Gun control debate (merged)

[C-south]

You really proved my point with this emotional rant ... You never offer any solutions.

Nothing emotional about it.

 

[BowlBrother85]

Nothing emotional about it.

So, you always talk like that? Then you're a loon.

 

[VOLS INC.]

Nothing emotional about it.

Amen.

If you are a Husband, a Father, etc. and you have any sense about you at all, you are prepared for the worst. Because the worst is currently being promoted as fine and well. Reasonable and rational people know better

 

[BowlBrother85]

You don't have a right to do anything with a car. Our founders gave us a way to change things. Use it. Until then piss off

You and your plethora of solutions ... LOL.

 

[85SugarVol]

Is it your position that having cops already on the scene of a school shooting is going to solve everything? Because there is recent evidence to the contrary. We can't do that today. Cops are fallible.

Multiple armed officers hung back during Florida school shooting, reports say

Parkland Officer Who Stayed Outside During Shooting Faces Criminal Charges (Published 2019)

^ The massacre at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Florida on February 14, 2018. ^

Texas top cop: Uvalde police could have ended rampage early on

^ The massacre at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas on May 24, 2022. ^

You didn’t answer mine, but I’ll still answer yours.

No, that is not my position.

A visible armed officer actually inside the school is part of it, but there is more that can be done.

Cops are employees, earning a paycheck. They are indeed fallible. And some of them are outright cowards - like the ones highlighted above.

There are 10’s of thousands of highly trained former servicemen and women in this country. Put out the call for those willing to protect our most vulnerable. They’ll answer.

Plain clothes. Concealed. They would compliment the visible armed officer at the door in this scenario. These wouldn’t be the “Rambos” so frequently referenced.

There are other things that can be done as well. Just takes money.

 

[C-south]

So, you always talk like that? Then you're a loon.

That’s a compliment from a dim nut job.

 

[BowlBrother85]

You didn’t answer mine, but I’ll still answer yours.

No, that is not my position.

A visible armed officer actually inside the school is part of it, but there is more that can be done.

Cops are employees, earning a paycheck. They are indeed fallible. And some of them are outright cowards - like the ones highlighted above.

There are 10’s of thousands of highly trained former servicemen and women in this country. Put out the call for those willing to protect our most vulnerable. They’ll answer.

Plain clothes. Concealed. They would compliment the visible armed officer at the door in this scenario. These wouldn’t be the “Rambos” so frequently referenced.

There are other things that can be done as well. Just takes money.

That's an understatement. It doesn't sound practical. Certainly not at every school ... and if you have seen documentaries on Virginia Tech from 2007 and Sandy Hook from 2012 ... these guys do their homework. They are in many cases better armed than people engaging them would be and they have thoroughly scouted their targets. I honestly don't think your suggestions would save any lives .... but at least you did offer some solutions - at least for school shootings. That is more than what we usually get from your like.

 

[C-south]

That's an understatement. It doesn't sound practical. Certainly not at every school ... and if you have seen documentaries on Virginia Tech from 2007 and Sandy Hook from 2012 ... these guys do their homework. They are in many cases better armed than people engaging them would be and they have thoroughly scouted their targets. I honestly don't think your suggestions would save any lives .... but at least you did offer some solutions - at least for school shootings. That is more than what we usually get from your like.

What is your solution without amending the constitution or violating law abiding citizens rights? I’m sure you’ll have a “reasonable compromise“.

 

[85SugarVol]

That's an understatement. It doesn't sound practical. Certainly not at every school ... and if you have seen documentaries on Virginia Tech from 2007 and Sandy Hook from 2012 ... these guys do their homework. They are in many cases better armed than people engaging them would be and they have thoroughly scouted their targets. I honestly don't think your suggestions would save any lives .... but at least you did offer some solutions - at least for school shootings. That is more than what we usually get from your like.

Money. That’s what you’re going to challenge as to why it won’t work? That’s sad.

And your cries about them being “out gunned” is laughable.
Give me a trained individual who is honestly there to protect children and you can arm them with a .32 revolver. I’ll take them over the “crazy” that picked up the scary assault weapon every time.

Hell, if all that stood between 20 schoolchildren and an armed madman was Luther with a revolver - I’ll take Luther with the revolver over nothing.

Look in the mirror with your accusations of only talking about why something won’t work.

 

[BowlBrother85]

Money. That’s what you’re going to challenge as to why it won’t work? That’s sad.

Who is going to pay for it? If you don't think that's an issue, then you're naive.

And your cries about them being “out gunned” is laughable.

That really depends on what you are talking about allocating, in terms of personnel and tactical equipment.

 

[joevol33]

Who is going to pay for it? If you don't think that's an issue, then you're naive.

That really depends on what you are talking about allocating, in terms of personnel and tactical equipment.

I wonder how many we could have paid to guard our schools with those billions we sent Ukraine? That's one of many examples, our government has always crapped on us, while funding ignorance in other countries. Heck, their stupid COVID stimulus gave millions to Muslim countries for gender studies . There's plenty of money to put into protecting our kids, but the government rather send it elsewhere.

 

[85SugarVol]

Who is going to pay for it? If you don't think that's an issue, then you're naive.

That really depends on what you are talking about allocating, in terms of personnel and tactical equipment.

Money? How much is it going to cost to station an officer at every school? Put a number on it for everyone to see.

It’s not about the tools allocated. It’s about the person wielding the tool.

And wth are you talking about tactical equipment?

 

[85SugarVol]

I wonder how many we could have paid to guard our schools with those billions we sent Ukraine? That's one of many examples, our government has always crapped on us, while funding ignorance in other countries. Heck, their stupid COVID stimulus gave millions to Muslim countries for gender studies . There's plenty of money to put into protecting our kids, but the government rather send it elsewhere.

San Francisco wants to pay $Billions in reparations. Let their politicians tell everyone they have money for that, but no money to protect schools.

I doubt they would alter course. But at least they would be on record.

 

[BowlBrother85]

Money? How much is it going to cost to station an officer at every school? Put a number on it for everyone to see.

It’s not about the tools allocated. It’s about the person wielding the tool.

And wth are you talking about tactical equipment?

You think you're taking down the Virginia Tech guy before he gets some shots off? He was wearing a tactical covert vest and was carrying grenades. He killed 33 people. You seem naive on this. The guys who pull these school shootings off aren't acting on a whim. They have been preparing for months in advance and scouting out locations to attack. You are grossly underestimating the threat.

 

[BowlBrother85]

It’s not about the tools allocated. It’s about the person wielding the tool.

And that's naive as well.

 

[85SugarVol]

You think you're taking down the Virginia Tech guy before he gets some shots off? He was wearing a tactical covert vest and was carrying grenades. He killed 33 people. You seem naive on this. The guys who pull these school shootings off aren't acting on a whim. They have been preparing for months in advance and scouting out locations to attack. You are grossly underestimating the threat.

And that's naive as well.

You’re the one showing blatant ignorance with regard to firearms. Yes, it is 100% about the person wielding the tool.

And the VT shooter killed all those people with a couple of handguns.

The point of the armed presence is to act as a deterrence. It reduces the likelihood that the school is attacked.

All you people care about is reducing the lethality of the next attack.

 

[BowlBrother85]

You’re the one showing blatant ignorance with regard to firearms. Yes, it is 100% about the person wielding the tool.

LOL. That is dumb.

The point of the armed presence is to act as a deterrence. It reduces the likelihood that the school is attacked.

Did it deter the Parkland shooter? Nope.

And the VT shooter killed all those people with a couple of handguns.

He was also carrying grenades and had a tactical vest.

All you people care about is reducing the lethality of the next attack.

All you people care about is having the option of buying any type of gun you want.

... and look at the Mandalay Bay shooter ... Stephen Paddock. Deadliest mass shooting ever. How were you gonna stop that? You weren't. He brought enough firepower into that hotel room to invade Cuba.

 

[whodeycin85]

@BowlBrother85
You brought up parkland a few times, do you know how many school shooting in Florida since parkland? And do you know what changed?

 

[GroverCleveland]

That's an understatement. It doesn't sound practical. Certainly not at every school ... and if you have seen documentaries on Virginia Tech from 2007 and Sandy Hook from 2012 ... these guys do their homework. They are in many cases better armed than people engaging them would be and they have thoroughly scouted their targets. I honestly don't think your suggestions would save any lives .... but at least you did offer some solutions - at least for school shootings. That is more than what we usually get from your like.

There is zero, repeat zero, evidence any of these loonies hit a hard target. In fact, all the evidence I have ever seen is that these were selected precisely because they were soft targets.

The best protection is actually unidentified, armed personnel, random numbers of personnel rotating between sites. The known (there are armed defenders) and the unknown (not easily identifiable) combined are our friends.

 

[GroverCleveland]

And that's naive as well.

Note to self: Never, ever hire BB85 for a threat/risk assessment.

 

[GroverCleveland]

LOL. That is dumb.

Did it deter the Parkland shooter? Nope.

He was also carrying grenades and had a tactical vest.

All you people care about is having the option of buying any type of gun you want.

... and look at the Mandalay Bay shooter ... Stephen Paddock. Deadliest mass shooting ever. How were you gonna stop that? You weren't. He brought enough firepower into that hotel room to invade Cuba.

where are you getting the VT shooter had hand grenades? Those are highly illegal. Where did he supposedly get them because whoever provided them to him should be under a jail somewhere.

 

[InVOLuntary]

Is it your position that having cops already on the scene of a school shooting is going to solve everything? Because there is recent evidence to the contrary. We can't do that today. Cops are fallible.

Multiple armed officers hung back during Florida school shooting, reports say

Parkland Officer Who Stayed Outside During Shooting Faces Criminal Charges (Published 2019)

^ The massacre at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Florida on February 14, 2018. ^

Texas top cop: Uvalde police could have ended rampage early on

^ The massacre at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas on May 24, 2022. ^

So what you're saying is to not depend on police for your personal protection and you should be prepared to protect yourself by carrying a firearm.

 

[K-town Vol Fan]

Still not understanding our guaranteed rights I see

This is what's dumbfounding about republicans. Y'all are the party always screaming about pro-life and protect our children and banning everything that hurts children....but when it comes to innocent people being murdered you don't actually care. "Well it's our guaranteed right so just pray and hope it goes away." You don't care. You value your stupid right to own a gun over innocent lives being taken.

 

[GroverCleveland]

This is what's dumbfounding about republicans. Y'all are the party always screaming about pro-life and protect our children and banning everything that hurts children....but when it comes to innocent people being murdered you don't actually care. "Well it's our guaranteed right so just pray and hope it goes away." You don't care. You value your stupid right to own a gun over innocent lives being taken.

This is a blatant lie. What confuses you and others on here is we have a better grasp of what the real problem is and how to go about solving it. We repeatedly provide those solutions, but the emotional responses many of you have towards guns or the proposed solutions does not seem to allow you to consider the tangible benefit of those proposals.

 

[C-south]

This is what's dumbfounding about republicans. Y'all are the party always screaming about pro-life and protect our children and banning everything that hurts children....but when it comes to innocent people being murdered you don't actually care. "Well it's our guaranteed right so just pray and hope it goes away." You don't care. You value your stupid right to own a gun over innocent lives being taken.

Even more dumbfounding is how looney leftists like yourself coddle lunacy, mental illness, and are soft on criminals. More laws but refuse to enforce the ones now. I’m sure if marijuana was illegal you’d just quit.