Heupel VS Swinney on transfer portal

#2

volsrock09

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2013
Messages
486
Likes
1,673
#2
I believe the reason in the 2 mindsets differ based on their current roster situations. UT needs to utilize the portal for quick fixes until their roster is up to par with their competition. Clemson already has one of the best rosters in the country allowing him to be more picky with who he brings in from other schools. UT isn't in that position right now. If things were flipped, I bet he would absolutely take more transfers.
 
#4

ClockworkOrange

Electric Sheep
Joined
Jan 28, 2009
Messages
632
Likes
2,856
#4
The movie King Richard reminded me of the best argument FOR NIL. If Serena and Venus Williams got paid millions at like 14 to let somebody use their name and likeness way back in the 90s, why can't football and basketball players do it as well??

Why should team sport players be barred from benefitting from what other teen athletes have been benefitting from for DECADES?
 
#5

turbovol

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 8, 2021
Messages
563
Likes
1,044
#5
The movie King Richard reminded me of the best argument FOR NIL. If Serena and Venus Williams got paid millions at like 14 to let somebody use their name and likeness way back in the 90s, why can't football and basketball players do it as well??

Why should team sport players be barred from benefitting from what other teen athletes have been benefitting from for DECADES?
You miss the obvious point: The Williams sisters were turning pro; they didn't go to college. College student-athletics should be different. Granted, it isn't much anymore--but it should be.

Somehow, this notion settled in that college athletes were being exploited by their schools, which IMO is mostly nonsense. Most revenue-sport student athletes are getting full scholarships that, over 4 years, are worth well more than $100,000--probably closer to $150K or more when you consider housing and food. Do you know how many college students who are not student-athletes would like $100K to pay for their college education? All of them. They not only have to pay to go to college, most have to borrow as well, getting saddled with student debt. So all of these hand-wringing about poor football and basketball players is the usual jive talk. We've got colleges now who are paying student-athletes to get decent or good grades. More nonsense. It's like, well, we can't expect these players to be responsible, so we have to bribe them to stay eligible. Most take very easy majors in the first place, and so getting good grade in a sports-management or general studies (whatever that is) major shouldn't be that difficult in the first place.

Beyond this, NIL is just a license to bribe high-school prospects. Some Alabama coach can tell a 5 star prospect that he's got a bizman lined up to do a NIL with him. Maybe the booster/bizman gives the kid, say, $10K or $20K as part of some supposed NIL deal. Maybe the bizman has 100 T-shirts printed to make the deal look kosher--and that's the end of it. Very few student athletes are going to get an NIL deal in the first place, and of those who do, only a handful (at best) even have the possibility of making decent money. You might have a star left-guard on your football team--but fans are not going to go out and buy Star Left Guard T-shirts. In sum, this idea that student-athletes who are getting an expensive four-year college education for free--along with food, housing, tutoring, crisis management, etc, etc. AND the training/coaching that could them in a position to earn a pro contract--are being mistreated is total BS. They've got it better than all other college students in the country! And paying them to get decent/good grades? Pathetic. And, as mentioned, you've just, with NIL, pretty much give boosters a license to bribe high-school prospects. It used to be done in the dark and was illegal; now, it can all be wide open--and there's NOBODY to monitor any of it.

As for the portal, the transfer thing has spun out of control--but as others have noted, it's easy for coaches at top programs to cast aspersions on the portal, because they recruit very well to begin with. It is clearly more help to programs, like ours, which are not as strong--but even so how much help are most transfers. In some cases they can be a lot of help--look at our QB--but in a lot of cases you're just getting players who were not getting PT at other schools, and there's usually a reason for that. I don't think there is even a limit on the number of times a student-athlete can transfer, is there? If there isn't, there should be--limit of one, or maybe two, I can't decide. It's also worth noting that a LOT of student-athletes do NOT improve their situation by transferring. Some do, but a lot don't. And most transfers can't pick the next school they want to play more. A few can, but a coach has got to want you. You may find a school where you play more--but it may be a lesser, lousy program.
 
#8

Delmar

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 4, 2011
Messages
2,167
Likes
3,370
#8
You miss the obvious point: The Williams sisters were turning pro; they didn't go to college. College student-athletics should be different. Granted, it isn't much anymore--but it should be.

Somehow, this notion settled in that college athletes were being exploited by their schools, which IMO is mostly nonsense. Most revenue-sport student athletes are getting full scholarships that, over 4 years, are worth well more than $100,000--probably closer to $150K or more when you consider housing and food. Do you know how many college students who are not student-athletes would like $100K to pay for their college education? All of them. They not only have to pay to go to college, most have to borrow as well, getting saddled with student debt. So all of these hand-wringing about poor football and basketball players is the usual jive talk. We've got colleges now who are paying student-athletes to get decent or good grades. More nonsense. It's like, well, we can't expect these players to be responsible, so we have to bribe them to stay eligible. Most take very easy majors in the first place, and so getting good grade in a sports-management or general studies (whatever that is) major shouldn't be that difficult in the first place.

Beyond this, NIL is just a license to bribe high-school prospects. Some Alabama coach can tell a 5 star prospect that he's got a bizman lined up to do a NIL with him. Maybe the booster/bizman gives the kid, say, $10K or $20K as part of some supposed NIL deal. Maybe the bizman has 100 T-shirts printed to make the deal look kosher--and that's the end of it. Very few student athletes are going to get an NIL deal in the first place, and of those who do, only a handful (at best) even have the possibility of making decent money. You might have a star left-guard on your football team--but fans are not going to go out and buy Star Left Guard T-shirts. In sum, this idea that student-athletes who are getting an expensive four-year college education for free--along with food, housing, tutoring, crisis management, etc, etc. AND the training/coaching that could them in a position to earn a pro contract--are being mistreated is total BS. They've got it better than all other college students in the country! And paying them to get decent/good grades? Pathetic. And, as mentioned, you've just, with NIL, pretty much give boosters a license to bribe high-school prospects. It used to be done in the dark and was illegal; now, it can all be wide open--and there's NOBODY to monitor any of it.

As for the portal, the transfer thing has spun out of control--but as others have noted, it's easy for coaches at top programs to cast aspersions on the portal, because they recruit very well to begin with. It is clearly more help to programs, like ours, which are not as strong--but even so how much help are most transfers. In some cases they can be a lot of help--look at our QB--but in a lot of cases you're just getting players who were not getting PT at other schools, and there's usually a reason for that. I don't think there is even a limit on the number of times a student-athlete can transfer, is there? If there isn't, there should be--limit of one, or maybe two, I can't decide. It's also worth noting that a LOT of student-athletes do NOT improve their situation by transferring. Some do, but a lot don't. And most transfers can't pick the next school they want to play more. A few can, but a coach has got to want you. You may find a school where you play more--but it may be a lesser, lousy program.
Interesting but antiquated thoughts. I “should” look like Robert Redford and have Bill Gates’ money but that ain’t happening. Just one thing on comparing these players with regular students. Let’s use a chemistry major as an example. Are there 100,000 people buying tickets and merchandise to watch him/her light a Bunsen Burner? Is the university getting paid millions for fans tuning in to watch a Biology major dissect a frog? I don’t like the fact that it hasn’t been set up well and policing it is going to be a nightmare. But I have no issue at all with players profiting from the millions of dollars these programs are raking in. Like it or not, the horse has left the barn on the ancient notion of the amateur “student athlete”. As far as the transfer portal goes, they need to tweak those rules as well as it’s the Wild West right now. However, if coaches are free to leave for a better deal at a moment’s notice, I fundamentally don’t have a problem with athletes being able to move without having to sit out a year if they think it’s best for them.
 
#9

GiveHim6InSC

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2016
Messages
1,012
Likes
2,603
#9
Based on the climate around here last year, Swinney would’ve loved to have another QB after the way the ones he had left played.
They got a 5 star in this year, but things weren’t much better in the spring and the nerves were palpable last weekend at the spring game.
I’d say he talks out both sides of his mouth, because they’re adding players from the portal…
 
#11

TitanicVolz

BrB keep my seat warm😉
Joined
May 21, 2013
Messages
1,772
Likes
5,460
#11
It's not really that shocking that the Bama and Clemsons of the world have a problem with NIL and the transfer portal.I mean for the last handful of years secret handshakes have taken them to the top of college ball and now that the hand shakes ain't so much a secret there leveling the playing field and they have an issue with it.Theres alot of money moving around behind the scenes we never see or hear of but nobody likes it when someone else's hand is in the cookie jar.
 
#12

tennesseeduke

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2012
Messages
6,601
Likes
6,366
#12
I honestly don't know why any player would want to play for Swinney. He's too rigid and it's my way or the highway attitude.
That's the exact reason they do. Don't judge him if you have never met him or spent some time with him. I have and he's a genuine as they come. I hate Clemson but I respect and admire coach Swinney!
 
#14

GrayWaterCanine

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2020
Messages
627
Likes
1,235
#14
Interesting but antiquated thoughts. I “should” look like Robert Redford and have Bill Gates’ money but that ain’t happening. Just one thing on comparing these players with regular students. Let’s use a chemistry major as an example. Are there 100,000 people buying tickets and merchandise to watch him/her light a Bunsen Burner? Is the university getting paid millions for fans tuning in to watch a Biology major dissect a frog? I don’t like the fact that it hasn’t been set up well and policing it is going to be a nightmare. But I have no issue at all with players profiting from the millions of dollars these programs are raking in. Like it or not, the horse has left the barn on the ancient notion of the amateur “student athlete”. As far as the transfer portal goes, they need to tweak those rules as well as it’s the Wild West right now. However, if coaches are free to leave for a better deal at a moment’s notice, I fundamentally don’t have a problem with athletes being able to move without having to sit out a year if they think it’s best for them.
Not sure that is a fair comparison. The schools are technically not involved in the NIL money and deals. Also, the best comparison is that those Chemistry majors you mentioned are completely free to utilize their name for commercial purposes, so why should a football player be prohibited from that same right?
 
#15

RiseToTheTop

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 19, 2013
Messages
19,029
Likes
20,473
#15
Man has a 93M contract, plays in a garbage conference but yet has a problem with NIL and the portal. Guy sucks.

Good luck staying ahead of your competition with an approach like that.
 
#17

BigBadVol

The MojoMofo
Joined
Feb 2, 2010
Messages
3,940
Likes
6,358
#17
That's the exact reason they do. Don't judge him if you have never met him or spent some time with him. I have and he's a genuine as they come. I hate Clemson but I respect and admire coach Swinney!
Ok, I get that but I certainly don't like his if you commit you can't take visits to other schools. It robs the kids of the experience and free trips. I live in SC and I have met him with a bunch of others so it wasn't one on one
 
#18

Delmar

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 4, 2011
Messages
2,167
Likes
3,370
#18
Not sure that is a fair comparison. The schools are technically not involved in the NIL money and deals. Also, the best comparison is that those Chemistry majors you mentioned are completely free to utilize their name for commercial purposes, so why should a football player be prohibited from that same right?
I’m agreeing with you. The players have every right to take advantage of it and should get some considering the schools have made millions on the backs of the players. What the other poster was saying is that the players get plenty already with the “free” education. Those days are dead and gone.
 
#19

Devo182

"Well Known Member" TWSS
Joined
Jan 25, 2015
Messages
25,420
Likes
72,030
#19
You miss the obvious point: The Williams sisters were turning pro; they didn't go to college. College student-athletics should be different. Granted, it isn't much anymore--but it should be.

Somehow, this notion settled in that college athletes were being exploited by their schools, which IMO is mostly nonsense. Most revenue-sport student athletes are getting full scholarships that, over 4 years, are worth well more than $100,000--probably closer to $150K or more when you consider housing and food. Do you know how many college students who are not student-athletes would like $100K to pay for their college education? All of them. They not only have to pay to go to college, most have to borrow as well, getting saddled with student debt. So all of these hand-wringing about poor football and basketball players is the usual jive talk. We've got colleges now who are paying student-athletes to get decent or good grades. More nonsense. It's like, well, we can't expect these players to be responsible, so we have to bribe them to stay eligible. Most take very easy majors in the first place, and so getting good grade in a sports-management or general studies (whatever that is) major shouldn't be that difficult in the first place.

Beyond this, NIL is just a license to bribe high-school prospects. Some Alabama coach can tell a 5 star prospect that he's got a bizman lined up to do a NIL with him. Maybe the booster/bizman gives the kid, say, $10K or $20K as part of some supposed NIL deal. Maybe the bizman has 100 T-shirts printed to make the deal look kosher--and that's the end of it. Very few student athletes are going to get an NIL deal in the first place, and of those who do, only a handful (at best) even have the possibility of making decent money. You might have a star left-guard on your football team--but fans are not going to go out and buy Star Left Guard T-shirts. In sum, this idea that student-athletes who are getting an expensive four-year college education for free--along with food, housing, tutoring, crisis management, etc, etc. AND the training/coaching that could them in a position to earn a pro contract--are being mistreated is total BS. They've got it better than all other college students in the country! And paying them to get decent/good grades? Pathetic. And, as mentioned, you've just, with NIL, pretty much give boosters a license to bribe high-school prospects. It used to be done in the dark and was illegal; now, it can all be wide open--and there's NOBODY to monitor any of it.

As for the portal, the transfer thing has spun out of control--but as others have noted, it's easy for coaches at top programs to cast aspersions on the portal, because they recruit very well to begin with. It is clearly more help to programs, like ours, which are not as strong--but even so how much help are most transfers. In some cases they can be a lot of help--look at our QB--but in a lot of cases you're just getting players who were not getting PT at other schools, and there's usually a reason for that. I don't think there is even a limit on the number of times a student-athlete can transfer, is there? If there isn't, there should be--limit of one, or maybe two, I can't decide. It's also worth noting that a LOT of student-athletes do NOT improve their situation by transferring. Some do, but a lot don't. And most transfers can't pick the next school they want to play more. A few can, but a coach has got to want you. You may find a school where you play more--but it may be a lesser, lousy program.
Lmao now do the valuation side...

Remember, a mostly free market like the NFL values the roster (of just 53) at about 25-30x their Head Coach. And yet 85 FBS scholarship football players at 100k valuation/each puts them at merely 1:1 or 2:1 at best lolol.
 
#20

Delmar

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 4, 2011
Messages
2,167
Likes
3,370
#20
Not sure that is a fair comparison. The schools are technically not involved in the NIL money and deals. Also, the best comparison is that those Chemistry majors you mentioned are completely free to utilize their name for commercial purposes, so why should a football player be prohibited from that same right?
One other thing though. You think the schools don’t know what’s going on with the NIL deals? “Technically” they aren’t supposed to be involved but you know better than that. If they aren’t, how do the NIL folks working with the various schools know which players to contact for that school? Somebody has to coordinate and I guarantee the head coach knows. If he doesn’t he’s a fool.
 
#21

Devo182

"Well Known Member" TWSS
Joined
Jan 25, 2015
Messages
25,420
Likes
72,030
#21
That's the exact reason they do. Don't judge him if you have never met him or spent some time with him. I have and he's a genuine as they come. I hate Clemson but I respect and admire coach Swinney!
I'm sure he's nice in front of people, but the guy has a history of being an unapologetic racist and is even against his own players earning their equity. The guy is so backwards, but he sadly pushed his "Reverend Freeze" jig upon everyone and sells it with perfection.
 
Likes: igotworms
#22

GrayWaterCanine

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2020
Messages
627
Likes
1,235
#22
One other thing though. You think the schools don’t know what’s going on with the NIL deals? “Technically” they aren’t supposed to be involved but you know better than that. If they aren’t, how do the NIL folks working with the various schools know which players to contact for that school? Somebody has to coordinate and I guarantee the head coach knows. If he doesn’t he’s a fool.
I agree that is the case, but it's not how it is technically set up. I said that to thwart the argument that the players deserve some of the money taken in by athletic departments. Different pie.
 
#23

DaddyChad

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2008
Messages
17,938
Likes
19,628
#23
That's the exact reason they do. Don't judge him if you have never met him or spent some time with him. I have and he's a genuine as they come. I hate Clemson but I respect and admire coach Swinney!
Meh, we have differing opinions. And it’s fine. I’ve also sit down with Freeze before he was at Ole Miss; never would’ve believed the stuff that came out before it did. Dabo has always struck me as FOS. Only guy I ever believed was as good as he acted like was Richt.
 
#25

tennesseeduke

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2012
Messages
6,601
Likes
6,366
#25
Ok, I get that but I certainly don't like his if you commit you can't take visits to other schools. It robs the kids of the experience and free trips. I live in SC and I have met him with a bunch of others so it wasn't one on one
It's his method and for 14 yrs it's worked pretty well! Since 2012 he's 131-17 with 2 natty's
 

VN Store




Top