I didn't realize it was this bad...

Remy

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If we lost to Kentucky and/or even Vanderbilt next season, I for one will not be calling for Heupel's job. In 2022, he does the same thing, I won't be calling for his job but I will be on the bandwagon he gets zero extensions and or promises about supporting him for the end of his five year contract. If he doesn't beat both in year 3 he deserves no reason to see a season 4 as UT HC IMO.
 

SayUWantAreVOLution

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If we lost to Kentucky and/or even Vanderbilt next season, I for one will not be calling for Heupel's job. In 2022, he does the same thing, I won't be calling for his job but I will be on the bandwagon he gets zero extensions and or promises about supporting him for the end of his five year contract. If he doesn't beat both in year 3 he deserves no reason to see a season 4 as UT HC IMO.
I agree. A lot of this isn't Heupel's fault.

If Willis and Beasley are gone and the portal doesn't bless us, we're a rolled ankle followed by a targeting call from....... "Yikes! Who is that?" trying to cover SEC caliber receivers. That might work against Vandy but Kentucky and SCe will exploit the hell out of serious talent/experience gaps.

Losses to lesser schools can easily occur when your depth is paper thin and a penalty, injury, illness puts inexperienced backup players in key spots.
 

SayUWantAreVOLution

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Why do we care about this particular stat?
Because if you want to recruit Manning or Downs or another big 2023 recruit, you want to show you're a pipeline university to the next level. If you think you can show them the campus, the facilities, Neyland and that's all an elite prospect is looking for..... you're dreaming.

College is just launching pad for an elite athlete. If we're not preparing them for and getting them to the next level, they're not coming to UT.

If they're not coming to UT, we're, at best, a middle of the SEC program.
 
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BowlBrother85

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SEC's past 3 years (2019, 2020, 2021) total NFL Draft picks:

Bama: 29
LSU: 24
Georgia: 23
Florida: 19
Auburn: 15
Texas AM: 13
Kentucky: 13
Miss State: 12
South Carolina: 11
Missouri: 10
Ole Miss: 8
Arkansas: 6
Vanderbilt: 4
Tennessee: 4

-Finished, edited through Round 7
You didn't just watch Tennessee go 3-7?
 

ETCvol4life

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This is the hard truth but if Heupel doesn't "turn it around" in 2-3 years..... many here will be calling for his head.

A recruiting pipeline takes time to establish. A player development program takes time once you've established SEC quality recruiting.

We're going to have to invest time, real time, in allowing a coach to be "long term" and provide a stable program to recruit to. Right now, recruits are going to hear from their coaches: Great school but you need to understand your recruiting coaches probably won't be there long enough to develop you before a new staff with new ideas comes along.

That's not a selling point for recruiting and contributes to why development lags, wins aren't there, and guys aren't getting to the next level like they should.
I agree, it takes time. Just look at what Stoops has done at a place like KENYUCKY and you can see what it takes to recruit and develop players. Say what you want about the cats but he has done a great job getting a program like that to the point there at now.
 

BowlBrother85

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I agree, it takes time. Just look at what Stoops has done at a place like KENYUCKY and you can see what it takes to recruit and develop players. Say what you want about the cats but he has done a great job getting a program like that to the point there at now.
What point are they at now? In Mark Stoops 8 seasons, Kentucky has only lost fewer than 5 games once. They were 5-6 last season. Stoops is just 2-6 vs Tennessee. Are they really that much better now than they were in Rich Brooks last 4 seasons?
 
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SayUWantAreVOLution

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What point are they at now? In Mark Stoops 8 seasons, Kentucky has only lost fewer than 5 games once. They were 5-6 last season. Stoops is just 2-6 vs Tennessee. Are they really that much better now than they were in Rich Brooks last 4 seasons?
Stoops didn't inherit the Brooks team, he replaced Joker Phillips who sucked the life out of what Brooks had done at KY over 3 years.

KY was awful, 2-10 for Stoops' first year, and little better in his next 2 years. Now KY is sending guys to the NFL regularly and they're no longer a "sure win" on the SEC schedule for several teams.

Is Stoops the new Saban? No, but he's been given the time to build a program at KY and he's building a solid program.

The point is: it takes a good coach AND it takes time to pull a program up from where we are. VN will insist "he should have it fixed in year 2 or he's not the guy" which is dumb. Saban or Swinney or Meyer would struggle in the first couple of years at UT because we're dysfunctional, the culture is beat down, and the coaching has been awful for the players already here.

Time. And good coaching, but TIME.
 

BowlBrother85

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Stoops didn't inherit the Brooks team, he replaced Joker Phillips who sucked the life out of what Brooks had done at KY over 3 years.

KY was awful, 2-10 for Stoops' first year, and little better in his next 2 years. Now KY is sending guys to the NFL regularly and they're no longer a "sure win" on the SEC schedule for several teams.

Is Stoops the new Saban? No, but he's been given the time to build a program at KY and he's building a solid program.

The point is: it takes a good coach AND it takes time to pull a program up from where we are. VN will insist "he should have it fixed in year 2 or he's not the guy" which is dumb. Saban or Swinney or Meyer would struggle in the first couple of years at UT because we're dysfunctional, the culture is beat down, and the coaching has been awful for the players already here.

Time. And good coaching, but TIME.
Give me a break. Kentucky sucks.
 

SayUWantAreVOLution

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Nothing is Heupel’s fault at this time because he hasn’t even coached a game yet.
The point is Heupel didn't create our huge secondary issues by failing as a coach so should he be blamed when our secondary gets torched and we lose?

If we're reduced to playing 2s and 3s week after week on defense and they are trying to cover faster, simply more talented receivers, can we put those losses on Heupel this year?
 

Otis1105

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What point are they at now? In Mark Stoops 8 seasons, Kentucky has only lost fewer than 5 games once. They were 5-6 last season. Stoops is just 2-6 vs Tennessee. Are they really that much better now than they were in Rich Brooks last 4 seasons?
I think Kentucky is at a point where stoops can prove he gets players drafted now. Which means he will start pulling in higher rated players that will get drafted at a higher clip. He’s developed his low end players, now, as UT has lost 3 head to head recruiting battles against him in 3 years for 4 star prospects. you START to see the snowball. Denying he has built a decent program doesn’t make you a better vol fan, nor does it mean it isn’t true. If this rams coach makes Kentucky 1.5 dimensional instead of just 1 then they will be a real decent team.
 

BowlBrother85

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I think Kentucky is at a point where stoops can prove he gets players drafted now. Which means he will start pulling in higher rated players that will get drafted at a higher clip. He’s developed his low end players, now, as UT has lost 3 head to head recruiting battles against him in 3 years for 4 star prospects. you START to see the snowball. Denying he has built a decent program doesn’t make you a better vol fan, nor does it mean it isn’t true. If this rams coach makes Kentucky 1.5 dimensional instead of just 1 then they will be a real decent team.
I'm just stating the facts. In 8 seasons, Mark Stoops has only lost fewer than 5 games one time (2018). He is 2-6 vs Tennessee and he lost to Tennessee with the best team that he has had (2018)... by 17 points.
 

ETCvol4life

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What point are they at now? In Mark Stoops 8 seasons, Kentucky has only lost fewer than 5 games once. They were 5-6 last season. Stoops is just 2-6 vs Tennessee. Are they really that much better now than they were in Rich Brooks last 4 seasons?
Still better than they have been sense I started watch football. They have had a 10 win season and they are making bowl games regular and they beat UT at UT so I would say he has done a very good job. With the place he is at and the reputation they had for lack of football he has brought them a long way. I did not say he turned them into a championship team. I just said said he has done a good job!
 

stevenrich2003

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SEC's past 3 years (2019, 2020, 2021) total NFL Draft picks:

Bama: 29
LSU: 24
Georgia: 23
Florida: 19
Auburn: 15
Texas AM: 13
Kentucky: 13
Miss State: 12
South Carolina: 11
Missouri: 10
Ole Miss: 8
Arkansas: 6
Vanderbilt: 4
Tennessee: 4

-Finished, edited through Round 7
Thanks, I am on my way to the hardware store to find me a strong rope and a latter. We have had the same amount of draft picks as vandy?? Sobering is not a good word...
 

ABINGDON VOL FAN

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The point is Heupel didn't create our huge secondary issues by failing as a coach so should he be blamed when our secondary gets torched and we lose?

If we're reduced to playing 2s and 3s week after week on defense and they are trying to cover faster, simply more talented receivers, can we put those losses on Heupel this year?
No but that is a different point from I was responding to.
 

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