CJH > Kiffin

#26

joevol33

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#26
You're making stuff up. No one compares Kiffin to Saban. Lmao. You're just trying to stir the pot, I see lol.
You literally just did in what I quoted you. You said if we count the NFL, then saban isn't good, like you're taking up for Kiffin. Seriously, go read your first post I quoted, I didn't make anything up, I responded to what YOU said.
 
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#27

thehardknoxlife

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#27
You literally just did in what I quoted you. You said if we count the NFL, then saban isn't good, like you're taking up for Kiffin. Seriously, go read your first post I quoted, I didn't make anything up, I responded to what YOU said.
Bro. Comprehension is hard I guess. To make it clear to you. I compared Saban to your analogy of NFL coaching, not to Kiffin. Like wut?
 
#29

VolArmy74

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#29
Why don’t we throw out his USC stats too, since he was under sanctions and such, and his time there really wasn’t an accurate reflection on his true abilities.
He inherited something like 30 future NFL players at USC from stacked top 4 classes, USC was loaded while he was there. The sanctions harmed Sarkisian, not Kiffin, the smaller classes were freshman and redshirt freshmen/sophomores Kiffin's last year there. Even those short classes were still top 10 nationally and top 2 in the Pac 10.
 
#30

VFL-82-JP

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#30
I don't think you can call anyone a fraud who has only had one losing season his entire career. He's 70-40, that's pretty darn good. A snake, sure. A fraud, not so much.
Oakland 2007 -- 4-12
Oakland 2008 -- tbh, he didn't get through even half the season before being fired, so let's skip this one (but 1-3)
Vols 2009 -- 7-6
USCw 2012 -- 7-6
USCw 2013 -- again, fired less than halfway through the season, but for the record, 3-2
FAU 2018 -- 5-7
Ole Miss 2020 -- 5-5

So when you say "only one losing season" you are so barely, technically right. As long you only count college jobs, not NFL. And as long as you ignore that a 5-5 season, as well as a 7-6 and another 7-6 are all a sneeze above a losing season but yep, not actually losing. And as long as you don't count those years he got fired against him.

So if you squint your eyes really super tight so you can pretend to ignore all the crap littering his career, yep. You're right. Just one losing season.

He must be awesome. :)
 
#31

joevol33

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#31
Bro. Comprehension is hard I guess. To make it clear to you. I compared Saban to your analogy of NFL coaching, not to Kiffin. Like wut?
I responded to your NFL claim, not you responding to anything I said about the NFL. Maybe go back and read from the start. Either way, Kiffin isn't that great of a coach, he's a good offensive guy, but not a great head coach. That's the point.
 
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#34

thehardknoxlife

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#34
I responded to your NFL claim, not you responding to anything I said about the NFL. Maybe go back and read from the start. Either way, Kiffin isn't that great of a coach, he's a good offensive guy, but not a great head coach. That's the point.
Oakland 2007 -- 4-12
Oakland 2008 -- tbh, he didn't get through even half the season before being fired, so let's skip this one (but 1-3)
Vols 2009 -- 7-6
USCw 2012 -- 7-6
USCw 2013 -- again, fired less than halfway through the season, but for the record, 3-2
FAU 2018 -- 5-7
Ole Miss 2020 -- 5-5

So when you say "only one losing season" you are so barely, technically right. As long you only count college jobs, not NFL. And as long as you ignore that a 5-5 season, as well as a 7-6 and another 7-6 are all a sneeze above a losing season but yep, not actually losing. And as long as you don't count those years he got fired against him.

So if you squint your eyes really super tight so you can pretend to ignore all the crap littering his career, yep. You're right. Just one losing season.

He must be awesome. :)
Don't forget to include the 70-40 record. I'm not even a fan of Kiffin, but I am a realist, and I won't let my personal dislike reflect someone's credentials. If he sucks so bad, I wonder why he keeps getting good jobs. I guess you guys know better than the people in charge of the millions they pay him.
 
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#36

Fightmaker

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#36
He inherited something like 30 future NFL players at USC from stacked top 4 classes, USC was loaded while he was there. The sanctions harmed Sarkisian, not Kiffin, the smaller classes were freshman and redshirt freshmen/sophomores Kiffin's last year there. Even those short classes were still top 10 nationally and top 2 in the Pac 10.
I know, I was being sarcastic. Someone on here posted last week that one of the things that proved Kiffin is a great coach was that he took that team to a number 1 ranking. I didn’t bring up what happened to that ranking. But I was just illustrating the lengths that his believers will go to in order to defend that man. It’s a very bizarre thing to me.
 
#37

VFL-82-JP

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#37
Don't forget to include the 70-40 record. I'm not even a fan of Kiffin, but I am a realist, and I won't let my personal dislike reflect someone's credentials. If he sucks so bad, I wonder why he keeps getting good jobs. I guess you guys know better than the people in charge of the millions they pay him.
I'm just clarifying precisely what's hidden behind "only one losing season." BTW, if you include NFL (which you should, to get the man's whole career), it's 75-55.
 
#38

thehardknoxlife

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#38
I'm just clarifying precisely what's hidden behind "only one losing season." BTW, if you include NFL (which you should, to get the man's whole career), it's 75-55.
I mean, only one losing season is a pretty clear statement, but sure. It's funny you guys wanna throw the NFL seasons in because that's the only way to make him look bad even though thats doesnt affect college coaching AT ALL.
 
#39

Fightmaker

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#39
Don't forget to include the 70-40 record. I'm not even a fan of Kiffin, but I am a realist, and I won't let my personal dislike reflect someone's credentials. If he sucks so bad, I wonder why he keeps getting good jobs. I guess you guys know better than the people in charge of the millions they pay him.
How many games had Phillip Fulmer won by the time he lost 40 games? Or Spurrier? Or Bowden? Or fill in the blank.
 
#41

thehardknoxlife

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#41
How many games had Phillip Fulmer won by the time he lost 40 games? Or Spurrier? Or Bowden? Or fill in the blank.
Im not comapring him to any of those. I'm just stating he's a good coach despite what you guys try to make him out to be. Numbers don't lie, he wins.

Funny you mention Fulmer. A lot of UT people would say he's a terrible coach.
 
#42

DERELICK_MY_VOLS

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#42
Next week we should field a team with all the players that were not dressed today against Ole Miss. With that said Heupel is 2-0 vs Kiffin head to head. The foot gas pedal will not be off from start to finish. We have a legit solid defense….they field bodies as space takers. They got beat up by Alabama then an emotional track race from start to finish today.

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BUT….
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#43

VFL-82-JP

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#43
I mean, only one losing season is a pretty clear statement, but sure. It's funny you guys wanna throw the NFL seasons in because that's the only way to make him look bad even though thats doesnt affect college coaching AT ALL.
Dude, did you really look at post #30? I mean, read it line by line?

Almost his entire career looks bad, except those three years at a G5 school.
 
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#45

Fightmaker

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#45
Im not comapring him to any of those. I'm just stating he's a good coach despite what you guys try to make him out to be. Numbers don't lie, he wins.

Funny you mention Fulmer. A lot of UT people would say he's a terrible coach.
Fulmer is something like 150-50 give or take. We are only talking about records, and not opinions. By the time Kiffin gets to 150 wins, he’ll have twice that many losses. I just don’t feel like a 70-40 record is anything to write home about. Butch Jones, by comparison, is 85-59, which Kiffin is on pace with. I think saying that Kiffin=Butch is a pretty close estimate.
 
#46

24/7vol

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#46
Don't forget to include the 70-40 record. I'm not even a fan of Kiffin, but I am a realist, and I won't let my personal dislike reflect someone's credentials. If he sucks so bad, I wonder why he keeps getting good jobs. I guess you guys know better than the people in charge of the millions they pay him.
.636 winning percentage Hype I believe is 32-10 for a .765 winning percentage. No matter what happens Saturday I'll take Hype.
 
#47

hUTch2002

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#47
Don't forget to include the 70-40 record. I'm not even a fan of Kiffin, but I am a realist, and I won't let my personal dislike reflect someone's credentials. If he sucks so bad, I wonder why he keeps getting good jobs. I guess you guys know better than the people in charge of the millions they pay him.
After USC he hasn’t really gotten good jobs, at least not as a HC. He had to go back to being a coordinator, went to Fla Atlantic, and then got a lower-mid SEC job. Just in the conference Ole Miss is only better than Vandy for sure and similar to MSU, USC, UK, Arkansas and Mizzou.
 
#48

WoodsmanVol

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#48
Figured it our. A faction of VN has a hybrid disease. It's called Kiffinitis-Jonesism. Apparently, it is incurable. Primarily because they don't want to be cured, which gravely restricts their ability to enjoy positive achievements of the current Vols team. Poor things, the condition might even be terminal.
 
#49

cardvolfan

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#49
To be fair to both coaches, which one fares better long term will depend on how they learn to manage their staffs and in particular assemble a group of great defensive coaches.
Also, one must say to this point, Kiffin is almost certainly a better recruiter today than CJH, but I think this could change very soon if we continue to put a product on the field that gets noticed by recruits. Its early in their current tenures at SEC schools, but to me the biggest hurdle for both will come as the top programs learn to scheme around their particular "style" of offense. Then, how do these two coaches adapt their system to "adjust to the adjustments". For example, SCar today demonstrated how to slow us down in the 2nd half. What will Heup do to counter that? He never really overcame it today, as our only score came from a short field. Now, he likely didn't feel he had to do much since we were up, but this will be interesting to watch.
When you run a bit of a "gimmicky" offense, the good programs catch up and adjust. Then you have to tweak your system. I hope he can, and I believe he can. It will be fun to watch.
South Carolina didn’t slow us down. Coaches totally deflated the air out of the ball. We could have exploited SC’s scheme in the 2nd half, but chose not to.
 

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