Coronavirus (No politics)

SCRocket

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What does this have have to do with what I said? They are using the crisis. We lost almost 13,000 in 2017 from the flu and an estimated 360,000 worldwide, where was the panic then?
Me thinks that you don’t really understand the difference between this virus and the flu. I suggest doing more research.
 

MarcoVol

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I never said it was about Dem/Reb. But yes there are wealthy socialist elites all over the world that would love to knock the U.S. down a peg and turn the U.S. into another socialist failure and unfortunately the Democrats would too. The easiest way is thru healthcare. Trillions have now been lost in 401k’s and such which includes retirees. The administration has no choice at this point but to follow orders. We will look back one day and say wth happened to America. Answer, we gave up our freedoms and liberties over misinformation and panic. After this is over in a few weeks, there will be another crisis while the criticism of the administration will intensify.
This just isn’t true. You’re grouping ALL dems in with Bernie’s plan. And AOC and some of the other dems who are much farther left than most. They may be loud, but they’re not the majority. That’s why you’re seeing now with Biden taking over the polls when head to head against Bernie.

Unless you think Biden wants the US to be socialist?

You seemed to jump from topic to topic in your post, but I’ll address the rest:

Trillions lost? Fact. And of course it includes retirees - it includes EVERYBODY. And if you believe the media made that happen then ok. We disagree there. Now, of course they sensationalize. It’s a business and they’re trying to get clicks/viewers. Just like Fox News on the other side of it. They literally all do it.

Who is it the WH is taking their orders from? No idea what you mean there. But if you think POTUS is taking orders from anyone, you cray. Trump does what Trump wants. Dems hate it and Repubs brag about it. So I find it hard to believe he now is taking orders.

Sure, there will eventually be another crisis of some kind. And the media will scrutinize. But it happens on both sides. Ever flip on Fox News during Obama’s presidency? Goes both ways.
 
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xavierbballfan

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Yes.

If you're going to use pure stats to scare people, they need context. More people died from TB yesterday than coronavirus. Are you upset about that?
It's upsetting as well. Human suffering is bad. The TB deaths are out of context though and a false equivalency given how long TB has been around and the much higher amount of exposures that have occurred. Ask a historian if native americans should have ideally been more casual about smallpox 3 weeks into their epidemic because only a few people had died at that point.
 
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BigBadVol

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Me thinks that you don’t really understand the difference between this virus and the flu. I suggest doing more research.
This is not a flu variant. I get it but they can be compared. My point was about the number of deaths. Nobody is talking about how mild this is to those that aren't health compromised in some way. The reaction to this is way overblown.
 
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xavierbballfan

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This is not a flu variant. I get it but they can be compared. My point was about the number of deaths. Nobody is talking about how mild this is to those that aren't health compromised in some way. The reaction to this is way overblown.
I disagree that approximately 10% of cases in Italy requiring ICU care is no big deal.
 
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ButchPlz

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It's upsetting as well. Human suffering is bad. The TB deaths are out of context though and a false equivalency given how long TB has been around and the much higher amount of exposures that have occurred. Ask a historian if native americans should have ideally been more casual about smallpox 3 weeks into their epidemic because only a few people had died at that point.
Pandemics, epidemics, outbreaks, they've always happened. It's not sad. It's nature.

No matter what we're better positioned now to deal with it than anywhere else. But this has been around months, and a few thousand people have died. We're not looking at the Black Plague. We're also definitely not talking about smallpox. That's a worse false comparison than I would ever make, and is why we have panic.
 
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xavierbballfan

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Pandemics, epidemics, outbreaks, they've always happened. It's not sad. It's nature.

No matter what we're better positioned now to deal with it than anywhere else. But this has been around months, and a few thousand people have died. We're not looking at the Black Plague. We're also definitely not talking about smallpox. That's a worse false comparison than I would ever make, and is why we have panic.
It isn't the black plague or small pox. I agree. I would ask, though, what level would be acceptable to care at? Or should we not attempt to mitigate disease?

Also, just because there has been someone infected several months ago which is very likely, is not the same as a disease which has spread through the entire country and the result of that.

Panic is bad, the current public health measures being taken are not an overreaction. The news coverage is sensationalist as it has been before this disease arrived in the US.
 

ButchPlz

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It isn't the black plague or small pox. I agree. I would ask, though, what level would be acceptable to care at? Or should we not attempt to mitigate disease?

Also, just because there has been someone infected several months ago which is very likely, is not the same as a disease which has spread through the entire country and the result of that.

Panic is bad, the current public health measures being taken are not an overreaction. The news coverage is sensationalist as it has been before this disease arrived in the US.
Your last point has been my point the whole time, so I'm not sure why you chose to call me out. Numbers alone are very misleading. Saying 300 some people in Italy sounds bad. Saying 300 some elderly people in a cluster of the disease died, ignoring that Japan just announced hundreds fully recovered and most countries with more stable health systems have a way lower rate is, almost by definition, sensationalist.

I have a lot of sympathy for people. But you know who I have much more sympathy for? My wife, and my coworkers, and my immediate neighbors, who are having their businesses and livelihooods crushed because 350 elderly Italians died of a disease that isn't killing most people. Why do they matter more than the people closest to me?
 
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Orangeredblooded

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Your last point has been my point the whole time, so I'm not sure why you chose to call me out. Numbers alone are very misleading. Saying 300 some people in Italy sounds bad. Saying 300 some elderly people in a cluster of the disease died, ignoring that Japan just announced hundreds fully recovered and most countries with more stable health systems have a way lower rate is, almost by definition, sensationalist.

I have a lot of sympathy for people. But you know who I have much more sympathy for? My wife, and my coworkers, and my immediate neighbors, who are having their businesses and livelihooods crushed because 350 elderly Italians died of a disease that isn't killing most people. Why do they matter more than the people closest to me?
In a way you’re right. All of us worry about our inter circle (all of which you listed), What happens when it trickles down, will you care then? Sure you will. It’s all about trying to slow it before it gets to when you care.
 

xavierbballfan

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Your last point has been my point the whole time, so I'm not sure why you chose to call me out. Numbers alone are very misleading. Saying 300 some people in Italy sounds bad. Saying 300 some elderly people in a cluster of the disease died, ignoring that Japan just announced hundreds fully recovered and most countries with more stable health systems have a way lower rate is, almost by definition, sensationalist.

I have a lot of sympathy for people. But you know who I have much more sympathy for? My wife, and my coworkers, and my immediate neighbors, who are having their businesses and livelihooods crushed because 350 elderly Italians died of a disease that isn't killing most people. Why do they matter more than the people closest to me?
Having more sympathy for people closest to you is natural. I don't fault anyone for that. I just believe and the data supports public health mitigation strategies to keep all of our friends an family safe.

The impact on our economy and businesses is not to be taken lightly. The economic impact is going to be severe as well.

I don't think Italy's numbers can be completely discounted though. They have more ICU beds per capital than we do currently.

Optimally we will all find ways to unify under the common goal of getting the US through this in the best way possible.
 

kiddiedoc

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From the front lines:

The world of medicine in the US has literally been flipped on its head in the span of 48-72 hours. The story in Europe is VERY concerning, as are early numbers here. My friends in surgery and anesthesia tell how hospitals are preparing for what is almost certain to come. New guidelines for patient care make my office look unrecognizable from last week. We've now sent our first tests, which are readily available. People are stressed, anxious, and worried.

I know that everyone has their own opinions, most seemingly in one extreme or the other. Please know that the burden on our healthcare system and economy is, or is about to be HUGE.

I really believe the best courses of action right now are to stay home when possible, avoid crowds, maintain good hygiene, be understanding and respectful of others and of the guidance from healthcare providers/authorities, and use good common sense.

There's no conspiracy. This is not biowarfare. The virus doesn't draw party lines. Protect your neighbors and especially our elderly and frail population. Band together, and we will get through this.
 

DynaLo

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From the front lines:

The world of medicine in the US has literally been flipped on its head in the span of 48-72 hours. The story in Europe is VERY concerning, as are early numbers here. My friends in surgery and anesthesia tell how hospitals are preparing for what is almost certain to come. New guidelines for patient care make my office look unrecognizable from last week. We've now sent our first tests, which are readily available. People are stressed, anxious, and worried.

I know that everyone has their own opinions, most seemingly in one extreme or the other. Please know that the burden on our healthcare system and economy is, or is about to be HUGE.

I really believe the best courses of action right now are to stay home when possible, avoid crowds, maintain good hygiene, be understanding and respectful of others and of the guidance from healthcare providers/authorities, and use good common sense.

There's no conspiracy. This is not biowarfare. The virus doesn't draw party lines. Protect your neighbors and especially our elderly and frail population. Band together, and we will get through this.
Thank you for the update Doc. Stay safe and please update us as you can.
 

DynaLo

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Will do. It's been a crazy day. Everyone is just coming to grips with what will be the new "normal" for a while.
Unfortunately I think crazy is just getting started for our medical professionals and that new normal may yet go further south. Our society isn’t psychologically ready for this and the panic is going to be crushing to y’all😟
 

kiddiedoc

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Unfortunately I think crazy is just getting started for our medical professionals and that new normal may yet go further south. Our society isn’t psychologically ready for this and the panic is going to be crushing to y’all😟
We are all feeling it. The uncertainty is the hardest part. That's why anything we can do to limit the spread of infection is so important.

We don't want a national crisis here, with ventilator rationing and overwhelmed hospitals. If everyone will just err on the side of caution, it will most certainly help. Don't panic, but be smart.
 

DynaLo

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I’m having the discussion with my youngest tomorrow about my at risk granddaughter just coming and staying with me since she’s here with school out and mom working anyhow. I’m just not comfortable about her mom’s retail job and the exposure potential to both myself and the grand with the constant coming and going in and out.
 

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