Can someone explain to me Bama’s hatred for Fulmer?

#126
#126
The most hypocritical part about Bama fans is that, as court proceedings would indicate, one of the "at least 8 schools" that Lang shopped Means to was Michigan State, coached by Saint Nick Saban. At the time, it was reported that Michigan State was one of five schools that dropped a dime on Bama/Young. One of Saban's then-assistant coaches testified in criminal trial. But Bammers can overlook Saban's role in their probation because he won big for them.

Bama cheated, cheats, and will cheat
 
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#127
#127
BowlBrother85 said:
Exactly. The Sanfords were longtime friends of Tee's. Their relationship with him pre-dated his college recruitment. Therefore, the NCAA (who did investigate those checks) concluded that there was nothing wrong with them helping him out a bit, as they had done before he was recruited by Tennessee. It was an arrangement similar to that of the Tuohey's and Michael Oher (Blind Side). That has absolutely nothing in common with what Logan Young was doing.
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Exactly. And as you say, the NCAA did investigate and concluded there was nothing improper. Even the Tuscaloosa News reported that. Alas, it makes no difference in the alleged minds of bammers because, as the self-styled bammerwriter acknowledged, bammers believe what they want to believe about an "implied (sic) quid pro quo" regardless whether it's true or not.
 
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#129
#129
BowlBrother85 said:
No. Eric Berry was the #2 player in the country and he signed with Tennessee but Tennessee's class was either 5 or 6... However, with the exception of Berry, it was mostly a washout. I wasn't just speaking in terms of class rankings but how the players in the class panned out.
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It was no. 3, so we were both off, but I was closer. :p

And yeah, a lot of players didn't pan out, but for one, I think that has been exagerated. More important, that class had to suffer through two coaching changes, Fulmer to Kiffin and Kiffin to Dooley in a single year. That will cause attrition. There is always attritiion when a coach leaves, and obviously the effect is greater when it happens back to back.
 
#131
#131
BowlBrother85 said:
This was a good post. It was an Alabama booster named Logan Young who paid the $200K to Memphis Trezevant High School head coach Lynn Lang for Albert Means to sign with Alabama. One of his assistants, Milton Kirk, was upset that he didn't get a cut of the take and he went public with information about the payment. Fulmer was one of several coaches who consulted with the NCAA on the matter. Fulmer also spoke to the FBI. Other SEC coaches including Houston Nutt of Arkansas and Steve Spurrier, who publicly announced, without being prompted that "I won't be surprised if Alabama goes on probation."

However, it is only Fulmer that Alabama fans have ever blamed for their probation and ongoing issues with the NCAA in the early 2000's. There is never any accountability placed on Mike DuBose or acceptance of responsibility for their actions... or that if they hadn't cheated in the first place, then there would have been nothing to turn them in over. They have simply chosen to vilify Fulmer for their probation.

Now, having said that, I didn't think this was still lingering. Their dominance of college football the last 10 years has softened the hearts of most of their fans. I don't doubt there are some idiots still posting about "Phil" on their message boards, though.
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Good post. Part of the disdain for Fulmer is he denied it. Media did ask Spurrier about it and he admitted to turning them in. As has been mentioned, ‘perks’ were normal but Alabama was going rogue (the reason most don’t like AU, they go far beyond) and Spurrier did call Alabama and told them to ‘knock it off’. Now, when it came to light that Phil lied about turning them in, he was their scapegoat if you will. You are correct it wasn’t or isn’t Phil’s fault, they are the ones who went rogue. People always have to blame someone else.

I’ll explain (probably shouldn’t) what I mean about AU or going beyond reasonable means. A WR recruit was near the top of most recruiting boards a few years back, all the top SEC guys were trying to get him. His final 5 was all SEC including TN, Bama, AU, FL, and UGA. Pretty standard recruitment, back and forth. AU learns that his parents are struggling with their marriage (all 5 knew) but AU decides to get involved. His mom is originally from Alabama so AU tells her if she moves to Alabama away from the dad (he favored another school) they have a job and house waiting for her if her son signed with them. I think that’s too far, you shouldn’t get involved in situations between parents, especially trying to break up the home. I have other similar stories about AU and that’s why I detest their ways.
 
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#132
#132
secking said:
Good post. Part of the disdain for Fulmer is he denied it. Media did ask Spurrier about it and he admitted to turning them in. As has been mentioned, ‘perks’ were normal but Alabama was going rogue (the reason most don’t like AU, they go far beyond) and Spurrier did call Alabama and told them to ‘knock it off’. Now, when it came to light that Phil lied about turning them in, he was their scapegoat if you will. You are correct it wasn’t or isn’t Phil’s fault, they are the ones who went rogue. People always have to blame someone else.

I’ll explain (probably shouldn’t) what I mean about AU or going beyond reasonable means. A WR recruit was near the top of most recruiting boards a few years back, all the top SEC guys were trying to get him. His final 5 was all SEC including TN, Bama, AU, FL, and UGA. Pretty standard recruitment, back and forth. AU learns that his parents are struggling with their marriage (all 5 knew) but AU decides to get involved. His mom is originally from Alabama so AU tells her if she moves to Alabama away from the dad (he favored another school) they have a job and house waiting for her if her son signed with them. I think that’s too far, you shouldn’t get involved in situations between parents, especially trying to break up the home. I have other similar stories about AU and that’s why I detest their ways.
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They have always been more openly crooked than UA.
 
#134
#134
bamawriter said:
This is simply not true. Yes, Spurrier and Nutt both reported what they'd heard about Bama (as did the coach at Michigan State, though I forget his name). However, none of them actually sat down with the NCAA's investigators; that was all Fulmer. And the NCAA violated their own bylaws by trying to give Fulmer anonymity. On the heels of Tennessee skating on the Tee Martin issue, it came off like Fulmer and the NCAA had a quid-pro-quo agreement. It was an easy conclusion for Bama fans to draw. Whether that conclusion matches reality is ultimately neither here nor there.

Maybe you think Fulmer was completely in the right on this issue. That's fine. Again, it really doesn't matter anymore. But to say that Bama fans unfairly focused on him over other coaches is to ignore how it all went down.
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Even if what you are saying is true, it is a case of a warped mind to place the blame on Fulmer.. we don't live in a playground society where the rat fink is the bad guy. If Fulmer was the guy that did the whistleblowing did that is one of the few things that I have to speak about him positively. Alabama got caught doing the worst recruiting offense in the history of the NCAA and they should have gotten much more penalties than they did receive. Bama supporters should be red-faced in hiding in shame over that issue.
 
#136
#136
bamawriter said:
You're simply rehashing the reasons why it was easy for Bama fans to assume a quid-pro-quo. You don't have to be of the belief that it actually happened in order to see how the conclusion could be reached.
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He’s simply pointing out that Bammers would rather ignore/deny facts so they can place blame and have their own narrative in their own little world that it was anybody else’s fault but their own program. The issue is not that it is easy for Bama fans to come to the conclusion they have, the issue is they have come to this conclusion because that is what they want it to be. Bama fans turn into little toddlers with their fingers in their ears running around screaming “Fulmer! Fulmer!” everytime this is brought up.

I live in Alabama and literally have yet to meet a Bama fan that simply says “I hate Fulmer because he owned us.” It’s always “I hate Fulmer because he is a snitch.” When it comes to this subject the stupidity is rampant down here.
 
#137
#137
rjd970 said:
He’s simply pointing out that Bammers would rather ignore/deny facts so they can place blame and have their own narrative in their own little world that it was anybody else’s fault but their own program. The issue is not that it is easy for Bama fans to come to the conclusion they have, the issue is they have come to this conclusion because that is what they want it to be. Bama fans turn into little toddlers with their fingers in their ears running around screaming “Fulmer! Fulmer!” everytime this is brought up.

I live in Alabama and literally have yet to meet a Bama fan that simply says “I hate Fulmer because he owned us.” It’s always “I hate Fulmer because he is a snitch.” When it comes to this subject the stupidity is rampant down here.
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Not saying you're completely wrong, but Tuberville owned us worse than Fulmer, and a buch of Bama fans are about to vote for him for the US Senate.

Mind you, it's not like I'm Bama fans would have Phil on our Christmas card list but for his involvement with the NCAA.
 
#138
#138
bamawriter said:
I can't speak for everyone, obviously. But, for some, I think it's just fun to have a reason to care about the TSIO rivalry. Almost two decades on, the facts of the situation aren't really that important.
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Some of us live in a fact-based world. Some live in fantasyland.
 
#140
#140
CampBlount said:
Some of us live in a fact-based world. Some live in fantasyland.
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And the fact is that Tennessee wound up much worse of than Bama. What used to be the most important rivalry in the SEC has been diminished to the point that it's almost an afterthought. If a Bama fan needs to rage against Fulmer in order to get excited for this game, I can understand where he's coming from. I'm not personally in that camp, but I understand.
 
#141
#141
bamawriter said:
Not saying you're completely wrong, but Tuberville owned us worse than Fulmer, and a buch of Bama fans are about to vote for him for the US Senate.

Mind you, it's not like I'm Bama fans would have Phil on our Christmas card list but for his involvement with the NCAA.
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I will not count '95-'98 when Tuberville was 0-4 vs Alabama at Ole Miss.... While at Auburn, Tuberville was 7-3 vs Alabama from '99-'08. Fulmer was 10-5-1 vs Alabama from '93-'08, and that is keeping the '93 game as a tie. Tuberville had a 6 game winning streak over Alabama, Fulmer had a 7 game winning streak over Alabama. It's close, but in terms of kicking Alabama butt, Fulmer has the edge.
 
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#142
#142
BowlBrother85 said:
I will not count '95-'98 when Tuberville was 0-4 vs Alabama at Ole Miss.... While at Auburn, Tuberville was 7-3 vs Alabama from '99-'08. Fulmer was 10-5-1 vs Alabama from '93-'08, and that is keeping the '93 game as a tie. Tuberville had a 6 game winning streak over Alabama, Fulmer had a 7 game winning streak over Alabama. It's close, but in terms of kicking Alabama butt, Fulmer has the edge.
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Point taken. But there is also some recency bias with Tuberville's ownage. And the fact that he was at Auburn, which will always be a bigger deal to most Bama fans.
 
#143
#143
bamawriter said:
And the fact is that Tennessee wound up much worse of than Bama. What used to be the most important rivalry in the SEC has been diminished to the point that it's almost an afterthought. If a Bama fan needs to rage against Fulmer in order to get excited for this game, I can understand where he's coming from. I'm not personally in that camp, but I understand.
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No, you are just an Alabama fan who has posted close to 20,000 messages to a Tennessee fan forum over the last 9 years.
 
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#144
#144
Pepe said:
Even if what you are saying is true, it is a case of a warped mind to place the blame on Fulmer.. we don't live in a playground society where the rat fink is the bad guy. If Fulmer was the guy that did the whistleblowing did that is one of the few things that I have to speak about him positively. Alabama got caught doing the worst recruiting offense in the history of the NCAA and they should have gotten much more penalties than they did receive. Bama supporters should be red-faced in hiding in shame over that issue.
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To be fair UF's disregard for the NCAA rule book in the early 80's was much worse. Convicted on 59 major violations and over 100 reported. The NCAA stopped trying to prove more than 59 as they need no more evidence to throw the book at UF. SMU. We all know what happened here. Miami bought one of my friends a new car in 1980. Robert "Speedy" Neil was an All-American FB in the same Parade class as H. Walker.
The NCAA handed USC their ass a few years back. Let's not forget the near $200k paid by Auburn for Cam ( I stole a fellow student's laptop and got caught cheating on several exams at UF) Newton.

UT slipped away from 11 major violations in 1991 with only a slap on the wrist.
 
#145
#145
VolunGator said:
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To be fair UF's disregard for the NCAA rule book in the early 80's was much worse. Convicted on 59 major violations and over 100 reported. The NCAA stopped trying to prove more than 59 as they need no more evidence to throw the book at UF. SMU. We all know what happened here. Miami bought one of my friends a new car in 1980. Robert "Speedy" Neil was an All-American FB in the same Parade class as H. Walker.
The NCAA handed USC their ass a few years back. Let's not forget the near $200k paid by Auburn for Cam ( I stole a fellow student's laptop and got caught cheating on several exams at UF) Newton.

UT slipped away from 11 major violations in 1991 with only a slap on the wrist.
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They weren't major violations.
 
#148
#148
TUSKtimes said:
Who are you trying to kid? There has been many a vol thread that has taken up bandwidth over here about how fulmer got his HC gig. How he's being portrayed by Bama fans is altogether in line with many a Vol that has had his say about this guy's character flaws over the years. That's no accident or just someone having a bad day. Coach Majors has never reminded me of a guy that goes out of his way about ostracizing people. But his reaction to this guy's tactics has been a source of deep, bitter consternation since the coup happened. Thinking that a college football fan has to travel all the way to Tuscaloosa for a unique perspective into this guy's character is fundamentally flawed. Check your own bandwidth?
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You don't know what you are talking about.
 
#149
#149
Bammers can say all they want about the Albert Means situation, but the fact is, Fulmer owned the tide, for a decent stretch.
GBO!!
 
#150
#150
When all is said and done, regardless of what happens on the football field on Saturday night, we get to live in Tennessee and support the University of Tennessee.

And they'll still be bammers.

I wouldn't trade places with them
 
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