Is Phillip Fulmer a legend? (split)

#201
#201
Clinkscales was part of the WR era that began to put UT on the map as "Wide Receiver U"..while I wouldnt compare him to Pickens per say...He was a very good college receiver for us that went on to the NFL..cant really find his stats
 
#202
#202
Technically speaking, if you really want to define a school legend, it boils down to 2 categories. When you think of UT football do you remember someone as...

1. Oh yeah, they were good...

OR

2. BAM! BAM! BAM! Another Notch!!
 
#206
#206
oklavol said:
What do people remember Ryan Leaf for? Being a great QB at Washington St or a bust in the NFL?

I think you have to look at their career as a whole, college and pro to really call someone a legend.
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While I agree with you oklavol...I might have to say that it would depend on the position the player played....However I think you have to look at the entire career from college through the NFL
 
#207
#207
hatvol96 said:
He wasn't even the best safety on his own team. I'd take Greg Gaines over him all day long.
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OMG...I actually agree w/ Hat. I too watched every game Bates played at UT. He was not a poor player...you just wouldn't know whether he was on the field, or not. I went to HS w/ Greg gaines, and all the Gaines boys, and there isn't one of them that didn't hit harder than Bates. Bates in not a UT legend. The only reason he made it w/ the Cowboys is because he decided he HAD to change the way he played in order to make it at the next level. I wish he had played as hard at UT as he did in Dallas. There...I said it, I publicly agreed w/ hat...now I need to go take a shower...:)
 
#208
#208
General_Neyland said:
While I agree with you oklavol...I might have to say that it would depend on the position the player played....However I think you have to look at the entire career from college through the NFL
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We're talking 2 types of legends here. A true football legend top to bottom, and legends of school history. A true "UT" legends list won't be super long to begin with. A legend of the sport seems to be the main theme here. Howver, also consider the list of NFL "legends" that were relatively silent in college. Then we have 3 categories.

1. Collegiate Legends
2. NFL legends
3. Legends of the game.

For example, there are alot of us here that are legends in our own mind. I won't mention names. Most of us are quickly humbled outside our own arena on volnational level.
 
#209
#209
mcompton said:
OMG...I actually agree w/ Hat. I too watched every game Bates played at UT. He was not a poor player...you just wouldn't know whether he was on the field, or not. I went to HS w/ Greg gaines, and all the Gaines boys, and there isn't one of them that didn't hit harder than Bates. Bates in not a UT legend. The only reason he made it w/ the Cowboys is because he decided he HAD to change the way he played in order to make it at the next level. I wish he had played as hard at UT as he did in Dallas. There...I said it, I publicly agreed w/ hat...now I need to go take a shower...:)
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Being right for the first time ever is a feeling you want to wash off? You should think about it before you do that.
 
#210
#210
Well thats cool....Im not saying Bill Bates is a Hall of Famer....but he will forever be remembered as a play making part of UT's defense back then....I also saw him play all games at UT...I dont really get why you say you would never know he was on the field...from what I remember from Bates days is that he was a hard hitter and in on most plays defensively...Im more or less saying He will never be forgotten at UT and always well regarded
 
#211
#211
After Bates got rolled by Walker and forever became the butt end of highlight reels, he had no choice but to change the way he played. That never happened to him again best I recall.
 
#212
#212
hatvol96 said:
On teams that were, not coincidentally, awful. When the Cowboys returned to prominance, he was nothing more than a backup in the defensive bacfield.
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You cant blame a guy for "when" he played. And he was like.... 40 years old by that time.
 
#213
#213
MontereyVol said:
You cant blame a guy for "when" he played. And he was like.... 40 years old by that time.
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I wasn't blaming him for when he played. It is, however, no coincidence that the Cowboy teams he played significant defensive snaps for were awful.
 
#216
#216
MontereyVol said:
Your actually saying Bill Bates was the reason the Cowboys sucked at defense?
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The fact that someone as minimally talented as Bates was starting for the Cowboy defense is certainly as symptom of a defense wracked with the disease, Lackofplaymakersosis.
 
#217
#217
hatvol96 said:
The fact that someone as minimally talented as Bates was starting for the Cowboy defense is certainly as symptom of a defense wracked with the disease, Lackofplaymakersosis.
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Yeah.... your probably right because defensive coaching couldnt have been the problem it had to be the eleven guys who all sucked but somehow made it into pro football. Also Bates was so crappy the Cowboys just tried to get rid of him instead of letting him play as long as he liked.
 
#218
#218
MontereyVol said:
Also Bates was so crappy the Cowboys just tried to get rid of him instead of letting him play as long as he liked.
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I'm picturing all those defensive snaps Bates played the last seven or eight years of his career. Oh, that's right. They didn't happen.
 
#219
#219
GAVol said:
Hat, he could cure cancer and you wouldn't like him.

Whatever you think of my verbiage, my point was that I don't think a program has to wander through the wilderness for a period of time when replacing a successful coach.

P.S. - I still don't give this thread much weight.
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Good point GAVOL.Post such as this have made me come to realize that you probably are the most fair and most informed/overall intelligent poster on the board.This comment comes from a viable source since my son is a professor (howbeit young) and my neice is first year interning a UCLA Medical (via NYC) after turning down one or two Ivy League schools (just to validate my point more).I can see through a lot of STUFF on here.A lot!Volnation must have a voice of reason.
 
#220
#220
MontereyVol said:
Yeah.... your probably right because defensive coaching couldnt have been the problem it had to be the eleven guys who all sucked but somehow made it into pro football.
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Right. The staff responsible for the Doomsday Defense suddenly got stupid when Bates arrived. It has nothing to do with trading in guys like Charlie Waters or Cliff Harris for a player like Bates, an exchange comparable to exchanging a Mercedes for a Vega.
 
#224
#224
hatvol96 said:
Does that mean when his successor wins his third SEC title, we'll name the university after him? The idea that Fulmer would be mentioned in the same breath as the Bryants, Paternos, Rocknes, and Osbornes of the world is utterly sickening.
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An analogy...

300 wins will probably never be accomplished again (unless Randy Johnson gets it in gear) because pitchers aren't getting the same number of starts as in the past. The new milestone will probably be 250 wins in MLB.

Same is true for coaches, I suppose. 2 conference championships in 15 years is the new bar that coaches have to be measured by because the conference has gotten that much tougher and conference championships are a lot harder to come by.

I know it's twisted logic, but I'm just playing Devil's Advocate and reaching trying to figure out how any reasonable individual could believe that Fulmer can be grouped with legendary coaches.
 
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