Best Angle and Slow mo of 4th and 24

#1
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Fullfillmer

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#1


Hopefully I have captured this correctly and pasted it successfully. Please watch the slow motion at least 3 times before commenting.

Attempting to remove all bias. 1. He wasn't down at the 39 which is where he ended up. 2. He wasn't down at the 41 which is where it was ultimately spotted.
3. You can not look at that and not come up with a rational argument that he reached the artificial yellow first down line at the 40 yard line.
It's not a slam dunk - refs are human and he was out of position - but on replay, I am saying he reached the 40 for a first down.
He didn't go down - knee first or right elbow first - but lunged and his whole body landed at once. I am aware that he was carrying the ball tucked in under his left
arm ( as he should ) but that still would take it to the 40 or slightly beyond. Carrying the ball tucked - would have portions of the ball even or an inch or two above your left bicep not
down at your waist. In fact it's impossible to tuck a football and have it be below your bicep. It's even or above.

It bothers me that people with agendas argue he was short of the first down line. I continue to believe that is not the case.

Please don't post the beating the dead horse - picture. I am aware- I am aware that some people threw some things and
shouldn't have. I am also aware that was a first down and the stop of forward progress in the first quarter was a touchdown.
 
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#5
#5
Fullfillmer said:


Hopefully I have captured this correctly and pasted it successfully. Please watch the slow motion at least 3 times before commenting.

Attempting to remove all bias. 1. He wasn't down at the 39 which is where he ended up. 2. He wasn't down at the 41 which is where it was ultimately spotted.
3. You can not look at that and not come up with a rational argument that he reached the artificial yellow first down line at the 40 yard line.
It's not a slam dunk - refs are human and he was out of position - but on replay, I am saying he reached the 40 for a first down.
He didn't go down - knee first or right elbow first - but lunged and his whole body landed at once. I am aware that he was carrying the ball tucked in under his left
arm ( as he should ) but that still would take it to the 40 or slightly beyond. Carrying the ball tucked - would have portions of the ball even or an inch or two above your left bicep not
down at your waist. In fact it's impossible to tuck a football and have it be below your bicep. It's even or above.

It bothers me that people with agendas argue he was short of the first down line. I continue to believe that is not the case.

Please don't post the beating the dead horse - picture. I am aware- I am aware that some people threw some things and
shouldn't have. I am also aware that was a first down and the stop of forward progress in the first quarter was a touchdown.
Click to expand...

Go back and watch the ref when he runs to place the ball. He runs to the 40 yard line then proceeds to spot the ball a yard behind where he was initially going to spot it. Do I think he made the first down? Probably not, but if the ref spots it where he was going to, then it would have been impossible to overturn that call too with replay. Look at where Warren was when the ref got ready to spot the ball.
 
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#6
#6
I don't know if he made it or not, but the spot was absolutely incorrect. They spotted at the 41. His knee didn't touch the ground till he was past the 41 yard line and the ball was well in front of his knee. They basically spotted the ball at his knee; not where he held the ball.

I've never seen a spot overturned in any game, though, even when it's blatantly obvious the spot was incorrect. To me, while you can't pinpoint the exact location of the ball, you can logically deduce with 95%+ certainty that it's past the 40 yard; probably about 1 foot past it. Regardless, though, there's no way I can look at the video and conclude that the spot was correct. It may have still been short, but no way he was down at the 41. At a bare minimum, he hit the 40, as his knee was down around 41 yards plus a few inches, and the ball is well above his knee.
 
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#8
#8
the problem was the plays before this one where we got ZERO yards. Everyone knew it was 4 down territory you do not need to get 24 yards on 3rd down just get some and our QB ate the ball for no gain.
 
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#10
#10
His right knee hit the turf at almost the exact same time that #35’s right foot is planted just outside of the 41. I thought that I saw a shot from the south end zone at that moment and the ball was very low… like near his belt. I think that the spot was about a half football outside of the 40 and was slightly short of a 1st down. But had the call on the field been a first down I doubt that there was enough there to overturn it.
 
Last edited:
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#12
#12
VolBricks said:
the problem was the plays before this one where we got ZERO yards. Everyone knew it was 4 down territory you do not need to get 24 yards on 3rd down just get some and our QB ate the ball for no gain.
Click to expand...

I think that there was no gain on 2nd down and Hooker gained 3 yards on 3rd and 27.
 
#14
#14
Fullfillmer said:


Hopefully I have captured this correctly and pasted it successfully. Please watch the slow motion at least 3 times before commenting.

Attempting to remove all bias. 1. He wasn't down at the 39 which is where he ended up. 2. He wasn't down at the 41 which is where it was ultimately spotted.
3. You can not look at that and not come up with a rational argument that he reached the artificial yellow first down line at the 40 yard line.
It's not a slam dunk - refs are human and he was out of position - but on replay, I am saying he reached the 40 for a first down.
He didn't go down - knee first or right elbow first - but lunged and his whole body landed at once. I am aware that he was carrying the ball tucked in under his left
arm ( as he should ) but that still would take it to the 40 or slightly beyond. Carrying the ball tucked - would have portions of the ball even or an inch or two above your left bicep not
down at your waist. In fact it's impossible to tuck a football and have it be below your bicep. It's even or above.

It bothers me that people with agendas argue he was short of the first down line. I continue to believe that is not the case.

Please don't post the beating the dead horse - picture. I am aware- I am aware that some people threw some things and
shouldn't have. I am also aware that was a first down and the stop of forward progress in the first quarter was a touchdown.
Click to expand...

Good assessment of the knee being down at the 41 and the tuck placement of the ball in the left hand. The ball clearly should have been placed at or close to the 40.
 
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#15
#15
Thunder Good-Oil said:
His right knee hit the turf at almost the exact same time that #35’s right foot is planted just outside of the 41. I thought that I saw a shot from the north end zone at that moment and the ball was very low… like near his belt. I think that the spot was about a half football beyond the 40 and was slightly short of a 1st down. But had the call on the field been a first down I doubt that there was enough there to overturn it.
Click to expand...


Interesting that the play by play guys instantly said first down
 
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#19
#19
The Original Fade said:
Interesting that the play by play guys instantly said first down
Click to expand...

It kind of appeared like he had reached out with his right hand in real time when the ball was in his left. Plus his momentum carried him well beyond the mark. The important fact is where the ball was when his knee hit. The play by play guys didn’t have a better look.
 
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#20
#20
I still can’t understand why the head linesman: 1.Is the authority on spotting that ball when he was 20 yards behind the play (granted none of the officials were in a great position) and 2.Appeared to run directly to the line to gain stick and immediately turn right, he even appears to take another step towards the line of scrimmage when he turns right.I am far from a conspiracy theorist and roll my eyes when fans feel the world is out to get them, but the optics of who and how the ball was spotted on this critical play just look strange, especially when you watch the replay 100 times ha ha. I just don’t understand what the line to gain stick has to do with where the ball should be spotted, and why the linesman would stare at, run at, and then turn just before the stick. Is that normal to do when spotting close balls? I would think not knowing where the sticks are would help me make a more accurate spot, or at least stay above reproach when making a close spot.
 
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#23
#23
We wouldn’t have this to worry about if he had stay on his feet and ran through somebody. He dove and lunged forward on his own. Never put refs in position to make questionable calls to begin with. You know before the play where the 1st down marker or yard line it’s own. So why dive at it and not run through it.
 
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#24
#24
Ball definitely didn't belong at the 41. That's where his knee appeared to go down. I rhought he was just short after seeing those replays combined with the endzone angle which appeared to show the ball down around the stomach/waist area.. That was just my guess though and definitely no agenda. Who knows for sure, but it was definitely a bad spot.
 
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