LADY VOLS ARE NOW THE #2 TEAM IN THE COUNTRY-THE OFFICIAL TENNESSEE ⚽️ THREAD

#1,926
#1,926
Wow: This sux, frankly. Pensky was turning the Vols into a genuinely strongly national program. We had our best team ever last year--one could argue the '18 team was equally good---and this year we could be even stronger, with all but one starter back. On a soccer board I follow, an FSU fan suggested a few days ago that the job might interest Pensky. I don't know if he knew something or not--but I laughed it off, partly because following Mark Krikorian at FSU will be like following John Wooden in basketball at UCLA. Krikorian has won 3 national titles in the last 8/10 years--but has been in the final four just about every year, and that's pretty damn hard, as collegiate soccer is competitive and the ACC is the nation's best conference.

Pensky will be roughly doubling his salary, it would seem--but I can't imagine that he or anybody will be able to maintain the level set by Krikorian. I view it as a "be careful what you wish for" job. To wit: If Pensky doesn't take the Noles to at least the Final Four (called the College Cup) this fall, Noles fans will consider it an unsuccessful season. But Pensky is ambitous--as we now see, and he's an excellent recruiter--so I wish him well even as I'm completely bummed because this could set back UT's program just when it was gaining serious momentum. Our AD--if he wants to continue the recent success of the program--will need to raise the pay of the head-coach position AND he will need to hire an excellent recruiter. A mediocre recruiter will not cut it. Our success comes from recruiting.

Here's another thing: Are Taylor Huff, Fusco, and others of our best players going to stay at UT or follow Pensky to FSU. The program is likely going to suffer from this development, I"m afraid. It will be interesting to see what associate coach Jon Morgan does now. He took over the Maryland job when Pensky left Maryland to become the UT coach. Morgan did not fare well at Maryland, was sacked after a few years--then joined Pensky here and has done a fine job in his, maybe, seven years here. Our other associate coach, Joe Kirt, as been on the staff even longer. I don't really think either of them will be hired to succeed Pensky. My bet is that Pensky will recommend Morgan for the job--as they are tight, it would seem. If he doesn't get the position, I fully expect him to go to FSU with Pensky. I haven't even read a news story on this yet. As I say, this is disappointing--but I can't blame Pensky for going for the brass ring.
 
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#1,927
#1,927
Here's why this is a risky move for Pensky or anybody that would follow Krikorian. FSU over the last several years has been better than UNC (21 or so national titles), UVA and Duke--three of the best programs in the country, and all in the same conference. While competing against Vandy, Arkansas and South Carolina is not easy, UVA, Duke and UNC are at a higher level and so it wouldn't take much slippage by FSU to suddenly find itself losing matches to its rivals--and that's not going to go down well with the spoiled FSU fan base.
 
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#1,931
#1,931
mad4vols said:
I wonder if Tennessee even had a chance to counteroffer or anything?
Click to expand...

That's a good question. My guess is that given the status of the FSU program and the big jump in pay he's getting, he did not ask for a counter-offer. And why would he expect one? He just got an extension--and presumably a raise--but I strongly suspect that whatever raise he received was rather modest. My bet is that he was not making even $300K annually and probably closer to $250K--maybe a bit more than that if you throw in the soccer camps, but I don't think they generate much money at all.

In contrast, Vitello, our baseball coach, was making $600K annually even when he'd accomplished nothing--nearly 3 times what Pensky and Swimming coach Matt Kredich were getting--and then, simply for getting us to the final 8 last year, got an extension and raise so that now he's making $1.5 MILLION annually. And while baseball pulls in more money from fans than soccer, it's still a nominal amount of money and baseball remains a non-revenue sport, essentially. I'm happy for Vitello, don't get me wrong, and pleased to see our baseball program doing so well. Even so, why would we--or any school--pay one successful non-revenue coach so much more than other successful non-revenue coaches? I think it's unfair--and if you do it you surely run the risk losing your best coaches. Some athletic directors are focused only on revenues and don't seem to care that much about non-revenue sports because they don't generate big money--see FSU. Even UCLA, which has a much more prominent soccer tradition than we do, apparently refuses to pay a salary high enough to attract the best soccer coaching candidates. But who likes having bad or mediocre programs, in any sport? And beyond that, winning programs generate a lot of positive PR for a university, whether or not they are a "revenue" sport.
 
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#1,933
#1,933
turbovol said:
It's of course wrong to say that he was "easily" lured away. FSU is the best program in the country and Pensky doubled his salary. Those are very big and enticing lures.
Click to expand...
You are right, can’t blame him for making the jump. It’s a great honor and a very prestigious position. I’m just still sad about it.
 
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#1,935
#1,935
mad4vols said:
You are right, can’t blame him for making the jump. It’s a great honor and a very prestigious position. I’m just still sad about it.
Click to expand...

I'm completely bummed about it, too. I've been following the program closely since Pensky arrived--partly because it was apparent that he was a good recruiter and so I thought he had a good chance to build a good program. He did--but it took years. Angela Kelly left the talent cupboard bare, and it was five years before Pensky and the program started gaining any real momentum. So to lose our coach three months before we could roll out what might be our best team ever...is awful. And if some of our kids decide to follow Pensky, or just transfer, it will be like starting over--and that will truly sux. I would hope that most stay and play this season for all it could be worth.

Pensky and associate coach Jon Morgan are tight, I think--as they were together at Maryland, where Morgan followed Pensky as head coach. Pensky might have put in a recommendation for Morgan to get the job before leaving--though I doubt White was in a particular receptive mood for next-coach advise. Hiring Morgan might keep our talent in the fold in the short-term--and he seems a very good guy---but he wasn't very successful at Maryland and so I'm not sure if he'd be the right hire. While Pensky is competitive and ambitious, Morgan seems quite a bit more laid-back--that's my sense from afar. If he's not offered the job, I could definitely see him joining Pensky at FSU, as the two are a good recruiting combo, I think.

Because it's late to be finding a new coach, if I'm White I might offer Morgan the job on an interim basis with the understanding that he'll be evaluated on how the team performs this season. If the team excels, they you offer him the permanent job next year. Meanwhile, you put out feelers to other established coaches. The risk of offering Morgan the interim position is that, with all our returning talent, we might very well have a good season--but that doesn't necessarily presage Morgan continuing to recruit as well as Pensky has and continuing to build the program. Lots of coaches, in college and the pros, do well for a year or two after inheriting talented teams--but they can't maintain it, can't recruit/coach as well as the previous coach, and things start to deteriorate. So maybe the interim idea is not so good after all. It's tough. Chris Henderson, a serious women's soccer analyst, just described the Tennessee job as "plum," because of our excellent facilities and talent level--but it takes an excellent coach to keep the position and the program "plum." I think if White were to raise the salary to at least $300K, if not a bit more, hhe could make a strong hire. The Xavier coach is good, as is the Georgetown coach. There are a number of established winners around the country who should be interested.

Somebody on the other board suggested offering the job to Krikorian. Absolutely! But White would have to be prepared to offer him $500K. I doubt White will want to do that--even though landing Krikorian would be a coup and an absolute bargain at that salary. I also can't see Krikorian taking the UT job under any circumstance--but why not give it a go? See if you can get him on campus--our facilities are as good as if not better than FSU's. I think he's thinking pro job now--but you never know. I'm all for being bold.

Who wouldn't have described our women's basketball job as "plum" when Summitt retired. It was uber-plum--but then we screwed it up by hiring the wrong person to succeed Summitt--and six/seven years later it was very plum at all, even with our tradition.
 
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#1,936
#1,936
turbovol said:
I'm completely bummed about it, too. I've been following the program closely since Pensky arrived--partly because it was apparent that he was a good recruiter and so I thought he had a good chance to build a good program. He did--but it took years. Angela Kelly left the talent cupboard bare, and it was five years before Pensky and the program started gaining any real momentum. So to lose our coach three months before we could roll out what might be our best team ever...is awful. And if some of our kids decide to follow Pensky, or just transfer, it will be like starting over--and that will truly sux. I would hope that most stay and play this season for all it could be worth.

Pensky and associate coach Jon Morgan are tight, I think--as they were together at Maryland, where Morgan followed Pensky as head coach. Pensky might have put in a recommendation for Morgan to get the job before leaving--though I doubt White was in a particular receptive mood for next-coach advise. Hiring Morgan might keep our talent in the fold in the short-term--and he seems a very good guy---but he wasn't very successful at Maryland and so I'm not sure if he'd be the right hire. While Pensky is competitive and ambitious, Morgan seems quite a bit more laid-back--that's my sense from afar. If he's not offered the job, I could definitely see him joining Pensky at FSU, as the two are a good recruiting combo, I think.

Because it's late to be finding a new coach, if I'm White I might offer Morgan the job on an interim basis with the understanding that he'll be evaluated on how the team performs this season. If the team excels, they you offer him the permanent job next year. Meanwhile, you put out feelers to other established coaches. The risk of offering Morgan the interim position is that, with all our returning talent, we might very well have a good season--but that doesn't necessarily presage Morgan continuing to recruit as well as Pensky has and continuing to build the program. Lots of coaches, in college and the pros, do well for a year or two after inheriting talented teams--but they can't maintain it, can't recruit/coach as well as the previous coach, and things start to deteriorate. So maybe the interim idea is not so good after all. It's tough. Chris Henderson, a serious women's soccer analyst, just described the Tennessee job as "plum," because of our excellent facilities and talent level--but it takes an excellent coach to keep the position and the program "plum." I think if White were to raise the salary to at least $300K, if not a bit more, hhe could make a strong hire. The Xavier coach is good, as is the Georgetown coach. There are a number of established winners around the country who should be interested.

Somebody on the other board suggested offering the job to Krikorian. Absolutely! But White would have to be prepared to offer him $500K. I doubt White will want to do that--even though landing Krikorian would be a coup and an absolute bargain at that salary. I also can't see Krikorian taking the UT job under any circumstance--but why not give it a go? See if you can get him on campus--our facilities are as good as if not better than FSU's. I think he's thinking pro job now--but you never know. I'm all for being bold.

Who wouldn't have described our women's basketball job as "plum" when Summitt retired. It was uber-plum--but then we screwed it up by hiring the wrong person to succeed Summitt--and six/seven years later it was very plum at all, even with our tradition.
Click to expand...
Morgan and Kirt were both elevated to associate head coaches just two weeks ago, wonder if that means anything. Also last week the director of operations put in her two weeks notice.
 
#1,937
#1,937
turbovol said:
I'm completely bummed about it, too. I've been following the program closely since Pensky arrived--partly because it was apparent that he was a good recruiter and so I thought he had a good chance to build a good program. He did--but it took years. Angela Kelly left the talent cupboard bare, and it was five years before Pensky and the program started gaining any real momentum. So to lose our coach three months before we could roll out what might be our best team ever...is awful. And if some of our kids decide to follow Pensky, or just transfer, it will be like starting over--and that will truly sux. I would hope that most stay and play this season for all it could be worth.

Pensky and associate coach Jon Morgan are tight, I think--as they were together at Maryland, where Morgan followed Pensky as head coach. Pensky might have put in a recommendation for Morgan to get the job before leaving--though I doubt White was in a particular receptive mood for next-coach advise. Hiring Morgan might keep our talent in the fold in the short-term--and he seems a very good guy---but he wasn't very successful at Maryland and so I'm not sure if he'd be the right hire. While Pensky is competitive and ambitious, Morgan seems quite a bit more laid-back--that's my sense from afar. If he's not offered the job, I could definitely see him joining Pensky at FSU, as the two are a good recruiting combo, I think.

Because it's late to be finding a new coach, if I'm White I might offer Morgan the job on an interim basis with the understanding that he'll be evaluated on how the team performs this season. If the team excels, they you offer him the permanent job next year. Meanwhile, you put out feelers to other established coaches. The risk of offering Morgan the interim position is that, with all our returning talent, we might very well have a good season--but that doesn't necessarily presage Morgan continuing to recruit as well as Pensky has and continuing to build the program. Lots of coaches, in college and the pros, do well for a year or two after inheriting talented teams--but they can't maintain it, can't recruit/coach as well as the previous coach, and things start to deteriorate. So maybe the interim idea is not so good after all. It's tough. Chris Henderson, a serious women's soccer analyst, just described the Tennessee job as "plum," because of our excellent facilities and talent level--but it takes an excellent coach to keep the position and the program "plum." I think if White were to raise the salary to at least $300K, if not a bit more, hhe could make a strong hire. The Xavier coach is good, as is the Georgetown coach. There are a number of established winners around the country who should be interested.

Somebody on the other board suggested offering the job to Krikorian. Absolutely! But White would have to be prepared to offer him $500K. I doubt White will want to do that--even though landing Krikorian would be a coup and an absolute bargain at that salary. I also can't see Krikorian taking the UT job under any circumstance--but why not give it a go? See if you can get him on campus--our facilities are as good as if not better than FSU's. I think he's thinking pro job now--but you never know. I'm all for being bold.

Who wouldn't have described our women's basketball job as "plum" when Summitt retired. It was uber-plum--but then we screwed it up by hiring the wrong person to succeed Summitt--and six/seven years later it was very plum at all, even with our tradition.
Click to expand...
I wonder if our raise and extension was an insult to Pensky. Coming off the tournament title he may have expected a bit more money...Just a thought..
 
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#1,938
#1,938
turbovol said:
I'm completely bummed about it, too. I've been following the program closely since Pensky arrived--partly because it was apparent that he was a good recruiter and so I thought he had a good chance to build a good program. He did--but it took years. Angela Kelly left the talent cupboard bare, and it was five years before Pensky and the program started gaining any real momentum. So to lose our coach three months before we could roll out what might be our best team ever...is awful. And if some of our kids decide to follow Pensky, or just transfer, it will be like starting over--and that will truly sux. I would hope that most stay and play this season for all it could be worth.

Pensky and associate coach Jon Morgan are tight, I think--as they were together at Maryland, where Morgan followed Pensky as head coach. Pensky might have put in a recommendation for Morgan to get the job before leaving--though I doubt White was in a particular receptive mood for next-coach advise. Hiring Morgan might keep our talent in the fold in the short-term--and he seems a very good guy---but he wasn't very successful at Maryland and so I'm not sure if he'd be the right hire. While Pensky is competitive and ambitious, Morgan seems quite a bit more laid-back--that's my sense from afar. If he's not offered the job, I could definitely see him joining Pensky at FSU, as the two are a good recruiting combo, I think.

Because it's late to be finding a new coach, if I'm White I might offer Morgan the job on an interim basis with the understanding that he'll be evaluated on how the team performs this season. If the team excels, they you offer him the permanent job next year. Meanwhile, you put out feelers to other established coaches. The risk of offering Morgan the interim position is that, with all our returning talent, we might very well have a good season--but that doesn't necessarily presage Morgan continuing to recruit as well as Pensky has and continuing to build the program. Lots of coaches, in college and the pros, do well for a year or two after inheriting talented teams--but they can't maintain it, can't recruit/coach as well as the previous coach, and things start to deteriorate. So maybe the interim idea is not so good after all. It's tough. Chris Henderson, a serious women's soccer analyst, just described the Tennessee job as "plum," because of our excellent facilities and talent level--but it takes an excellent coach to keep the position and the program "plum." I think if White were to raise the salary to at least $300K, if not a bit more, hhe could make a strong hire. The Xavier coach is good, as is the Georgetown coach. There are a number of established winners around the country who should be interested.

Somebody on the other board suggested offering the job to Krikorian. Absolutely! But White would have to be prepared to offer him $500K. I doubt White will want to do that--even though landing Krikorian would be a coup and an absolute bargain at that salary. I also can't see Krikorian taking the UT job under any circumstance--but why not give it a go? See if you can get him on campus--our facilities are as good as if not better than FSU's. I think he's thinking pro job now--but you never know. I'm all for being bold.

Who wouldn't have described our women's basketball job as "plum" when Summitt retired. It was uber-plum--but then we screwed it up by hiring the wrong person to succeed Summitt--and six/seven years later it was very plum at all, even with our tradition.
Click to expand...
You mentioned that it’s late in finding a coach, that’s what is the most disappointing part of the timing in all of this and kind of reminds me of the way Kiffin left.
 
#1,939
#1,939
mad4vols said:
You mentioned that it’s late in finding a coach, that’s what is the most disappointing part of the timing in all of this and kind of reminds me of the way Kiffin left.
Click to expand...

You took the words out of my mouth when you mentioned Kiffin. I had the same thought. Kiffin was a bold hire--I loved it--and I'm convinced that, though he's got some flaws, he would have turned our football program into a powerhouse in a few short years. He put together a seriously good staff his first year. But then we got very unlucky when his dream job, USC, came open unexpectedly (he had coached there for years early in his career) and we ended up getting screwed with both the timing and fact of his sudden departure--not enough time to do a thorough coaching search. I lot of coaches spend 15/20 years or longer at the same school--but others change jobs pretty regularly, depending on their situations and opportunities. Until today I hadn't really thought about why we would give a new baseball coach $600K to start--then after one successful year more than double his salary--while well established and successful other non-rev coaches (swimming, men's tennis, soccer) get paid one-fifth as much. That's a problem.
 
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#1,942
#1,942
B5C41907-9ECD-46E1-900B-C565520B8416.jpeg

rose-come-back.gif
 
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#1,945
#1,945
mad4vols said:
I had read he was going to Tufts in Boston, maybe that will change
Click to expand...

Well, I know nothing about his son's playing skills--but Tufts is a Div. III school athletically, so if that is his (or anyone's level), he's not going to switch to Div. 1.

White, Kirk and Morgan need to make a major effort to keep our kids in the fold. We have a chance to be very good next year--and is someone playes make rash decisions to transfer they could screw up our team--and their careers. This is the immediate priority.
 
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#1,946
#1,946
So much money is being spent on Tennessee athletics right now: renovating Neyland, major upgrade coming to Lindsey Nelson stadium, coaches' salaries... million$ in NIL MONEY!!!

The gov't is spending money it will never have, the middle class (once ticket buyers) have seen their paychecks and worth dwindle, inflation appears to be rising unabated, while a huge chunk of global wealth was transferred into the accounts of the top 5% during the COVID shutdown.

College enrollment is falling nationwide as the value of a higher education is more in doubt than ever, while college tuition has continued to rise faster than almost anything else. WHERE IS THE A.D.'s MONEY COMING FROM?

In this environment, it makes no sense for people, for institutions, to be spending more money.
But they are.

What do they foresee?
 
#1,947
#1,947
Pensky 's base salary was raised from $185,000 to $250,000 in his last contract. According to an internet site comparing college soccer coaches... the top salaries ranged from $103,000 to $220,000. Not sure how accurate those are...
It's the internet. But based on that it would appear Pensky was fairly compensated. I truly believe AD White knows what top coaches make and Pensky was compensated accordingly. Baseball has become a nuclear war and AD White is trying to fix football which provides the money for all "non revenue" sports.

No disrespect to Pensky, I think he did a good job. However, it's taken 12 years to be relevant. Correct me if I am wrong, but I think he won the East Division his last two years and the Conference Tournament last year.

My problem with him was every big game, we seemed to have, when I listened or watched , our star player was always playing for their national team or our best player would be playing on our under 18 or under 20 team. I get it but it was difficult to understand.
 
#1,950
#1,950
BruisedOrange said:
So much money is being spent on Tennessee athletics right now: renovating Neyland, major upgrade coming to Lindsey Nelson stadium, coaches' salaries... million$ in NIL MONEY!!!

The gov't is spending money it will never have, the middle class (once ticket buyers) have seen their paychecks and worth dwindle, inflation appears to be rising unabated, while a huge chunk of global wealth was transferred into the accounts of the top 5% during the COVID shutdown.

College enrollment is falling nationwide as the value of a higher education is more in doubt than ever, while college tuition has continued to rise faster than almost anything else. WHERE IS THE A.D.'s MONEY COMING FROM?

In this environment, it makes no sense for people, for institutions, to be spending more money.
But they are.

What do they foresee?
Click to expand...
Conference and television contracts....shoe and uni. Deals..the money is there
 
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