A conundrum, if you will...

#26
#26
Dragon18 said:
Good lord man! How many times did we hear from the so called negative crowd that it doesn't matter how you play, wins are what matter. Half the posters on this board have to be either teenagers or trolls.
We are not playing well and that needs to change to win SEC games. However, we are 3-0. I just don't get the incredible angst over potential negative outcomes. We have the potential to win the games coming up just like we have the potential to lose them if we play poorly.
I'm not a player anymore so I just don't get too warped about this stuff now.
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And the sunshine pumpers beat up the nega vols every time saying that the way we were playing and improving was most important...so now that the way we are playing and the fact we are not getting better is questioned, the sunshine pumpers change their tune to winning is all that matters. WHICH IS IT?
 
#27
#27
The problem is we have been a very bad to mediocre team for the last decade. We as a fan base have seen teams in the SEC like Bama, LSU, Auburn and Florida dominate and win National Championships on a consistent basis over those ten years. We have seen other coaches come in to a program and seem to revive their relevance within a year and be back on a national stage and perform well week in and week out. Some of those programs like Auburn, Florida, Ole Miss have fell off the last couple of years but the question remains, why not us? Why can't we bring a coach in that can bring us back from the depths of the SEC and have us back in the title hunt within a couple of years. I think Butch Jones can do that but he has to be willing to change. He has to go out and get the right people on his staff to make that difference. He made a good start with the hiring of Shoop, but staff members like Mahoney need to be sent packing at the end of the year. There is no excuse for this offensive line to be playing this bad. They really have taken a couple of steps in the wrong direction so far this season. I think Debord and this entire offensive scheme has to go too. I like the idea of an up tempo offense but do it with your QB under center in an I formation or a pro set and pound the rock. That's what the SEC has always been...power football. Changes to the staff will either make or break CBJ over the next couple of years in my opinion. The man can recruit as we have seen over the last 3-4 years. But when four and five star players don't seem to develop and perform like other programs seem to do it raises a lot of questions. The bigger question is does CBJ have too much loyalty to his staff members that have been with him since his days at Central Michigan and Cincy? If that is the case, we may be looking for the 24th head coach at Tennessee in a few years.
 
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#28
#28
The Tall Gguy said:
And the sunshine pumpers beat up the nega vols every time saying that the way we were playing and improving was most important...so now that the way we are playing and the fact we are not getting better is questioned, the sunshine pumpers change their tune to winning is all that matters. WHICH IS IT?
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Wtf is a sunshine pumper? Grow up tall guy. If some fans like to take a positive perspective so be it. It's a much better place to be imo than being a handwringing little girl. Like I said before, we are not playing well and we need to play better to reach the goals set for the team. However, all of our goals are currently intact. I just don't get how bent out of joint most/many on this board are. You guys are poised on the ledge and ready to jump because of some potential outcome on Saturday. We have at least a 50/50 chance of winning this game. If we play to our potential that goes up dramatically.

Your point about "sunshine pumpers (smdh)" not beotching about playing poorly when we win is simply ridiculous.
 
#29
#29
I don't think I'm the one who needs to grow up. The sunshine pumpers change their way of thinking to suit their agenda. It is not about positive or negative. It Is about the irony of it all.

So what I am hearing is that it is ok for one group of fans ("sunshine pumpers") to change their opinion from winning is not most important, How you play and improving week to week is, to winning is all that matters...but it is not ok for another group of fans ("nega vols") to change their opinion from winning is all that matters to How you play and improving week to week is.

Does nobody else see the problem with this?
 
#30
#30
Ill sum up what i think people are thinking

This was the year Tennessee was supposed to be a "good" football team. However one wants to define that. And it isnt necessarily judged by wins and losses.

Florida won 10 games and went to the SEC title game last year and i wouldnt have called them a "good" football team.

So far, the win-loss record is fine, but they are not playing like a "good" football team and that's disappointing.

This coming weekend still feels like a tallest midget contest
 
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#31
#31
The Tall Gguy said:
I don't think I'm the one who needs to grow up. The sunshine pumpers change their way of thinking to suit their agenda. It is not about positive or negative. It Is about the irony of it all.

So what I am hearing is that it is ok for one group of fans ("sunshine pumpers") to change their opinion from winning is not most important, How you play and improving week to week is, to winning is all that matters...but it is not ok for another group of fans ("nega vols") to change their opinion from winning is all that matters to How you play and improving week to week is.

Does nobody else see the problem with this?
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Pretty sure it's not that black and white. If you want to win championships you have to improve week over week. I don't think anyone is satisfied with the way this team has performed so far. It just seems a bit juvenile to call out some percieved group of fans because they don't want to light the mattresses when we are 3-0.

Pretty sure you are in a small group that feels like you do. (I could be wrong though. This board is bizarre at times)
 
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#32
#32
IluvdoubleD's said:
I can't believe I am even bothering with this but I'm here. We have been building up to a team like this. We have been positioning ourselves for success. You don't just show up and people hand you a natty. We are in a posistion to flip the switch. We are, but we are Not as deep as some other teams and that means we are going to have to play a lot of inexperience when digging into our depth. BUtch has been very,VERY good at getting young men ready to play early though.
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Hahahahahahahaha



The youth and depth complaint again. Only you....
 
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#33
#33
Winning ugly against lesser competition =/= Winning ugly against equal or better competition.

We've consistently struggled this year against every opponent, MAC, Sunbelt, ACC. The opponent hasn't mattered, but all of them have less talent than we do, and that is why us playing so poorly against them so bad.
 
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#34
#34
99gator said:
Ill sum up what i think people are thinking

This was the year Tennessee was supposed to be a "good" football team. However one wants to define that. And it isnt necessarily judged by wins and losses.

Florida won 10 games and went to the SEC title game last year and i wouldnt have called them a "good" football team.

So far, the win-loss record is fine, but they are not playing like a "good" football team and that's disappointing.

This coming weekend still feels like a tallest midget contest
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When a Gator fan gets it when half of Volnation doesn't...
 
#39
#39
Wylo said:
Hahahahahahahaha



The youth and depth complaint again. Only you....
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How can the significant injuries not be part of the conversation? If you had to pick the worst D injuries, would you not have said Sutton, Kirkland , and Reeves Maybin? Toss in Sapp for a further nightmare
 
#40
#40
It's called a double standard. After a win we celebrate and talk about where we need to improve. After a loss we are sad and talk about where we need to improve.
Win=happy and improve.
Lose=sad and improve.
Double standard.
It's exactly the same but different.
 
#41
#41
Dudleys87 said:
If we are out matched and we lose id rather look good and fight rather than the team quit like previous years.

Not playing your best and stil wining is great but essentially hanging your hat on it over the course of three weeks doesent look good and eventually the breaks start going the other way.
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Butch has never had a team quit on him.

This is not Dooley.

Win over lose in any scenario. Wth are ppl talking ab???

Sounds like some Dooley-esque loser mentality. Oh, they were a better team and we lost but BOY WE LOOKED GOOD.

Lol no thanks Jeff
 
#42
#42
See, that is the issue. In previous years, the legion of sunshine held the belief that the "moral victory" and improving week to week were the most important things, while myself and several other realists stated that the only victory is a win on the scoreboard. We were torn apart by the legion of sunshine.

This year, we see the legion of sunshine abandon the whole moral victory stance and run across the field to the winning is all that matters. When anyone states that they would like to see improvement on the field week to week, they are torn apart by the legion of sunshine--who, this year, hold fast to the "winning is most important thing" stance.

I'm just calling them out on their inconsistency.
 
#43
#43
The Tall Gguy said:
See, that is the issue. In previous years, the legion of sunshine held the belief that the "moral victory" and improving week to week were the most important things, while myself and several other realists stated that the only victory is a win on the scoreboard. We were torn apart by the legion of sunshine.

This year, we see the legion of sunshine abandon the whole moral victory stance and run across the field to the winning is all that matters. When anyone states that they would like to see improvement on the field week to week, they are torn apart by the legion of sunshine--who, this year, hold fast to the "winning is most important thing" stance.

I'm just calling them out on their inconsistency.
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It's a double standard, happens all the time.
 
#44
#44
Iam4utalways said:
It's a double standard, happens all the time.
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ATTACHED TO THE WRONG QUOTE ..... BUT
There are basically 4 possibilities:

Win - and look good doing it
Win - and look bad doing it
Lose - BUT look good (improved)
Lose - and look bad

I think everyone's order of preference would be the same. I don't see the need to have an international debate over the degree of difference between options 2 and 3. When you're struggling to make your way back to the top, sometimes option 3 can be encouraging. When you're at or near the top, option 2 is not very encouraging but it's a whole lot better than option 3. I think the fan base being encouraged by the "good" loses last year and remaining cautiously optimistic after the "ugly" wins this year is completely understandable and consistent.
 
#45
#45
luthervol said:
ATTACHED TO THE WRONG QUOTE ..... BUT
There are basically 4 possibilities:

Win - and look good doing it
Win - and look bad doing it
Lose - BUT look good (improved)
Lose - and look bad

I think everyone's order of preference would be the same. I don't see the need to have an international debate over the degree of difference between options 2 and 3. When you're struggling to make your way back to the top, sometimes option 3 can be encouraging. When you're at or near the top, option 2 is not very encouraging but it's a whole lot better than option 3. I think the fan base being encouraged by the "good" loses last year and remaining cautiously optimistic after the "ugly" wins this year is completely understandable and consistent.
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Sunshine Pumpers look for the silver lining even in a loss.

Negavols are preparing for the worst case scenario, if things work out and we win they will be happy, but if we were to some how lose(it's just hard to say we will lose) they will be sad just like the Sunshine Pumpers.

Me personally I don't mind the critical thinking and discussing where the team needs to improve.
 
#46
#46
99gator said:
Ill sum up what i think people are thinking

This was the year Tennessee was supposed to be a "good" football team. However one wants to define that. And it isnt necessarily judged by wins and losses.

Florida won 10 games and went to the SEC title game last year and i wouldnt have called them a "good" football team.

So far, the win-loss record is fine, but they are not playing like a "good" football team and that's disappointing.

This coming weekend still feels like a tallest midget contest
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Solid post and I had to give you a like for the analogy.

luthervol said:
....
There are basically 4 possibilities:

Win - and look good doing it
Win - and look bad doing it
Lose - BUT look good (improved)
Lose - and look bad

... I think the fan base being encouraged by the "good" loses last year and remaining cautiously optimistic after the "ugly" wins this year is completely understandable and consistent.
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Perfect and parallels 99Gator.:good!:
 
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