5-7, to 6-6, to 8-4, to (probably) 9-3

[JonGrudensAgent]

I don't realistically see a path where Jones gets fired this year or even next year until they get a new brain trust established for the AD.

That being said, there is no way in Hell he deserves anything along the lines of a raise, extension, bonus or anything else for the way this season is playing out as the OP has suggested.

This team is a lot closer to being 3-5 than 5-3 than many are willing to admit. That's completely unacceptable rolling into the season as SEC East favorites with one of the most complete and experienced teams in the division.

And the talk of injuries as an excuse only holds so much water. The defense can get by with it losing key contributors at all three levels in Tuttle, McKenzie, Maybin, and Sutton but they aren't the biggest problem, this disjointed offense is the thing that has back slid the most since last season.

If Jones thinks he and his staff deserves more money after the season, they should be encouraged to go elsewhere to find it.

 

[tvolsfan]

Another goof that thinks he can see into the future.

You will be on my side soon enough.

 

[KentuckyVol]

I'm not sold yet on a decline next year.

Yes, we do lose some big names most likely: Dobbs, Barnett, JRM, Sutton, etc. Kamara may leave as well.

However, we have played without JRM and Sutton almost all year, so I do not see any loss of actual on-filed impact with those. Hurd has not been a high performer, Dobbs has not this year either. Kamara will hurt, but Kelly is the real deal.

If we get some new coaches, we can improve the OL, DK will be back, our DBs and Safeties will have a year of experience and extra time in the S&C program (with a full time permanent coach.

QB will be interesting. Either way, we will get a more accurate passer, which the opposing D will have to respect. One or two of the three have awesome wheels as well. Plus, we have at least 2 dynamic game changers at WR in Malone and Jennings as well.

All in all, I am not sold that next year will be less successful.

After that is where I get worried. We have to overcome all the negativity and press (Title IX lawsuit, current personnel issues and conflicts, evidence of bad team management and perceived lack of player development) in order to recruit at a high level to keep high quality talent coming in.

I could be 100% wrong on this, but I do not expect the 💩 to hit the fan in 2017. Could in 2018 unless we can start to salvage and grow our recruiting this year.

I could write out some big long explanation, but this sums it up precisely. Lets not kid ourselves, the pre-season #9 rank was based on having JRM and Sutton. They haven't been around and that hurts. Getting to they bye week at 5-2 was our expected results even if they were healthy. The injuries have caught up and its wearing on morale and the younger players. Next season these replacements will have a lot of experience they weren't expecting to have which should make our outlook for next year better. Lets stay the course, continue winning with our younger players against our weak back end schedule and get to 9-3. That is still one more win than last year. Until a team goes X-0, getting more wins is always what you want, and that is what UT has been doing. Go Vols!

 

[Rocky_Top_Vol13]

Even if we get to 9-3, so what? We will have finished the regular season playing, at most, four good teams. Why should we be pretending 9-3 is an actual accomplishment?

Because 9-3 is an accomplishment. Its a 75% winning percentage. Would anyone want to see the Titan's head coach fired after winning 12 games, or the Preds coach fired after winning 61 of 82 games, or your favorite baseball team's coach fired for winning 120 games or your favorite NBA coach fire for winning 61 games? And to beat it all, just three years ago, we couldn't string together enough wins to make a bowl game!

 

[JACK8254]

This is the damn peak. If you're expecting things to get better, you haven't been paying attention.

We may well never be in a situation where we were so primed to win as we were this year.[/ DO YOU think the Ga fans are glad that they fired Mark Richt ? 10-3 doesnt look so bad after this Smart (Dumb) year. They foolish thought that Saban-type records are transferred when you hire a Saban acolyte. Turns out-that is wrong. I think we tried that too- how did that work?

 

[jakez4ut]

And people still saying he should be fired? I'm frustrated with him too but this is silly. C'mon people. Seems there are some issues but to me he's got to regress over the next two seasons for him to be fired (yes, two).

he shouldn't be fired becausue of this year. and he won't be. he should be fired because it doesn't appear that it will ever get better than this. firing him, now, next year or the next....should have more to do with the priorities of the program, not a referendum on a single season. he will not be the guy that gets us to, and maintains, a championship level program.

Now if I thought we had the donors/admin to put up the dough for a can't miss superstar (of which there are only 4-5), then ok. But that's not happening. Given the likely improvement over all 4 reg seasons, we should just let him do his thing.

this is the problem our program has, and has had, and probably will continue to have.

People forgetting where we were when he got here. We were on the verge of disappearing.

no, we haven't. which is why everyone should give CBJ and heartfelt thank you. he deserves it, and has earned it. he's not been bad for this program. this is an important distinction to be made. he's not Dooley, and he wouldn't be fired for the same reason Dooley was. as for disappearing, well, as for this season, that's what we just did Saturday night, and it's now carrying over to this week with all the turmoil talk.

I'd even suggest extending him and giving him raise/increased buyout. I see no reason not to at this point.....unless we tailspin the rest of this season, which I don't think we will.

we wholeheartidly disagree here. if that happens, then i will have lost what little faith i have left in the decision makers.

 

[CookieVol]

And people still saying he should be fired? I'm frustrated with him too but this is silly. C'mon people. Seems there are some issues but to me he's got to regress over the next two seasons for him to be fired (yes, two).

Now if I thought we had the donors/admin to put up the dough for a can't miss superstar (of which there are only 4-5), then ok. But that's not happening. Given the likely improvement over all 4 reg seasons, we should just let him do his thing.

People forgetting where we were when he got here. We were on the verge of disappearing.

I'd even suggest extending him and giving him raise/increased buyout. I see no reason not to at this point.....unless we tailspin the rest of this season, which I don't think we will.

Only way he should be gone this year is if he loses two more games. Then they might fire and hire and interim until they get a new President and AD. Anything other than the discovery of major violations he is the guy until at least next year when UT gets a new AD.

If you fire him then we will have to restart the whole process again. 3-4 years to get that coaches players, coaches, system, program running the way he wants it to. Stick with Butch. Let him get his players in and he needs to make some changes in his offense.

 

[jakez4ut]

Only way he should be gone this year is if he loses two more games. Then they might fire and hire and interim until they get a new President and AD. Anything other than the discovery of major violations he is the guy until at least next year when UT gets a new AD.

If you fire him then we will have to restart the whole process again. 3-4 years to get that coaches players, coaches, system, program running the way he wants it to. Stick with Butch. Let him get his players in and he needs to make some changes in his offense.

i used to fall in this camp. i've seen too many others do it in much less time.

a) the cupboard is far from bare....there's plenty enough to win now, and still build for the future.
b) the only thing holding us back is us. if the back up plan for Butch is to hire another version of Butch, and that's the only options we'd consider, then yeah, stick with what we got. but if you decide as a program that you want to get as close to a Saban or Meyer as you can, and the goals should be higher.... then you do what you need to, to make it happen.

 

[jakez4ut]

of course, at this point, i have zero doubt that what the fans and alumni base expect is wholly different than what the administration is willing to do.

so i don't expect any change. the priorites don't line up, so we are where we are. and i don't expect any changes.

 

[CookieVol]

The problem is next year were gonna have a big decline, this honestly looks like our peak with CBJ

I thoroughly disagree; yes we will be younger, but I think there will be players playing that better fit is style of offense. JG, Kelly, Jennings again at WR. Butch's fault this year has been trying to take players that have different abilities than those that thrive in HIS (not DeBoard) system and trying to make them run HIS system anyways. Instead of taking his players this year and tweaking to make the offense as efficient as possible. Hurd, does not fit the system like Kamara, Kelly, and Chandler will. Dobbs does not also, Dobbs is very athletic and competitive, but he would be better suited like T. Pryor at WR.

 

[jakez4ut]

I thoroughly disagree; yes we will be younger, but I think there will be players playing that better fit is style of offense. JG, Kelly, Jennings again at WR. Butch's fault this year has been trying to take players that have different abilities than those that thrive in HIS (not DeBoard) system and trying to make them run HIS system anyways. Instead of taking his players this year and tweaking to make the offense as efficient as possible. Hurd, does not fit the system like Kamara, Kelly, and Chandler will. Dobbs does not also, Dobbs is very athletic and competitive, but he would be better suited like T. Pryor at WR.

i actually agree. i don't know that the schedule will allow the opportunity to be better record wise, but i think we pass the eyeball test a lot better next year, than we have this year.

we will still have the same issue up front on the O line.

 

[TheMookieMonster]

Okay, so Year 5 we are 10-2 and it takes him year 6 just to get to 11-1? And that is a HUGE if. Watching the games for 4 years now has shown clear coaching weaknesses.

And I'm sorry, but anyone that is okay with 9-3 seasons every year....I just cannot get behind that. Is that what TN is now? A team that is okay with mediocrity and occasionally beating your rivals? Butch talking about how when we win our next game we are bowl eligible for the 3rd straight year is everything that is wrong with this program.

People don't remember that TN was once a dominant and respected program. The majority of millennials see us as a doormat and a team that is historically bad not historically good. This is unacceptable. And our coach shouldn't be even acknowledging bowl eligibility as if it is something to be proud of.

 

[sanddune50]

You will be on my side soon enough.

Never will be on the side of crystal ballers. It just promotes more guessing in the future.

 

[JoeVols]

Okay, so Year 5 we are 10-2 and it takes him year 6 just to get to 11-1? And that is a HUGE if. Watching the games for 4 years now has shown clear coaching weaknesses.

And I'm sorry, but anyone that is okay with 9-3 seasons every year....I just cannot get behind that. Is that what TN is now? A team that is okay with mediocrity and occasionally beating your rivals? Butch talking about how when we win our next game we are bowl eligible for the 3rd straight year is everything that is wrong with this program.

People don't remember that TN was once a dominant and respected program. The majority of millennials see us as a doormat and a team that is historically bad not historically good. This is unacceptable. And our coach shouldn't be even acknowledging bowl eligibility as if it is something to be proud of.

Not too many programs fire 9-3 coaches (although we have done just that not that long ago - Majors).

If we plateau at 9-3, then let's reconsider. But he has us on the right path. We go 9-3 this year, see how the next couple of years go. We may win more, less, or the same. But the idea of firing him, after improving the team each year, based on speculation we might not be as good next year or two years down the road, is madness.

 

[jakez4ut]

Not too many programs fire 9-3 coaches (although we have done just that not that long ago - Majors).

If we plateau at 9-3, then let's reconsider. But he has us on the right path. We go 9-3 this year, see how the next couple of years go. We may win more, less, or the same. But the idea of firing him, after improving the team each year, based on speculation we might not be as good next year or two years down the road, is madness.

see this is where i think a big distinction needs to be made.

for me, the need for him to be fired is not as a result of going 9-3. 9-3 standing on it's own is a good season for almost anyone. us included.

the distinction is this...is he the guy to do more than that? i think the answer is no.

so, if the priority for this program (aimed at any pertinent current or future decision maker left on the hill) is to get to a championship level program on a regular basis, then you do what you have to, to make that happen. the cupboard isn't bare, and you can win now with team 121's roster. and there's still plenty there to build on for the future and sustain it.

to me it's not about 9-3. it's about where do i want this program to be considered going forward?

the East is terrible and is there for the taking. do you want to be part of the taken, or the taker? i don't think we have 'the taker' running things right now.

 

[JoeVols]

see this is where i think a big distinction needs to be made.

for me, the need for him to be fired is not as a result of going 9-3. 9-3 standing on it's own is a good season for almost anyone. us included.

the distinction is this...is he the guy to do more than that? i think the answer is no.

so, if the priority for this program (aimed at any pertinent current or future decision maker left on the hill) is to get to a championship level program on a regular basis, then you do what you have to, to make that happen. the cupboard isn't bare, and you can win now with team 121's roster. and there's still plenty there to build on for the future and sustain it.

to me it's not about 9-3. it's about where do i want this program to be considered going forward?

the East is terrible and is there for the taking. do you want to be part of the taken, or the taker? i don't think we have 'the taker' running things right now.

If you're talking about moving forward, how do you fire a guy who keeps winning more games than the year before? We need to see where he plateaus before we make that call. Can't do it while he keeps improving the team.

 

[tvolsfan]

If you're talking about moving forward, how do you fire a guy who keeps winning more games than the year before? We need to see where he plateaus before we make that call. Can't do it while he keeps improving the team.

So if he goes 9-4 this year we can fire him?

 

[jakez4ut]

If you're talking about moving forward, how do you fire a guy who keeps winning more games than the year before? We need to see where he plateaus before we make that call. Can't do it while he keeps improving the team.

are we really better than we were last year? at best it's a push.

but last year it was 'we're a good team that didn't finish'...this year....i'm not sure what you call it.

 

[JoeVols]

So if he goes 9-4 this year we can fire him?

I think you look at regular season performances. Bowl games to me are exhibitions and not that important, unless it's the playoffs (in which case you're not firing him anyway).

 

[jakez4ut]

and i just think we're at the plateau.

he's not going to get fired, so i'm not really advocating it as much as i am just resigning myself to the fact that "it is what it is".

i don't hate CBJ. i think the last 10 years of this program is more about what UT isn't willing to do than anything else.

 

[jbr82]

Could be his peak. This is potentially the 2nd yr in a row that CBJ botched going to ATL. WE are passed Dooley yrs. Champions focus on winning championships. Pretenders are glad to just make a bowl.After that team performed after a 2 wk break I dont see CBJ being any better than Richt, Current Les Miles, Ron Zook FL, shula at bammer.I feel CBJ will be an avg 8-4 type of coach. TN should desire better. Most fanatics I believe do to

 

[DownNDirty]

I've tried to tell people for years this idiot is just Dooley with people skills. And that's not even entirely true I don't think. This is Butch's ceiling and I know many people that said that this would be his peak year. In his "peak" year he should have lost to Appy State in the first game, struggled against Ohio, beat Georgia on a miracle last second catch, got beat down worse by Bama this year than last, and STILL hasn't beaten that benchlicker Muschamp in his career.

Guys, this is his best shot. Next year it's not getting better. Butch is the longest tenured coach in the East. South Carolina is really young and a dumpster fire and they beat us. Georgia has a first year coach who's not going to be all that great IMO. Florida is still down and trying to rebuild. This was the year. This was his one chance to buy himself a few more years of relevance by making it to the SEC Championship game. And, not to my surprise, he blows it. Just like he choked and blew it against Oklahoma and Florida last year. Just like he'll choke and blow it again, and again, and again until Tennessee gets rid of him.

For those of you saying OH GOD THE SKY IS FALLING WHO ARE WE GOING TO GET? NOBODY WANTS TO COME TO TENNESSEE............WAKE UP! We have a complete and utter sh**stain as an Athletic Director who is on his way out. If you think Blackburn will make the same bad choices I think you are crazy. Keeping this goof around is just going to prolong the agony. Recruiting was down some last year and really could tank this year. All of these guys were "Butch's guys" and there are no more excuses to be made. Next year we start out with Georgia Tech which should be a win but who knows with their offense. We play at Florida and Bama and draw LSU from the West. It's not going to be better next year with Butch Jones here. It will be worse and he will be a lame duck coach getting fired then. At that point, we'll have ANOTHER lost recruiting class and whoever the new guy coming in will have to rebuild again. If they tell him to take a hike after this year - or if his fragile ego finds another job where he feels wanted and leaves on his own accord - we'll be much better off. I've been silent all year regarding Jones because last year so many people were so upset because I was very outspoken against him but I've just had enough of this guy. Get him out of Knoxville, out of the state of Tennessee, and just......away.

He has no one to blame but himself by hiring the head pool boy buddy of his as offensive coordinator and making recruiting promises that his butt couldn't cash. Snake oil salesmen do a good job for a short time before they are found out to be frauds. Some of us knew what we got when this ijit stepped on stage for his introductory press conference. And he sure hasn't made me believe he can coach his way out of a wet paper bag the entire time he's been in Knoxville. He's a perfectly acceptable MAC coach. But he's not SEC level and never will be.

 

[sami]

For those of you saying OH GOD THE SKY IS FALLING WHO ARE WE GOING TO GET? NOBODY WANTS TO COME TO TENNESSEE............WAKE UP!

Okay, let's say Butch isn't the guy to get this program to the next level - I'm inclined to believe that as well, but I have a problem with firing a coach who is still improving his record year to year. I totally agree with the idea that considering bowl eligibility as an achievement is pathetic.

Here's the problem - there are three great coaches in college football, and getting one of them isn't happening. The way to find the next one is most likely taking a shot at a successful guy stepping up, like Florida did with Meyer. Jones fit that mold, but doesn't appear to be 'the guy' at this point. And I agree it's about championships, not bowl appearances.

What I don't want is a retread like Miles, or Jim Mora, or anyone else who couldn't get it done at a big school. Miles won one, but to me he's done as a big time coach. The classic example of what a crapshoot it is would be Charlie Strong, who was a lock to bring Texas back to glory. How'd that work out?

So who in your estimation is on the radar as being a coach ready to take a program to elite level and keep it there? Because if you're going to fire Jones, you better damn well have a plan. Not having a realistic, doable plan in place that can be executed will result in a desperation hire of another loser like Dooley.