Heupel could be "the" guy.

#51
#51
AllVol11717 said:
Fan expectations are almost always ludicrous, especially for SEC teams and shouldn’t be the end all, be all for coaching decisions. Losing one more game last year absolutely would’ve pissed off fans and you’d have more than your fair share calling for Heupel’s head for a 7 win season in his 5th year against a medium difficulty schedule by comparison to our peers.

In addition to fan expectations, you also have to sell your program to high profile recruits and transfers and winning less is actively a detriment to that. And maybe I’m crazy, but as a fan I want us to win every single game we play regardless of it’s importance, it’s only when a game is conceivably out of reach that it’s acceptable to move into “see what else we have” mode.

And why are you zero-ing on just practice? We’ve seen Merk in live action more than once last year against lesser competition and he did not perform exceptionally well. The offense stalled multiple times under him against UAB’s very poor defense. Acting like he never saw the field has me doubting how much of the season you actually saw. I also specifically mentioned that he was at UConn in the post you replied to so I’m also not sure you’re even reading what you’re replying to.

I wish nothing but the best for the kid, he’s a good dude and has talent, but we’ve seen he’s not a high end P4 guy. UConn is a great place for him to carve out a role and I really hope he has a successful career in whatever capacity that may be.
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Once again, I respectfully disagree

Quite honestly, for most of the big time donors (and most of the fans)-the 3rd loss was the tripping point. 3 losses or 5 losses at that point. It's still a meh season and a crappy bowl that nobody cared about one way or another. Whether we like it or not-the game now is playoffs or bust for the true players. For Arkansas or Miss St, yeah an 8-4 season would probably be manna from the heavens. Haven't we moved past our walk through the wilderness at this point though? Expectations (and prices) have changed considerably.

D White wants all the bells and whistles, the Vols better dominate the scoreboards. Middle of the pack teams don't need an entertainment district. They need to focus on the field.


I also don't think this conversations started specific to Meerk (I could be wrong on that though as there are like 4/5 similar conversations going around the board lol) I would not have cared if we rolled him or George (or a 4th string "emergency" QB for that matter) out there after the Oklahoma game, but one of them needed to be on the field

There was no benefit to the season or the future of the Vols by rolling Joey out there those last 3-4 games. None. Well, other than protecting the precious 200 yd/g "streak" that nobody cared about

Quite frankly, if Heupel was so concerned that going 7-5 vs 8-4 would get him fired after last season, then he may wanna buckle up this year lol. Once again, we have a meat grinder schedule now with absolutely zero live game experience under center. Bloody lovely

I like Heupel I really do -but the tail end of last season was borderline criminal mismanagement. Preparation and focus have been an issue since Heupel got here and I am honestly becoming more than a bit concerned.

And to tie things in a bow, I noticed the UConn part after posting my original thoughts then re-read and saw the UConn part. Hence the reason I edited plainly to say he ended up at UConn .
 
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#52
#52
CFB is evolving and has evolved significantly in just the short time Heupel has been at UT. Recruiting used to be everything. Now it is a comprehensive "money ball" operation to piece together the best roster you can... knowing there will not be dependable continuity due to NIL and the transfer portal.

Has the O changed or has he simply tailored it to the strengths and weaknesses of his QBs? There's probably some of both.


I personally never believed in Banks. He was never an SEC class playcaller or tactician. Even mediocre OCs routinely outschemed him. I do not know why Heupel hired a "co" DC in the first place with good money to spend. He did. It is done. He corrected his mistake though I would argue at least 2 years later than he should have. An elite DC would have produced a NC with the 2024 personnel.

To be fair, that was not an easy read for CJH. Banks did take over a mess. Bad culture. Bad development. Questionable talent. Things appeared to improve at least statistically from where he started. But the fault lines were always there when he ran up against well coached and reasonably talented Os.


I believe this is a watershed year. It will to a great extent demonstrate whether CJH can navigate the mess that CFB has become. I like him a lot but am under no delusions. What it takes to succeed as an HC today is radically different than when Saban saw the writing on the wall and retired.

Obviously DE is a big concern and putting all eggs in one basket was a significant mistake. Maybe they should have paid some of the guys who left? Or.... maybe Knowles has a different idea with plenty of "depth" to get the job done even if it is something different. Lots and lots of questions that can only be answered by how they play.
 
#53
#53
stolitonic said:
I also don't think this conversations started specific to Meerk (I could be wrong on that though as there are like 4/5 similar conversations going around the board lol) I would not have cared if we rolled him or George (or a 4th string "emergency" QB for that matter) out there after the Oklahoma game, but one of them needed to be on the field

There was no benefit to the season or the future of the Vols by rolling Joey out there those last 3-4 games. None. Well, other than protecting the precious 200 yd/g "streak" that nobody cared about

Quite frankly, if Heupel was so concerned that going 7-5 vs 8-4 would get him fired after last season, then he may wanna buckle up this year lol. Once again, we have a meat grinder schedule now with absolutely zero live game experience under center.
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There are always costs to any decision you make. Coaches do not do this often. Almost never unless the starter is stinking it up which Aguilar wasn't.

Have you thought about why?

The next big time QB they pursue (probably including Brandon) wants to know that if they earn the job then they get the opportunity to play and showcase their talent for the pros. What does punishing your starting QB because your DC sucks do to the trust your players want to have in your fairness?

Could they have worked one of the other guys in a few series here and there? Maybe. But if Merklinger or GM began to look like the heir apparent... what does that do to the decisions of Brandon or another potential QB considering the Vols?

I'm not arguing you are wrong necessarily. But there are significant risks and downsides.
 
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#54
#54
james_govols said:
oh-wow-you-dont-say.gif
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Great job!
 
#61
#61
DonDiego said:
So a question, let's say Brandon or George is a huge surprise and performs way above freshman expectations. The pieces and the talent are there on defense, and reports are that strength and conditioning is much improved. Those being the case, what would you put our win/loss numbers at?
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I think we still lack quality depth on the Dline still. But I agree the talent is there to be competitive with anyone in the country.
 
#62
#62
sjt18 said:
There are always costs to any decision you make. Coaches do not do this often. Almost never unless the starter is stinking it up which Aguilar wasn't.

Have you thought about why?

The next big time QB they pursue (probably including Brandon) wants to know that if they earn the job then they get the opportunity to play and showcase their talent for the pros. What does punishing your starting QB because your DC sucks do to the trust your players want to have in your fairness?

Could they have worked one of the other guys in a few series here and there? Maybe. But if Merklinger or GM began to look like the heir apparent... what does that do to the decisions of Brandon or another potential QB considering the Vols?

I'm not arguing you are wrong necessarily. But there are significant risks and downsides.
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Joey was a weird situation. You are right there.

Everyone knew though he was a one year emergency rental that basically came to us gift wrapped.

Good dude and good family.

But when the season was over (in reality if not in schedule), it was time to move on.

I don't think any recruits would have been put off by us having to deal with the Nico aftermath. One of the weirdest situations I have ever seen honestly in that we essentially traded QBs, saved a bunch of money, and still ended up about where we would have been if Nico stayed (he just was not and is not that good imho).
 
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#63
#63
The next three years will tell if CJH has the ability to win the big one or not.
 
#64
#64
stolitonic said:
Joey was a weird situation. You are right there.

Everyone knew though he was a one year emergency rental that basically came to us gift wrapped.

Good dude and good family.

But when the season was over (in reality if not in schedule), it was time to move on.

I don't think any recruits would have been put off by us having to deal with the Nico aftermath. One of the weirdest situations I have ever seen honestly in that we essentially traded QBs, saved a bunch of money, and still ended up about where we would have been if Nico stayed (he just was not and is not that good imho).
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I would argue that Nico would have been significantly worse than Aguilar. He wasn't good for the Vols. He might have been worse all things and competition included at UCLA.

I really like Heupel as a coach and a man. I think he's a good guy. Two knocks. One, he should never hired Banks or tolerated him as long as he did. Heupel should never tolerate a DC that doesn't challenge him and frequently beat him in scrimmage. The DC should be as good at his job as Heupel is as an offensive coach. The other more concerning one is that he's made some pretty big errors with players. It took a "fortunate" injury to Milton for Hooker to show out. They went all in on Nico. Same with Carter. Now with Coleman. I think he's done a much better job coaching players than choosing the right ones to coach.
 
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#65
#65
sjt18 said:
I would argue that Nico would have been significantly worse than Aguilar. He wasn't good for the Vols. He might have been worse all things and competition included at UCLA.

I really like Heupel as a coach and a man. I think he's a good guy. Two knocks. One, he should never hired Banks or tolerated him as long as he did. Heupel should never tolerate a DC that doesn't challenge him and frequently beat him in scrimmage. The DC should be as good at his job as Heupel is as an offensive coach. The other more concerning one is that he's made some pretty big errors with players. It took a "fortunate" injury to Milton for Hooker to show out. They went all in on Nico. Same with Carter. Now with Coleman. I think he's done a much better job coaching players than choosing the right ones to coach.
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Totally fair post imo. I still flinch every time I hear Heupel is a "QB whisperer." Far from it when you see how the Hooker/Milton thing along with Nico played out. Now two young inexperienced guys are going to force him to choose between them. Far from a QB guru. He's a great QB recruiter getting 5 stars like Nico and Faizon wearing orange but it pretty much ends there.
 
#67
#67
UTFranklinVol said:
I'm not a betting man but if I were I would bet heavily against the Vols making the playoff for one and only one reason, a brand new freshman QB is NOT getting us to the playoff.
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Didn’t a brand new freshman QB get us to our last playoff experience??
 
#68
#68
DonDiego said:
So a question, let's say Brandon or George is a huge surprise and performs way above freshman expectations. The pieces and the talent are there on defense, and reports are that strength and conditioning is much improved. Those being the case, what would you put our win/loss numbers at?
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I don’t think the QB’s have to overly perform. Nico didn’t set the world on fire, he simply kept the ship steady. They should have an elite run game to lean on just like they did with Sampson. If u can run the ball, you can control any game you play. It takes so much pressure off your QB & Defense.
 
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#69
#69
stolitonic said:
I also don't think this conversations started specific to Meerk (I could be wrong on that though as there are like 4/5 similar conversations going around the board lol) I would not have cared if we rolled him or George (or a 4th string "emergency" QB for that matter) out there after the Oklahoma game, but one of them needed to be on the field
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sjt18 said:
There are always costs to any decision you make. Coaches do not do this often. Almost never unless the starter is stinking it up which Aguilar wasn't.

Have you thought about why?
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Given that Aguilar tried to get another year, it's no stretch to think Heupel was aware late last season that Aguilar was gonna try. Given the current state of CFBs seemingly arbitrary eligibilty rulings, I don't fault Heupel for leaning into it and sticking with Aguilar if that's indeed the case.

Also as @sjt18 expounded on a little bit, you can't isolate the QB position in a vacuum and prepare for next year.

Hypothetical. Heupel went with Merk and/or G-Mac. Any combination of Brazzel slipping to 6th/7th/UDFA, Matthews/Staley transferring, Keys de-committing, etc.... A lot of the same people criticizing Heupel for sticking with Aguilar would be excoriating Heupel twice as much.
 
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#73
#73
TAF said:

Heupel could be "the" guy.​


NOT till he LEARNS how to "Manage The Game from the Sideline!"

*It's the "Elephant in the Room"...EVERYBODY has seen it EVERY Season...with NO REAL SENSE of Corrective Measures...

WHAT'S IT GONNA TAKE, Josh??!!
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Heupel has to show me somethings before I can put him in a category of a championship winning type coach...Game management....game decisions...having his teams ready out of the gate....second half scoring... discipline...team toughness. Year 6 at Tennessee and year 9 as a HC. Time to take the next step.
 
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#74
#74
You’re talking like they didn’t play SEC football in 2024. They did play Bama, UGA, Fla, & OU. This schedule isn’t any different than what UT has played for the last 3 decades. Only difference now is they play a 9th conference game. If you can play Bama, UGA, & Fla with a random west opponent for 20 plus years you can play Bama, Tamu, Texas, & LSU. (LSU finished with a worse record than UT last year). I’m not seeing some ridiculous jump in schedule.
 
#75
#75
UTFranklinVol said:
uh, no. Nico wasn't a true freshman and also Nico wasn't even close to the reason why we got to the playoff. in fact I'd say we got there in spite of him
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Uhh, yeah. GMac isn’t a true freshman either. It’s the same situation. The QB’s are inexperienced just like Nico was. Your’re also making my point for me. The point was that you can have success with a young QB if you have the pieces around him. UT has a top 5 SEC OL, top 3 SEC RB, & a top 5 SEC WR core. They literally made the playoffs with a guy that you just said wasn’t even close to the reason they made the playoffs. An argument can be made that the current offense has a better supporting cast than 2024 so why can’t they have success with a young QB??
 
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