Kyle as a JR: 5.6 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 1.7 bpg
Kyle as a SR: 7.4 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 1.7 bpg


JJJ has only played in 15 games this season and battled injuries early in the year, but even then he's still pretty close to his JR season.

ON as a JR: 8.6 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 1.2 apg, 1.1 bpg
ON as a SR: 11.0 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 2.0 apg, 0.8 bpg

Santi is the only one that is actually performing worse this year than last year, but he's also been dealing with a shoulder injury. Even then he's still pretty close to his Junior season everywhere except PPG and that's a small drop from 13.3ppg to 11.9
 
#45
#45
Vescovi has not been the same since the Kentucky Game injury. He sat out 1 game. I imagine he has something nagging.
 
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#46
#46
This matter regarding regression of player development is off base, imo. Punter, Schofield, Alexander, Pons, Olivier, and Plavsic all noticeably improved late in their careers under Barnes. All others I can think of off the top of my head that stuck around UT under Barnes have not really regressed, even if they haven’t improved dramatically as seniors. Only exception might be Victor Bailey who put up much better numbers as a junior than as a senior.
 
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#47
#47
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