Bay Area Sports Links: Will Raiders target one of Kiffin's Vols in 2010 draft?

#26
#26
BuckeyeVols said:
I am a 49er fan, and can honestly say the only fans that have had LESS to be happy about the last 8 years or so, are the poor Raiders fans. I cant tell you how much I admire your love for your team to stay a devoted fan, even though your owner is single handedly trying to destroy what he built, and giving you every reason to turn your back on the team. I wish for your sake that the senile idiot would sale or hand over the team to someone that isnt certifiable. I am glad Al took Heyward-Bey, since that let Crabtree drop in our laps.....but did you notice MC's families' response when Oakland passed on him? They were actually relieved. I hope your team gets it turned around man.....I just dont think it happens until Al dies.
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not just Crabtree's family but Crabtree himself.

crabtreeUncle.gif
 
#27
#27
dubcfan said:
Is it just me or do these guys not have Berry taken in the 1st round?? Man, what an idiot.

2010 NFL Mock Draft - Draft King
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The person who wrote that clearly is crazy. McShay has a 2010 mock out, but he only includes players that have been on campus for 4 years (RS Juniors and Seniors), so that is why EB isnt on his. The link you provided....I dunno....either that guy just flat out forgot the best defensive player in college football, or his talent evaluation methods are suspect.
 
#28
#28
karmazone said:
They sell an image? I think that stopped in the 80's. There are no more Jack Tatum late hits. They don't bring in trouble makers anymore (with the exception of Randy Moss). All of Al Davis' court battles have been settled. Look at the guys they drafted, for crying out loud. Every one of them might as well be choir boys!
And I think there is a difference between selling fans on a brand and stereotyping all fans as quintessential embodiments of such a brand. Even if the team played the same way they played in the 70's (the offense actually did play that way in Art Shell's second tenure. But I digress...)
Even if the team did play with the reckless abandon that they played with in the 70's, there's no need to take it two inches farther and include the fan base. Every fan base has got some rowdies in it, just like my Raiders do. But, because of the costumes and Oakland being a rough city, our fan's transgressions get magnified.
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Every fanbase has rowdies in it, as you say. The difference is that 80 percent of the guys outside the Bay Area who are Raiders fans are there BECAUSE of the rowdy image. The Raiders made a crapton of money selling an entire generation of kids on the outlaw WWF thing -- "We're the team of badasses and late hits. Buy our jerseys." And it was very successful -- if you grew up in the south in the 70s, and you didn't live in an NFL city (as most of us didn't), then you were either a Cowboys, Steelers, or Raiders fan. And none of the guys who were Raiders fans picked them because they were particularly good. It was all because of the image they were selling.

And so what you have now is a national fanbase that includes a ton of these same guys who have grown up and turned into these fatass, middle-aged versions of Beavis and Butthead. And for them, the brand and the image is still as bright and shining as ever. Which is why, when the Raiders play in your stadium as a visiting team, it's like a convention of the ancient and balding and drunken Kiss Army has come to town. Committment To Excellence! Just Win Baby! Fsck Yeah!

You may be too young to have seen all of that at the time, but let me tell you straight up -- the reputation that hounds everybody with a Raiders shirt on today maybe unfortunate, but it's not unfair. The reputation of their fans is well earned. And it's something that Al Davis cultivated deliberately, and enriched himself greatly doing. This is why all the brand-manager types make a pantload of money: branding is enormously powerful, and, once established, it basically lasts forever. In ways both good and bad.


EDIT: I should note that one of my good friends is a 40ish guy who grew up in Knoxville and supported the Raiders. (And still does.) He owns his own software company, is intelligent and successful, and is in no way a fatass, middle-aged version of Beavis. He does not dress up like a pirate or a biker when he goes to see the Raiders play. However, as he will be the first to tell you, he DID pick the Raiders as his team when he was in elementary school entirely because the badass image. And just because he didn't go the principal's office > smoking area > Camaro > dressing-up-like-a-pirate route doesn't mean that a whole bunch of his fellow pre-teen 70s Raider-loving brethren didn't. Just go to any average Raiders away game on the east coast and look at the average age of the guys who are dressed up and acting like idiots.
 
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#29
#29
Karmazone: Honestly, what went through your mind when crazy Al passed on Crabtree.....then drafted a guy in the 2nd round that wasnt on anyones radar? I have to think the Raiders knew some other team liked the guy as well.....why else draft someone in the 2nd round you could have gotten in the 5th or 6th round?

I hope Heyward-Bey works out for you guys......however, he seems eerily similar to another WR who stock shot up on his 40yd dash time alone a few years ago.....Troy Williamson. He also went 7th overall I believe.
 
#30
#30
Buckeye Vols: What went through my head? Something like, "Oh. My. God. The old man has proven them right. Again." I was so convinced he'd go for Crabtree that I didn't put any thought at all in DHB actually going #7. I have actually heard a few analysts say it wasn't as much of a reach as thought. Ron Jaworski, for one. Listen to this at the 3:50 mark:

ESPN Radio - SuperStream Player

And as for Mitchell in the 2nd... the raiders took him at 47. The Bears were going to take him at 49. Cleveland was going to take him in the 3rd. He's not that bad of a pick. The only reason that Mayock, Kiper, and Mcshay had him so low was because they had never heard of him and never watched tape on him. The guy is fast (as we all know a Davis pick has to be), and hits HARD. I think he'll be okay.
 
#31
#31
And Vercingetorix: You have amazing computer skills for someone who's been dead for 2000 years.

Again I cannot dispute that most of the national fan base of the raiders chose them because of the team's reputation. And most of the Raiders fans in opposing stadiums may very well be the middle aged costumed fans (I don't think so, but I've never been to a Raider game and don't pay much attention to the fans when the games are on TV). But, just as your friend is a Raider fan who doesn't dress up and act out, and I am a raider fan who doesn't dress up and act out, I contend that most Raider fans don't dress up and act out. I still draw a distinction between a team getting a bad (and well earned) reputation, and the fan base getting the very same reputation. I mean, take Alameda Coliseum. How many fans are in there for a game (lately, not many...)? Maybe 40,000? And how many of those are the ones in the black hole that dress up? Maybe 100? And there is maybe 1 fight per game? between 2 or 3 guys? So should the other 39,897 people there be branded the same as those uber-visible 103?
 
#32
#32
karmazone said:
Buckeye Vols: What went through my head? Something like, "Oh. My. God. The old man has proven them right. Again." I was so convinced he'd go for Crabtree that I didn't put any thought at all in DHB actually going #7. I have actually heard a few analysts say it wasn't as much of a reach as thought. Ron Jaworski, for one. Listen to this at the 3:50 mark:

ESPN Radio - SuperStream Player

And as for Mitchell in the 2nd... the raiders took him at 47. The Bears were going to take him at 49. Cleveland was going to take him in the 3rd. He's not that bad of a pick. The only reason that Mayock, Kiper, and Mcshay had him so low was because they had never heard of him and never watched tape on him. The guy is fast (as we all know a Davis pick has to be), and hits HARD. I think he'll be okay.
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No, they weren't going to take him with those picks, those were dumb, untrue rumors.

Raiders did what the Raiders do; reach on players that they could have had rounds later.
 
#34
#34
Al Davis is just stupid enough to pass up on the best athlete in the draft just because hes got a connection to one Kiffin much lest two. If he were smart hed realize the true talent that Berry has and tank the season just so he could get Berry. But in reality Berry prolly wont be the "fastest player in the draft" so he'll pass.
 
#35
#35
If Berry is drafted by Davis he would be smart to pull an Eli and try and go to another team.
 
#36
#36
I'm glad they passed on Jeremy Maclin too. One is he would face the Chiefs twice a year, and two he would not end up wasting a potential great pro career with a losing org. that is Raider nation.
 
#38
#38
ryancy said:
No, they weren't going to take him with those picks, those were dumb, untrue rumors.

Raiders did what the Raiders do; reach on players that they could have had rounds later.
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It's very true the Raiders reach all of the time. They did it with Routt. They did it with Bowie. They did it with DHB (though he wouldn't have been there in the 2nd round). But why do you say those Mitchell rumors were untrue? Even Mel Kiper said that one team would have drafted him in the 3rd round.
 
#39
#39
But, back on topic, yes I could see Al Davis passing on a UT player to try and spite Kiffin. He could easily pass on EB for that reason and justify it simply by stating another player's 40 speed. Besides, it's well known that Al Davis is a USC guy. he'd take Taylor Mays over EB any day.
 
#40
#40
karmazone said:
It's very true the Raiders reach all of the time. They did it with Routt. They did it with Bowie. They did it with DHB (though he wouldn't have been there in the 2nd round). But why do you say those Mitchell rumors were untrue? Even Mel Kiper said that one team would have drafted him in the 3rd round
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Larry Meyer blog said:
I saw an interesting video on NFL.com that said the Bears were going to draft safety Michael Mitchell with the 49th pick in the second round if the Raiders hadn’t taken him at No. 47. This was a pick that was highly criticized by all the experts as Mitchell was projected to be a late-round selection. Is there any validity to that assertion?

Ankur G.
Schaumburg, Illinois

Ohio safety Michael Mitchell was on the Bears’ “hot list” as one of nearly 125 players they were going to consider selecting in the draft. But I can tell you with 100 percent accuracy that there’s no way they would have chosen him as early as the second round.
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Truthfully, I didn't mind the pick at all. Kid hits like a ton of bricks. It's getting blown out of proportion because the Raiders reached for DHB in the 1st RD.


Mocks for the 2010 Draft are just gimmicks at this point. Most of the credible Draftniks only include seniors in their mocks, so if Berry is left off any lists, that's why.

As far as Oakland, I see them taking Mays over Berry, and it has nothing to do with school affiliation. I also think Oakland picking 2nd Overall when they could be the 2nd best team in the AFC West is faulty.
 
#43
#43
Yeah right. Al Davis will take a punter or a kicker. He's the biggest moron in sports. Heyward-Bey? Over Crabtree? PLLLLLLLLLEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAASSSEEEEEE

"Bring me that Harrius Bey!"
"You mean Darrius Heyward-Bey? But sir, Crabtree is still available."
"I WANT THAT HARRIUS!"
"...."
 
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