Per Hyams - Tennessee shut down due to Covid

#78

sjt18

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#78
Let's break it down more.

You and some dude are standing there naked. He pee-pees and some splashes on you.
Let's say then you happen to be wearing pants. When he pee-pees, only a little gets on you.
Now, just for kicks, let's say both of you are wearing pants. He pee-pees...you stay completely dry!

See? That's how masks work.
Yeah. I've seen that before and it is literally an apples and oranges type of argument. Liquids do not behave the same way gases and particles suspended in them behave.

Here's a more appropriate analogy. You are in a room with a tank leaking a toxic gas. You put a piece of plastic across the leak that reduces it by maybe 20-30%. The toxicity still builds... you still die. Same scenario outside... you don't die unless you hover right over the tank with or without the "mask".

Should people coughing with obvious symptoms wear a mask? Better if they stay home but coughs and sneezes are where masks might have some benefit... not on people without symptoms.
 
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#80

VFL-82-JP

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#80
Purchase a pulse oxymeter and try an experiment yourself. They are about $20.00. I measured my blood oxygen at 96% without a mask. I put a mask on just standing at the counter in my kitchen and my blood oxygen was down to 88% within 3 minutes. OR, you can believe everything you read on the internet. There used to be numerous peer-reviewed scientific articles available in a google or yahoo search that demonstrated that blood oxygen dropped significantly when wearing a mask. However, they all seem to have disappeared in the last 6 months. Others have performed the same experiment and found similar results. Experimentation is real science.

Hypoxia from facemasks
Instead, I'm just gonna believe my own personal experience...call it experimentation, if you wish. Though I am usually in and out of crowds in quick order, like 10-15 minutes tops, I have been in situations a few times where I wore my mask for more than an hour at a time (a couple of times, for several hours). I never felt light-headed, dizzy, short of breath, or otherwise encumbered. At all. No difference in breathing efficiency, on repeated essays.

So I'd say for me, personal experimentation reveals wearing a mask is absolutely no problem. But you do you...if your oxygen flow is that easily diminished, perhaps you'll have to be more careful with your mask decisions.
 
#81

sjt18

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#81
Turtles all the way down...
What was done... what you so devotedly believe in even now... did NOT WORK. It did not work in communities that "masked up" when compared to communities like mine where virtually no one "masked up". A neighboring community invoked and enforces a strict mask mandate. The virus spiked and went away with a nearly identical curve to ours. That same thing is repeated over and over.
 
#82

sjt18

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#82
Instead, I'm just gonna believe my own personal experience...call it experimentation, if you wish. Though I am usually in and out of crowds in quick order, like 10-15 minutes tops, I have been in situations a few times where I wore my mask for more than an hour at a time (a couple of times, for several hours). I never felt light-headed, dizzy, short of breath, or otherwise encumbered. At all. No difference in breathing efficiency, on repeated essays.

So I'd say for me, personal experimentation reveals wearing a mask is absolutely no problem. But you do you...if your oxygen flow is that easily diminished, perhaps you'll have to be more careful with your mask decisions.
I have a condition that requires routine doctor visits. My nurse told me that she can tell without asking who wears masks and who doesn't by their oxygen level when she checks it.
 
#83

ButchPlz

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#83
What was done... what you so devotedly believe in even now... did NOT WORK. It did not work in communities that "masked up" when compared to communities like mine where virtually no one "masked up". A neighboring community invoked and enforces a strict mask mandate. The virus spiked and went away with a nearly identical curve to ours. That same thing is repeated over and over.
State level, national level, on and on the story is the same. The hysteria needs to die.
 
#84

sigmundoooz

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#84
Instead, I'm just gonna believe my own personal experience...call it experimentation, if you wish. Though I am usually in and out of crowds in quick order, like 10-15 minutes tops, I have been in situations a few times where I wore my mask for more than an hour at a time (a couple of times, for several hours). I never felt light-headed, dizzy, short of breath, or otherwise encumbered. At all. No difference in breathing efficiency, on repeated essays.

So I'd say for me, personal experimentation reveals wearing a mask is absolutely no problem. But you do you...if your oxygen flow is that easily diminished, perhaps you'll have to be more careful with your mask decisions.
I DID NOT say you would experience symptoms. You do not need to experience immediate symptoms to have serious long-term issues. OR, you can ignore REAL science. Wait, COVID-19 without symptoms will not be a problem according to your hypothesis. Thus, no symptoms, no need to worry about wearing a mask or physical distancing correct?

REAL SCIENCE
The first article actually says "In pooled analysis, we found no significant reduction in influenza transmission with the use of face masks (RR 0.78, 95% CI 0.51–1.20; I2 = 30%, p = 0.25)" Of coure, this was done before MASKTERIA. By the way, influenza is a virus just like SARS2. Masks cannot stop viruses.

Nonpharmaceutical Measures for Pandemic Influenza in Nonhealthcare Settings—Personal Protective and Environmental Measures
A cluster randomised trial of cloth masks compared with medical masks in healthcare workers
Oxygen saturations less than 92% are associated with major adverse events in outpatients with pneumonia: a population-based cohort study - PubMed
 
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#85

VFL-82-JP

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#85
I have a condition that requires routine doctor visits. My nurse told me that she can tell without asking who wears masks and who doesn't by their oxygen level when she checks it.
I'm healthy as a horse.

You have a condition, I'm healthy as a horse. I wear a mask in crowds, you don't. Hmmm....... :)
 
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#91

WilcoVolsFan

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#91
If you are saying they infected her by not wearing a mask then the mounting evidence says you are wrong. They should have stayed away if that was the concern.

Sorry for your loss. My father in law who had a long history of lung disease died after catching Covid. He did not come in direct contact with the son who gave it to him. He lived in the son's basement and apparently caught it through the HVAC system.
Attempting to correct someone on the death of Grandparent re: a situation they have absolutely zero knowledge about.

Thanks/No thanks for proving my point about belligerent A-Holes and politicizing science, Doctor.
 
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#92

WilcoVolsFan

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#92
What happened to the goal of “herd immunity?” Unelected people have too much power as it relates to this issue. It needs to be fixed in Knoxville and Knox County...IMHO.
It's a goal based on vaccinations, not mass infections, hospitalizations and deaths. We don't obtain herd immunity for the flu by infecting everyone with it either, genius.

But thanks for the input, Doctor.

Also, what's the "too much power" you're referencing? Exactly zero mask mandates in Tennessee since the start of the pandemic.
 
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#94

VFL-82-JP

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#94
Did you think Covid was just gonna magically go away? We'll probably dealing with this sh^t for years. Life as you knew it is probably a thing of the past.
The word to know is "endemic."

It is the future of covid-19.

Coronavirus started in one province of China as an epidemic ("a widespread occurrence of an infectious disease in a community"). Then it spread beyond the Wuhan province, across China and around the globe, and became a pandemic ("(of a disease) prevalent over a whole country or the world"). And as we get used to living with it, develop a degree of herd immunity (but never 100%, it's not going away entirely, ever), it will become endemic ("(of a disease or condition) regularly found among people or in a certain area").

Just as the flu is. Just as the common cold is. It is not going away, ever.

So far so good in your post. But I think you're wrong about "life as you knew it is probably a thing of the past". I think that's off. I think we'll get back to normal as we achieve a significant degree of herd immunity.

Will people continue to die of covid-19? Yes. And they die every year of the flu. And pneumonia. But the % who die of covid will drop dramatically as we reach some steady state of herd immunity, enough of a natural buffer among the population that the disease doesn't find so many ultra-vulnerable victims in any given season.

That's the future. Covid-19 endemic to the human population. And us getting on with life.
 
#95

sjt18

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#95
Attempting to correct someone on the death of Grandparent re: a situation they have absolutely zero knowledge about.

Thanks/No thanks for proving my point about belligerent A-Holes and politicizing science, Doctor.
Hardly. I'm not unsympathetic. And masks or lack thereof still didn't kill anyone's grandmother. Our "sample size" is now 10's of millions of people.... 1000's of communities and outbreak sites. If there were ANY correlation between mask use and Covid management... it would have been the top news story for weeks... probably including the gratuitous shot at "anti-science" conservatives. But that hasn't happened. Nor have we seen clinical studies showing that masks work in the way they're being promoted.

You are the ones "politicizing science". You are the mask Nazis. Sorry facts offend you so greatly.
 
#96

TennesseeTarheel

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#96
This is long, long, long past stupid. There are very effective treatments. There is now a significant degree of immunity in the population with or without the vaccine.

I don't wear a mask for the same reason I don't take sugar pills for a headache.
There are nasal sprays that reduce hospitalizations by 90%. And they've been used since this time last year. Recently double blind studies by Oxford medicine have proved it. Seems like it is not a welcome solution. I link it here for my Vols to reference in case you get a dose.

Asthma drug reduces hospitalization for COVID-19: study.
 
#97

Brave Volunteer

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#97
It's the reality of the situation. Covid isn't ever going away, we can all either live in lockdown over it forever or we can get back with our lives. It's sad, but we can't keep forcing everyone to do this forever.
Sure. I just don't like the "oh well, sucks to be you" attitude that some people seem to have towards the 65 and older demographic. Like the attitude with the masks. "I've had my shot so screw you! I'm not wearing a mask!" Well how about have some ****ing courtesy for those who haven't had their shot. And I totally reject the notion that masks don't help. Even if it's just a small amount, 10% of something is better than 100% of nothing.
 
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#98

utvolpj

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#98
Did you think Covid was just gonna magically go away? We'll probably dealing with this sh^t for years. Life as you knew it is probably a thing of the past.
I ate breakfast in a full dinner this morning with no masks anywhere. My kids play sports, ride the bus and have been in school since August. They even spent all last summer at camp and will do it again this year. Maybe you will allow your life to change but some of us are thankfully allowed to continue on. UT football should be one of those things allowed to continue based on the science
 
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sjt18

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There are nasal sprays that reduce hospitalizations by 90%. And they've been used since this time last year. Recently double blind studies by Oxford medicine have proved it. Seems like it is not a welcome solution.
Thanks.

That's my point. Some people accuse those saying the king has no clothes of making this political. We aren't and didn't. Politics among the people some here trust implicitly prevented or inhibited the deployment of alternatives. I do not know for certain that Hydrochloroquine works. I do know that it is a VERY low risk drug used across the world for many illnesses. I know someone who has used it for 20 years to treat a chronic condition. At the very worst, it would have neither helped nor harmed Covid patients. But those who shut it down weren't "following the science". They were clamping down on dissent.

Repeatedly things that might or DO work have been dismissed while masks have been used as a placebo so that people think our "leaders" are "doing something".

I strongly suspect this goes back to the investments in vaccines... and who would have lost money had the virus and fear gone away too soon.
 

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