Lying liars and the lies they tell

#51
#51
agent|orange said:
Welcome to how politics are done in the US.

That is one thing that Obama said that I adamantly agreed with. Lobbying needs to be killed. Corporations funding these extravagant campaigns need to end.

The bitter irony in these campaigns are the attempt to "reach the common person" by spending hundreds of thousands of dollars making a speech you could have made from your living room and televised on CSPAN.

Suffice to say, I have a lot of problems with how the entire political system exists in the US. It's almost completely unapproachable to someone that isn't already heavily connected by name, wealth or willingness to be nothing more than a parrot. Which is decidedly not what it is supposed to be.
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Can't do it, it is and rightfully so protected under the 1st amendment.

We could however lessen the value of a congressman/senator by restricting sessions to 3-4 months per year outside of a national emergency.
 
#52
#52
McDad said:
Ras made a comment in the Lyndsey Graham thread that caused the few neurons i have remaining to activate. His post:

"This is the kind of refreshing honesty that has been missing in politics. Don't lie to me and tell me what I want to hear before the election and then change to a more unpopular position. Let the ppeople know beforehand where you really stand so they don't have to bother wasting their time voting for you.

Lindsey Graham: If you’re tired of war, don’t vote for me"

i admire Graham for his honesty but i wouldn't vote for him.

Q1: Are there any people in this forum who believe their favorite politician never lies (or lies significantly less than the other politicians)?

Q2: Is lying justified because the person has to win to change the direction of policy or because everyone else is doing it?

Q3: How important is honesty when you're considering someone?

Q4: If you accept the notion that all politicians lie, do you ever find yourself believing their speeches even though you know better?
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Played a lot of softball and on a certain night I could hit the ball that would catch the wind and go over the fence. I was in no way a homerun hitter. We had guys that hit homeruns almost at will. There is a difference. Some politicians are homerun hitters. Some get lucky every once in a while.
 
#53
#53
hog88 said:
Can't do it, it is and rightfully so protected under the 1st amendment.

We could however lessen the value of a congressman/senator by restricting sessions to 3-4 months per year outside of a national emergency.
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Agree it is freedom of speech. I think lobbying should be banned 100 miles radius around DC. Make em do that crap in each person's district.
 
#54
#54
Since when does the first amendment protect bribery and palm greasing??

It's no secret that corporate America has been buying politicians for years; yet everybody acts like that's how it's always been.

Meanwhile, corporate owned news conglomerates spew their board approved agendas to the American public, straight faced like its the gospel; a never ending squabble between red and blue to distract and divide.

The game is rigged; we are not a democracy. We are a republic ruled by the corporate and the elite.

Your vote doesn't matter. Republican, Democrat = status quo.
 
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#55
#55
SWIL said:
Since when does the first amendment protect bribery and palm greasing??

It's no secret that corporate (and unions) America has been buying politicians for years; yet everybody acts like that's how it's always been.

Meanwhile, corporate owned news conglomerates spew their board and union approved agendas to the American public, straight faced like its the gospel; a never ending squabble between red and blue to distract and divide.

The game is rigged; we are not a democracy. We are a republic ruled by the corporate and the elite.

Your vote doesn't matter. Republican, Democrat = status quo.
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fify

Never forget those filthy unions.
 
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#56
#56
McDad said:
Agree it is freedom of speech. I think lobbying should be banned 100 miles radius around DC. Make em do that crap in each person's district.
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That would be nice but could never do it.

I know term limits are unconstitutional also but maybe we could set up a system similar to that in Judge Dredd. Stay in office as long as you can but after if you stay longer than 8-12 years you have to take the long walk. Ship them to Africa to bring democracy to those peoples.
 
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#57
#57
According to our super scientific poll on VN:

We all are aware that politicians lie.
Lying is bad but not bad ENOUGH to alter your opinion on a candidate.
Some lies are more easily overlooked than others.

The Republic is so screwed.
 
#58
#58
hog88 said:
Can't do it, it is and rightfully so protected under the 1st amendment.

We could however lessen the value of a congressman/senator by restricting sessions to 3-4 months per year outside of a national emergency.
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What about limiting the amount of $ that the lobbyist can "donate"?
 
#61
#61
SWIL said:
Since when does the first amendment protect bribery and palm greasing??

It's no secret that corporate America has been buying politicians for years; yet everybody acts like that's how it's always been.

Meanwhile, corporate owned news conglomerates spew their board approved agendas to the American public, straight faced like its the gospel; a never ending squabble between red and blue to distract and divide.

The game is rigged; we are not a democracy. We are a republic ruled by the corporate and the elite.

Your vote doesn't matter. Republican, Democrat = status quo.
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Sounds like a Bernie Sanders vote if I've ever heard of one. :thumbsup:
 
#65
#65
Gramps said:
What about limiting the amount of $ that the lobbyist can "donate"?
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Won't matter.

Company A is set to only donate $10,000 but wants to donate another $90,000.

So it sets up 9 shell companies and each one donates $10,000.

There is a way around anything as it is based on the idea that organizations should have a voice in politics through lobbying.

But they can't pay the politician.

So they pay the politicians campaign and that, in turn, gets spent by the politicians staff for expenses over the course of "campaign season" which is all the time.

Lobbying, as we know it, is fraught with corruption between lobbyists, the corporate interests they represent (buy out) and the politicians they're buying.
 
#66
#66
Kingston Vol said:
Why do you think the top tax rate was so high before 1960?
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Raise it back but get rid of the AMT and let me deduct EVERY bit of interest I pay, country club membership and all of the other "deductions" that were eliminated.
 
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