LeBron's Legacy

#1
GahLee

GahLee

Drop The Leash
Joined
Sep 3, 2009
Messages
14,912
Likes
797
#1
I have heard a lot of people state that LeBron's legacy is forever tarnished because he "had to go to D. Wade's team to win a title".

Folks act as if he was supposed to be the only good player on a title winning team, he would have been the first to do so.

Go back the last 30 years and look at those teams, most had at least 2 HOF'ers and some of the better role players in that time as well.

So if the Heat go on a big title run, why shouldn't it hold as much weight as other great players?

Thoughts?
 
#2
#2
Those people are idiots. If he gets multiple rings, his legacy will be just fine.

Don't know that he'll ever dominate his sport like Jordan, Kobe, or Tiger though.
 
#3
#3
I agree, I don't understand where those people are coming from...every title winning team has at least 2 really good players and usually have more than that.
 
#5
#5
GahLee said:
I agree, I don't understand where those people are coming from...every title winning team has at least 2 really good players and usually have more than that.
Click to expand...

It takes more than one superstar. Look at the 06-07 & 07-08 Lakers....Kobe was struggling to get them to playoffs.

LeBron was on a bad team. Now he's on a good one. We'll see what he's made of.
 
#6
#6
Winning cures everything.

Are we all ready to just give these guys the trophy, though? With Beasley supposedly gone, that leaves Miami with just six guys on the roster right now, possibly less. Best case scenario, that leaves them around $10mil at most to sign 9 more guys. I know JaJuan Howard was ready to take the minimum to play here, but you're not going to build a solid team that way.

With a new and improved Eastern Conference, I'm not sure this Heat team will even make it to the Finals, let alone win it. If one of the big three gets injured, they are done. Absolutely done. I would still pick the Lakers and Celtics over the heat in a best of 7 series right now, no matter who they signed.
 
#7
#7
I agree Milo, they are going to ride those three all year long, there will be some growing pains but they will win at least two titles.
 
#9
#9
Didn't know that, yeah he is a good player...they will need him, interesting to see what they will get out of the three rookies they drafted.
 
#11
#11
I thought Lebron had bought a Subaru because that's the only Legacy he still has an option of having.
Some of your arguments are solid if they were about any other player than Lebron. Lebron has the talent to be the best ever but doesn't have the leadership gene that MJ, Bird, or Magic had/have.
Isiah was the leader of his championship teams even though many found Dumars to be the best player on the team.
Similarly, DWade has the leadership gene that will probably help the more talented player get a title or two.
Lebron will never be mentioned with MJ, Bird, Magic, etc. because he will have never LED a team to a championship.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#12
#12
To answer the question mor succinctly, I believe lebrons legacy will be the best raw talent ever in the game and maye a title or two, nothing more.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#13
#13
bamacheats said:
I thought Lebron had bought a Subaru because that's the only Legacy he still has an option of having.
Some of your arguments are solid if they were about any other player than Lebron. Lebron has the talent to be the best ever but doesn't have the leadership gene that MJ, Bird, or Magic had/have.
Isiah was the leader of his championship teams even though many found Dumars to be the best player on the team.
Similarly, DWade has the leadership gene that will probably help the more talented player get a title or two.
Lebron will never be mentioned with MJ, Bird, Magic, etc. because he will have never LED a team to a championship.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

That is absurd, of all the great players that you named, which of them could have led any of his previous 7 teams to a championship?

I would say none, here is why.

None of them ever had to lead a team like that to a title because they ALL played on vastly superior teams.

Every great player that has won a title did so with the help of another great player and a few really good players.

Expectations for LeBron to be the greatest ever and lead an otherwise mediocre squad to a title is completely unfair.

In 7 years, the best player that he played with is either Antawn Jamison or a very young Carlos Boozer. Enough said.
 
#14
#14
As a general rule, if a player hasn't played long enough to have cemented a permanent legacy, he also hasn't played long enough to act like this is his last best shot to win.

When a guy signs a contract and is asked, "Is this your last contract?", then it's probably safe to say that no one can fault him for wanting to go out on top. No sane person could criticize Gary Payton, Karl Malone, Ray Bourque, or anyone who played a long time, came up short in their prime, and wanted to take one last kick at it even if it meant leaving. No sane person could question the commitment of Craig Biggio or Jeff Bagwell, who valued loyalty more than being a one- or two-year mercenary.

But yeah, plenty of reasonable people are right to question a situation like this, where a 25-year-old who's seven years into an NBA career acts like he's in the worst possible situation, even after a 127-37 record the last two years. This would be like Peyton Manning leaving the Colts after his 49-touchdown 2004 season and going to New England, and an NFL career is a lot shorter than an NBA one. You don't think he'd be absolutely vilified for doing that, and rightly so?

There's two things about this whole situation that bother me.
1) Chris Bosh. "I'll go with you, Dwyane and LeBron, just as long as it's not Cleveland." Apparently Bosh, who is regarded as a philanthropist, recognizes that Cleveland is a city that's bursting at the seams with money and doesn't have entire neighborhoods that need bulldozed (Glenville, for one).
2) LeBron acting like he'd be stuck in Cleveland no matter what. He suggested that he doesn't want to be 31, on bad knees, and title-less. Of course, it makes the assumption that, if he were clearly at the end of his career and the team was further from contention than ever before, that the Cavaliers would sit on their hands and do nothing? If he were told "Your knees are in bad shape, and you maybe have a year or two left", don't think for a second that the team wouldn't move him for that last shot on a contending team. To suggest that they would do anything else is insane, because it's easier to risk the wrath for not putting together a contender in 13 years than to keep a local legend locked away out of spite or callousness.
 
#15
#15
In 7 years, the Cavs as an organization did nothing to help him win a title.
Antawn Jamison, Shaq and Mo Williams do no count.

What was he supposed to do? Take a chance on them for another 6 years and hope that they signed a player to help him out?

He could have signed with them and not won anything in those 6 years, leaving him out of his prime and desperate for a title.

Who can blame him for going to a better situation where they are obviously dedicated to winning.

You keep bringing up their record in the regular season as if that is some sort of accomplishment, nobody cares about the regular season, they didn't win jack in his 7 years except for one conference title.

They did a very poor job of putting a playoff team together.

Mo Williams would be nothing more than a role player on teams such as Boston, Orlando, Lakers, Hawks, I could go on and on he was the number 2 option for Cleveland and was going to be for the foreseeable future seeing as how no FA wanted to go to Cleveland.
 
#17
#17
GahLee said:
That is absurd, of all the great players that you named, which of them could have led any of his previous 7 teams to a championship?

I would say none, here is why.

None of them ever had to lead a team like that to a title because they ALL played on vastly superior teams.

Every great player that has won a title did so with the help of another great player and a few really good players.

Expectations for LeBron to be the greatest ever and lead an otherwise mediocre squad to a title is completely unfair.

In 7 years, the best player that he played with is either Antawn Jamison or a very young Carlos Boozer. Enough said.
Click to expand...

All of them. (and watch that attacking "absurd" nonsense oh sensitive one)
MJ - better
Bird - better
Magic - better
Lebron has been to the finals and no way Lebron gets to the finals on a team that Jordan can't get there.
You're missing the point. Ripping the supporting cast only damages your argument further. Replace Lebron with Jordan and Bosh is begging to sign with Cleveland. Replace Lebron with Magic and DWade tells Miami, "It's been real."
Because Lebron is not a leader he can't recruit a better supporting staff. He's the recruited instead of the recruiter.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#18
#18
bamacheats said:
All of them. (and watch that attacking "absurd" nonsense oh sensitive one)
MJ - better
Bird - better
Magic - better
Lebron has been to the finals and no way Lebron gets to the finals on a team that Jordan can't get there.
You're missing the point. Ripping the supporting cast only damages your argument further. Replace Lebron with Jordan and Bosh is begging to sign with Cleveland. Replace Lebron with Magic and DWade tells Miami, "It's been real."
Because Lebron is not a leader he can't recruit a better supporting staff. He's the recruited instead of the recruiter.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

Again, Absurd.

If you think that MJ could have won a title with any of the past 7 Cavs teams you're more clueless than I thought, same for Bird and Magic.

Your argument is very primitive, MJ-better, Bird-better, Magic-better.

Truth is, all of the greats that have been mentioned were on better teams and they all won with a much better supporting cast.

With that said there is no way to tell if they could have because they all played on better teams, if any of them won even a single title with a lesser team I would concede the argument, but they haven't.

Even the Bulls first title, Pippen was better than anyone on the Cavs past 7 teams excluding LeBron.
 
Last edited:
#19
#19
"Absurd" "Clueless" Sounds like someone is a bit sensitive. Maybe because your pride is hurt and you just can't admit that your initial argument wasn't well thought out and now you're stuck trying to prove a minority opinion instead of saying, "hey, that makes sense."

Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#21
#21
GahLee said:
In 7 years, the Cavs as an organization did nothing to help him win a title.
Antawn Jamison, Shaq and Mo Williams do no count.

What was he supposed to do? Take a chance on them for another 6 years and hope that they signed a player to help him out?

He could have signed with them and not won anything in those 6 years, leaving him out of his prime and desperate for a title.

Who can blame him for going to a better situation where they are obviously dedicated to winning.

You keep bringing up their record in the regular season as if that is some sort of accomplishment, nobody cares about the regular season, they didn't win jack in his 7 years except for one conference title.

They did a very poor job of putting a playoff team together.

Mo Williams would be nothing more than a role player on teams such as Boston, Orlando, Lakers, Hawks, I could go on and on he was the number 2 option for Cleveland and was going to be for the foreseeable future seeing as how no FA wanted to go to Cleveland.
Click to expand...

LeBron James was drafted by a team that had gone 17-65 the year before. Over the next seven years, they won 35, 42, 50, 50, 45, 66, and 61 games.

Maybe it's just me, but I happen to think that wins and losses are a pretty good indicator of exactly how good a team is.
 
#22
#22
bamacheats said:
"Absurd" "Clueless" Sounds like someone is a bit sensitive. Maybe because your pride is hurt and you just can't admit that your initial argument wasn't well thought out and now you're stuck trying to prove a minority opinion instead of saying, "hey, that makes sense."

Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

Not really, pretty confident in my argument...seeing how I looked at history and said to myself " your right, nobody can say otherwise "...every single team within the last 30 years was more talented than any team that he has ever played on, every great player had another great player by his side and had other really good players as well.

Not sensitive in the least, don't like to be called an idiot by anyone, which is where all the sensitive talk is stemming from.

Make a point that has some reasoning behind it or you are just arguing for arguments sake.
 
Last edited:
#23
#23
Ohio Vol said:
LeBron James was drafted by a team that had gone 17-65 the year before. Over the next seven years, they won 35, 42, 50, 50, 45, 66, and 61 games.

Maybe it's just me, but I happen to think that wins and losses are a pretty good indicator of exactly how good a team is.
Click to expand...

It is just you...0 titles means they failed every single year, those win totals are a little weak when you consider just how poor the Eastern conference has been as of late.
 
#24
#24
GAVol said:
That's what they said about Michael Jordan during his first 7 years in the NBA.
Click to expand...

Who exactly is "they"? I was there and I don't remember "they" saying that.

Plus, Lebron is more physically gifted than MJ was. But to argue that Lebron a better team makes than Jordan is illogical, that's just someone who likes to argue.

Lebron couldn't recruit better players to play with him. That's on him, not Dan Gilbert.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.
Advertisement



Back
Top