Kiffin PCs vs Fulmer PCs

#52
#52
WPAINE said:
This is the most asinine post I have read in awhile. For one, the 29-21 record is over the past 4 years, not five. Why did you choose 4 instead of 5? Because it made your argument look better. Had you done 5, his record was 40-24. Still not great, no doubt, but a lot better than you made it out to be. Or since it is all about what a coach does "now" then it seems ironic that Fulmer led the Vols to 10 wins the year before and a shot at the SEC championship. 10 wins, man! Not shabby anyway you slice it. So they whole "one bad move after the other" is ricidulous. Fulmer hired a bad Offensive Coordinator and it costed him his job, perhaps rightfully so, but lets call it like it is and not make up bovine statements about how Fulmer wasn't a good coach.

And to quicly address how Bowden and Paterno "were able to pull themselves out of it," you clearly haven't seen FSU play football lately. Or watch the news to see all the kinds of mess that they are in. I wouldn't saw Bowden has ever "pulled himself out of it" he was just really really good for a long time and has earned his right to stay put. As for Paterno, he just reached iconic status. And his downturn was a lot worse than Fulmer's. Again, keeping in mind that Fulmer won us 10 games in 2007 and 19 games if you combine 2006 and 2007. Penn State on the other hand, did not make it to a Bowl Game in 2000 (went 5-7) , 2001 (5-6) , 2003 (3-9) , or 2004 (4-7).

I hope you look at this closely. Not because I want you to dislike Kiffin, but so you can at least appreciate what our former coach did while at the University of Tennessee. It is possible to like Kiffin and be excited for Kiffin without bashing on Fulmer.
Click to expand...

Yeah, let's look at that 2007 season. We went 9-3 that season with blowout losses to a 6-6 Cal, a 9-4 Florida, and a 6-6 Bama.

We got lucky that UGA happened to play their worst game of the season against us, and we got lucky that UF happened to lose 3 SEC games. We also got extremely lucky against South Carolina (a game we should've run away with, but let them back in it), lucky against Vandy (they missed the game winning FG), and lucky against UK.

That defense was the worst I have ever seen since watching UT football. They gave up 40+ points 4 times...FOUR TIMES! First time that's ever happened in UT history.

Yes, UT did get 10 wins, but they also had 4 losses. Now a 10-2 season would be impressive, but 10-4, not so much...pretty mediocre.

You can brag about making the SEC championship all you want, but the bottom line is, Tennessee was EXTEMELY lucky in 2007, and in 2008, their luck ran out, and we all saw how great Fulmer was without that luck...
 
#53
#53
Rock33 said:
The times, They are a "changin' "...

2 Yrs ago we wouldn't have had that last little sentence !
BUT, now we really can't still be "Fulmerite's"

Kiffin and staff are just superior, give'm 17 years !!! See what happens !
:hi:
Click to expand...
Nothing "Fulmerite" in my statement. Just the truth.

Kiffin has yet to prove ANYTHING on the field. He has been great as far as exticiting the fan base and bringing in big name coaches. He has also done well recruiting. The only thing will truly matter is wins and losses. You can assume all you want at this point that he will be a better coach then Fulmer was. It is only an assumption right now though.
 
#54
#54
absolutely ridiculous. You are remembered for your body of work. You are remembered for bringing a national title to your program. You are remembered for bringing SEC Championships. Did Fulmer stumble at the end of his reign? Obviously, otherwise he'd still be here. But he's not remembered for 2005 and 2008. He's remembered for 152-52, a national title and not enough SEC Titles. To already put Kiffin over him is the one of the more absurd things ever posted on this board. The fact that you all continue to break the most absurd post of all time mark with such ease proves how far this board has fallen.
 
#55
#55
GreyWolf1129 said:
A "career" is not complete until it's over. With that in mind, yes...absolutely...and those "certain years" are usually the last 3, 4, or 5 years. You are remembered by how you finish. Ask Larry Coker, or even Lou Holtz, how that works.

Bobby Bowden is a good example. So is Phil Fulmer. And so is Joe Paterno. The "separation factor" among those three, at this point, seems to be that while all three suffered a slump...Bowden and Paterno worked their way out of it. Fulmer made one bad move after another, and it ended up costing him his job. 29-21 over his last five years. Those are Kentucky numbers.

Bear Bryant and The General went out on top of their game. Fulmer went out under a 5-7 cloud, and two losing seasons in his last four.

There is no comparison between the three. Odds are, the same will apply when Bowden and Paterno retire. There's a HUGE difference between retiring, and being fired.

If you are, in fact, a "football ref", then you of all people should understand...it ain't about what you do in the second quarter...it's what you do for all four quarters. That is where Phil Fulmer, and his career, falls short.

Go Vols.
Click to expand...



No.
 
#56
#56
WPAINE said:
This is the most asinine post I have read in awhile. For one, the 29-21 record is over the past 4 years, not five. Why did you choose 4 instead of 5? Because it made your argument look better. Had you done 5, his record was 40-24. Still not great, no doubt, but a lot better than you made it out to be. Or since it is all about what a coach does "now" then it seems ironic that Fulmer led the Vols to 10 wins the year before and a shot at the SEC championship. 10 wins, man! Not shabby anyway you slice it. So they whole "one bad move after the other" is ricidulous. Fulmer hired a bad Offensive Coordinator and it costed him his job, perhaps rightfully so, but lets call it like it is and not make up bovine statements about how Fulmer wasn't a good coach.

And to quicly address how Bowden and Paterno "were able to pull themselves out of it," you clearly haven't seen FSU play football lately. Or watch the news to see all the kinds of mess that they are in. I wouldn't saw Bowden has ever "pulled himself out of it" he was just really really good for a long time and has earned his right to stay put. As for Paterno, he just reached iconic status. And his downturn was a lot worse than Fulmer's. Again, keeping in mind that Fulmer won us 10 games in 2007 and 19 games if you combine 2006 and 2007. Penn State on the other hand, did not make it to a Bowl Game in 2000 (went 5-7) , 2001 (5-6) , 2003 (3-9) , or 2004 (4-7).

I hope you look at this closely. Not because I want you to dislike Kiffin, but so you can at least appreciate what our former coach did while at the University of Tennessee. It is possible to like Kiffin and be excited for Kiffin without bashing on Fulmer.
Click to expand...

10 wins with 4 losses is hardly something to celebrate. Just means you played a lot of damn games.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#58
#58
Bowden hasn't worked his way out of anything and Paterno had good enough sense to get out of the way.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#61
#61
volfanbill said:
absolutely ridiculous. You are remembered for your body of work. You are remembered for bringing a national title to your program. You are remembered for bringing sec championships. Did fulmer stumble at the end of his reign? Obviously, otherwise he'd still be here. But he's not remembered for 2005 and 2008. He's remembered for 152-52, a national title and not enough sec titles. To already put kiffin over him is the one of the more absurd things ever posted on this board. The fact that you all continue to break the most absurd post of all time mark with such ease proves how far this board has fallen.
Click to expand...


great post!
 
#63
#63
KoachKrab127 said:
Yeah, let's look at that 2007 season. We went 9-3 that season with blowout losses to a 6-6 Cal, a 9-4 Florida, and a 6-6 Bama.

We got lucky that UGA happened to play their worst game of the season against us, and we got lucky that UF happened to lose 3 SEC games. We also got extremely lucky against South Carolina (a game we should've run away with, but let them back in it), lucky against Vandy (they missed the game winning FG), and lucky against UK.

That defense was the worst I have ever seen since watching UT football. They gave up 40+ points 4 times...FOUR TIMES! First time that's ever happened in UT history.

Yes, UT did get 10 wins, but they also had 4 losses. Now a 10-2 season would be impressive, but 10-4, not so much...pretty mediocre.

You can brag about making the SEC championship all you want, but the bottom line is, Tennessee was EXTEMELY lucky in 2007, and in 2008, their luck ran out, and we all saw how great Fulmer was without that luck...
Click to expand...


Please read my post again. Also, don't be so ridiculous in your argument that you mention our 3 losses but then qualify our wins as being "luck." I will give you that we got lucky in some of those wins, but we won. Who cares? Are you willing to say that we didn't deserve the 1998 NC game because we got lucky against Syracuse, Florida, and Arkansas?

My point was not that a 10 win season was great, but that it is certainly good enough to keep a coach around. Not many coaches get fired after winning 10 games. So to say that he "stumbled" and never recovered is asinine. He had 2 bad years in a 4 year span and it cost him his job. Had he hired a different OC that ran a similar offense to Cutcliffe's then he would probably still be our coach and would have gotten a raise.... It's just the way the cards fell. Has nothing to do with him all of a sudden being a bad coach.
 
#64
#64
WPAINE said:
Please read my post again. Also, don't be so ridiculous in your argument that you mention our 3 losses but then qualify our wins as being "luck." I will give you that we got lucky in some of those wins, but we won. Who cares? Are you willing to say that we didn't deserve the 1998 NC game because we got lucky against Syracuse, Florida, and Arkansas?

My point was not that a 10 win season was great, but that it is certainly good enough to keep a coach around. Not many coaches get fired after winning 10 games. So to say that he "stumbled" and never recovered is asinine. He had 2 bad years in a 4 year span and it cost him his job. Had he hired a different OC that ran a similar offense to Cutcliffe's then he would probably still be our coach and would have gotten a raise.... It's just the way the cards fell. Has nothing to do with him all of a sudden being a bad coach.
Click to expand...
Our problems were much deeper than who our OC was. With Cutcliffe here, we were still getting beat by Florida, Georgia, and Alabama.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#66
#66
some folks get way too sensitive or read way too much into a post...this was simply about press conf being more interesting than fulmer and not a bash fulmer or Kiffin episode
 
#67
#67
Godfatha said:
Our problems were much deeper than who our OC was. With Cutcliffe here, we were still getting beat by Florida, Georgia, and Alabama.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

Good post, but Cut always beat UGA. Our recruiting was going bust and discipline was out the window. That is why our talent pool is diminished and Kiffin and Co will have to build it back again to compete with the top teams in the SEC.

Kiffin more than likely will be better than the Fulmer of this decade but will be hard pressed to be equal to his 90's record. The SEC is a deeper conference than it was in the last decade and teams such as OM, USC, even UK have improved.
 
#68
#68
Godfatha said:
Our problems were much deeper than who our OC was. With Cutcliffe here, we were still getting beat by Florida, Georgia, and Alabama.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
Click to expand...

WRONG. You just keep swingin and missin...With Cutcliffe here as OC we NEVER lost to Georgia and only lost to Alabama twice (1994 with Peyton as a freshman, and 2007).
 
#69
#69
footballref said:
Nothing "Fulmerite" in my statement. Just the truth.

Kiffin has yet to prove ANYTHING on the field. He has been great as far as exticiting the fan base and bringing in big name coaches. He has also done well recruiting. The only thing will truly matter is wins and losses. You can assume all you want at this point that he will be a better coach then Fulmer was. It is only an assumption right now though.
Click to expand...
Posted via VolNation Mobile

You know what they say about making assumptions...
 
Last edited:
#70
#70
hmanvolfan said:
Be careful what you ask for... :ermm:
Click to expand...

Well, I've had many beers with folks I don't agree with. I do enjoy trading ideas and perspectives with folks I don't agree with. Depending on the person though some conversations can be very short.
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.
Advertisement



Back
Top