Everything evolves around making some open shots

#1
wmcovol

wmcovol

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#1
Vols got good looks again Sat night (just like vs Miss St) but this time knocked them down. The offense ran much better due to hitting some open 3s. And the team didn’t convert to simply shooting 3s exclusively either. They stayed in their offense the entire game. Best game since Missouri I
 
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#2
#2
Surprising how making gasket makes an offense look good! Making the three makes the rest of the game open up. I think we have good shooters, but sometimes they just don’t show up. But Springer, helping with the point really increases the flow of the offense. Vescovi is a pure shooting guard-his flaws at point are obvious.
 
#3
#3
Dr H Lecter said:
Surprising how making gasket makes an offense look good! Making the three makes the rest of the game open up. I think we have good shooters, but sometimes they just don’t show up. But Springer, helping with the point really increases the flow of the offense. Vescovi is a pure shooting guard-his flaws at point are obvious.
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Vescovi played 30+ minutes, had 1 turnover and +\- of +20 something but I guess he could play better.
 
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#4
#4
Rotation of 2 freshman guards starting then bringing Bailey ,James And Nkamouh off bench was nice. Bless Anosike’s heart he ain’t read. #13 needs to continue to take shots.....nice to see the shots drop
 
#6
#6
Everything is easier when you make a few baskets. You have that extra spring in your step.
 
#8
#8
If we can be a top 20 team offensively then were an elite team with our defense. Probably top 5 imo
 
#9
#9
Dr H Lecter said:
Surprising how making gasket makes an offense look good! Making the three makes the rest of the game open up. I think we have good shooters, but sometimes they just don’t show up. But Springer, helping with the point really increases the flow of the offense. Vescovi is a pure shooting guard-his flaws at point are obvious.
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I’m not trashing Vascovi, or at least I was not trying too. In fact, I love his play when the pressure of being point and not running the offense is on his shoulders. I actually think he’s very effective otherwise and like his game.
 
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#13
#13
Nope, when the games on the line, the other team is locked in defensively, and the refs swallow the whistle you have to have someone that can get you a basket. We don't have that guy. Johnson is the closest one to being that but he isn't there yet.
 
#14
#14
ColinS said:
Nope, when the games on the line, the other team is locked in defensively, and the refs swallow the whistle you have to have someone that can get you a basket. We don't have that guy. Johnson is the closest one to being that but he isn't there yet.
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Or somebody that can make 2 out of 3 free throws like that guy from Purdue.
 
#15
#15
ColinS said:
Nope, when the games on the line, the other team is locked in defensively, and the refs swallow the whistle you have to have someone that can get you a basket. We don't have that guy. Johnson is the closest one to being that but he isn't there yet.
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It’s a positive and a negative, opposing teams don’t know who to lean towards and shade a double like the did grant and therefore we end up with a good look usually, the negative is that we don’t have someone demanding it in that timeframe. I still like ball running through Fulk’s hands there, if Johnson can’t be trusted to hit FT it’s scary dialing it up for him.
 
#16
#16
ColinS said:
Nope, when the games on the line, the other team is locked in defensively, and the refs swallow the whistle you have to have someone that can get you a basket. We don't have that guy. Johnson is the closest one to being that but he isn't there yet.
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Before last night the board was saying Springer was that guy - what changed ?
 
#18
#18
zjcvols said:
What about now
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We have no one that can consistently take their man off the dribble and get to the basket and finish. We have no one that can back their man down into the paint and get an easy bucket. Nearly every shot we make is from outside 5 feet. Our "bigs" rely on fadeaways, jump-hooks, and mid-range jumpers. Our guards rely on outside jumpers and mid-range jumpers. I don't know that I've ever seen a team that just struggled to score around the basket as much as this bunch.

We heard all about how we were going to play fast and push tempo with this group, and we just refuse to do it. So, if that is the change our offense needs, it has needed it all year. We just are not going to outscore good teams in the halfcourt. We don't have a Grant Williams that owns the paint. We don't have an Admiral Schofield who can beat his man off the dribble. We don't have a Jordan Bone who can get to the rim at will. So our ability to score is almost entirely predicated on making difficult/low percentage shots. If we are shooting above our average, our defense is good enough to result in blowouts. If we shoot like we did, last night, our defense is good enough to stay in games with bad teams (Ole Miss), but not against more talented teams (Bama, Florida). Turnovers are also becoming a bigger issue.

So, I'm not sure our offense is broken. I just think our offensive philosophy that worked so well two years ago doesn't seem to mesh with the personnel we currently have. We seem to want to be a slow-paced, methodical, halfcourt offense, but our personnel doesn't seem like a fit for that.
 
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#19
#19
walkenvol said:
Before last night the board was saying Springer was that guy - what changed ?
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Springer played his worst game as a Vol. Ole Miss got very physical with him, perhaps to the point of fouls occurring that weren't called, and it frustrated him. He will have to grow from that and not let it affect him. He was visibly frustrated.
 
#20
#20
bleedingTNorange said:
It’s a positive and a negative, opposing teams don’t know who to lean towards and shade a double like the did grant and therefore we end up with a good look usually, the negative is that we don’t have someone demanding it in that timeframe. I still like ball running through Fulk’s hands there, if Johnson can’t be trusted to hit FT it’s scary dialing it up for him.
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I'm sorry, but this "egalitarian offense is a good thing" is such a dated and horrible take. In theory it sounds awesome, but in application it falls short. It's the football equivalent of saying "we don't have one starting QB, we have 2 that will play". All that means is they both aren't very good. Basketball is a game of studs now and has been for quite some time.

The opposition doesn't know who to lean to or shade is because they don't have to lean or shade towards anybody. They can play their base defense and play everyone straight up, which is much less stressful for a defense than having to worry about having to stop a stud, when to send the double, what your rotations are on a kick out from the double, etc.

Now apply that to this current roster. We don't have enough lethal shooters to warrant never leaving them and our best outside shooter has a slower set shot which allows time for recovery. Then we insist on typically having 2 of Fulky, Pons, ORN on the floor. Well neither of those guys are good enough on the block to warrant playing through them consistently, and 2 of those 3 are absolute non-factors from 3, which kills spacing and driving lanes and allows their man to just sag off them. Other than Springer and Keon, nobody looks to drive and score at the rim, but then again, we have people sagging off our non-shooters anyway.

The motion offense is dated and stale and our personnel really isn't a great match for it anyway. Sure we are going to have some games we hit shots, but far too often it's been shut down and stagnate. Especially for a team that is perceived as good as this one.
 
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#21
#21
Tonight was the second or 3rd time this year, and the first with Springer playing that it seemed like EVERYONE went into a shell at the same time and no one stepped up to be the guy to get them through. KJ was the only one that tried but he wasn't delivering enough. Making moves to the basket is great but if you don't finish it doesn't really help and it doesn't help if you don't hit FTs. We simply cannot have everyone collectively suck like that.

If you want a bright side.....we played like dog crap for the final 8:00 or so and still almost won. Granted OM isn't a good team and they weren't playing that well either so if they had been on it would have turned into another UF beatdown. But it's frustrating that as bad as we were playing we still the game right there to win yet nobody stepped up enough.
 
#22
#22
Vols8086 said:
I'm sorry, but this "egalitarian offense is a good thing" is such a dated and horrible take. In theory it sounds awesome, but in application it falls short. It's the football equivalent of saying "we don't have one starting QB, we have 2 that will play". All that means is they both aren't very good. Basketball is a game of studs now and has been for quite some time.

The opposition doesn't know who to lean to or shade is because they don't have to lean or shade towards anybody. They can play their base defense and play everyone straight up, which is much less stressful for a defense than having to worry about having to stop a stud, when to send the double, what your rotations are on a kick out from the double, etc.

Now apply that to this current roster. We don't have enough lethal shooters to warrant never leaving them and our best outside shooter has a slower set shot which allows time for recovery. Then we insist on typically having 2 of Fulky, Pons, ORN on the floor. Well neither of those guys are good enough on the block to warrant playing through them consistently, and 2 of those 3 are absolute non-factors from 3, which kills spacing and driving lanes and allows their man to just sag off them. Other than Springer and Keon, nobody looks to drive and score at the rim, but then again, we have people sagging off our non-shooters anyway.

The motion offense is dated and stale and our personnel really isn't a great match for it anyway. Sure we are going to have some games we hit shots, but far too often it's been shut down and stagnate. Especially for a team that is perceived as good as this one.
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Again, as crappy as the offense might’ve looked, take care of the ball and hit free throws and not only do we win but it’s a pretty respectable offensive showing.

For some reason it seems in games we shoot poorly we also turn it over and can’t hit free throws, bad combo.
 
#23
#23
bleedingTNorange said:
Again, as crappy as the offense might’ve looked, take care of the ball and hit free throws and not only do we win but it’s a pretty respectable offensive showing.

For some reason it seems in games we shoot poorly we also turn it over and can’t hit free throws, bad combo.
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We missed 6 free throws and they missed 5. Sure, hit all your free throws, but it's not like Ole Miss killed it from the line and we didn't and that was the difference. Hell, we had one more made free throw than they had last night.

Did you know Ole Miss had more turnovers last night than us?

Yes hit our FT's and we win. But had we hit all of our FT's, beating Ole Miss by 4 isn't exactly a "pretty respectable offensive showing". That's burying your head in the sand when it seems painfully obvious there are bigger issues on offense. Well, big issues if we think this team is making it past the opening weekend of March Madness.
 
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#24
#24
bleedingTNorange said:
Again, as crappy as the offense might’ve looked, take care of the ball and hit free throws and not only do we win but it’s a pretty respectable offensive showing.
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That's it. Turnovers have become a recent issue. Our defense is good enough to keep us in most games if the offense fails to show up against bad teams, but you can't have as many TOs as made baskets and expect to beat even bad teams shooting like we did (from the field or the line). Our failures in that department and at the FT line allowed us to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

Just to put last night's level of offensive ineptitude into perspective...
•We had an 11-point lead with 14 minutes to play in a game that featured a point total of 102.
•We made two shots from the field in the final 15 minutes. Two shots!!!
•We only hits three 2-pt shots in the entire 2nd half.
•We scored 0 points in transition.
 
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#25
#25
Vols8086 said:
We missed 6 free throws and they missed 5. Sure, hit all your free throws, but it's not like Ole Miss killed it from the line and we didn't and that was the difference. Hell, we had one more made free throw than they had last night.

Did you know Ole Miss had more turnovers last night than us?

Yes hit our FT's and we win. But had we hit all of our FT's, beating Ole Miss by 4 isn't exactly a "pretty respectable offensive showing". That's burying your head in the sand when it seems painfully obvious there are bigger issues on offense. Well, big issues if we think this team is making it past the opening weekend of March Madness.
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I’m not comparing what OM did, that has nothing to do with it...if we have 11 turnovers like our average and we hit our free throws you’re talking another 10-12 points. On the surface that’s not a great offensive showing with 60-62 points, but considering PPP that would be close to 1.0ppp which is solid.
 
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