What if Pearl were 100% out of the picture?

#26
#26
CCM will be here next year. But I'm afraid this time next year, there will not be one supporter for him and it will cost us more to get rid of him.
 
#27
#27
C-town Vol said:
Personally, I think if Bruce was out of the picture (as opposed to still living in Knoxville, still talking about the Vols and about to come to the end of his show cause) then the majority of the fan base would be jumping all in with Martin on this run and way fewer would be calling for his head...they would be more willing to let the season play out before making judgment. But with Pearl sitting there for the taking it is difficult to not want him back. I will admit I am a Pearl fan. If Cuonzo took the team to the Final Four this year I think I would still want to hire Pearl. In part because I just love Pearl. In part because a magical run in the post season doesn't wipe out the body of work Martin has built thus far. However, if Pearl were out of the picture I would likely be much more in a wait and see mode.

Just trying to be transparent.
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Martin has been able to get three solid seasons at U.T. He has not ended with embarassing records. He can also recruit. He is a good ambassador for the University.

However;


After having the excitable personality of Pearl, who is jumping and yelling on the side, then Martin comes in and puts us to sleep. It is a big contrast.

Also, I just can't get over the close games that we keep losing. It seems, ( I may be wrong though) that with Pearl, we found ways to win the close games.

Lofton's three pointers. Bradshaws steal against Florida. etc. etc.


A 20 plus winning season is something to be proud of. In the modern era of Tennessee basketball, we have missed the NCAA tourney far many more times than we qualified for it. And we had far many more teen wins than 20 plus wins for the season.

So, it isn't like we have been a Duke, UNC, etc. type program for 5 decades.
 
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#28
#28
C-town Vol said:
Personally, I think if Bruce was out of the picture (as opposed to still living in Knoxville, still talking about the Vols and about to come to the end of his show cause) then the majority of the fan base would be jumping all in with Martin on this run and way fewer would be calling for his head...they would be more willing to let the season play out before making judgment. But with Pearl sitting there for the taking it is difficult to not want him back. I will admit I am a Pearl fan. If Cuonzo took the team to the Final Four this year I think I would still want to hire Pearl. In part because I just love Pearl. In part because a magical run in the post season doesn't wipe out the body of work Martin has built thus far. However, if Pearl were out of the picture I would likely be much more in a wait and see mode.

Just trying to be transparent.
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Appreciate your honesty. IMO, it's opinions like yours from so many UT fans that doom Cuonzo, regardless of what happens the rest of this year. I truly believe he keeps his job (unless the admin decides, screw it, let's just re-hire Bruce-very unlikely). Next year will likely be a step back due to the talent we lose this year, and Cuonzo will likely be fired. Counzo will pay the price for simply not being Bruce Pearl. Hopefully the guy after CM will be someone the fans can get behind, and we can all move on and support the program. Otherwise our program will be relegated back to the Wade Houston/Kevin O'neal days.
 
#31
#31
VolFan_N_NC said:
If Pearl were out of the picture, then the majority of the fan base would still be talking about the next coach. Don't be blinded by the fact that we have beaten up on some REALLY bad teams recently.

Martin has proved that he is not fit for the job, no matter what kind of run he makes in the NCAAT.
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So again, if we made the Final Four (you said no matter what kind of run we make in the NCAAT), are you saying we still should fire him?
 
#33
#33
volanatic said:
I also am still a Pearl fan over Martin. I think he is way better for this bball program than Martin. I will support Martin while he is here but if I had my choice I'd take Bruce back in a heartbeat. Also, remember that fans have waited to see how it played out. I remind you we are in year three, and once again on the bubble in a "favorable" position. Bruce took all 6 teams to NCAA including teams with a roster of less talented players. That being said, I hope Martin does in fact succeed and continue to improve in this league. The Texas A&M debacles are mostly what has put us in this very familiar position, and you have to be able to motivate your players consistently to avoid these unnecessary losses year after year.
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to be fair, Pearl had some VERY talented teams (lofton chism smith teams was much more talented than this one)
 
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#34
#34
VolsSportsFan said:
So again, if we made the Final Four (you said no matter what kind of run we make in the NCAAT), are you saying we still should fire him?
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Hell, if we make the final four with this poorly coached team you can name the university after him. But there's really no point in debating that.
 
#35
#35
C-town Vol said:
Personally, I think if Bruce was out of the picture (as opposed to still living in Knoxville, still talking about the Vols and about to come to the end of his show cause) then the majority of the fan base would be jumping all in with Martin on this run and way fewer would be calling for his head...they would be more willing to let the season play out before making judgment. But with Pearl sitting there for the taking it is difficult to not want him back. I will admit I am a Pearl fan. If Cuonzo took the team to the Final Four this year I think I would still want to hire Pearl. In part because I just love Pearl. In part because a magical run in the post season doesn't wipe out the body of work Martin has built thus far. However, if Pearl were out of the picture I would likely be much more in a wait and see mode.

Just trying to be transparent.
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Yeah, it's nice we're winning some, but, you said it yourself. A little run doesn't make up for this season, last season, or the season before. I've seen enough.:thumbsup:
GO VOLS!
 
#36
#36
I haven't been happy with Martin at certain points, but could we please stop acting as if he's winning 10 games a year instead of 20?
 
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#37
#37
VolFan_N_NC said:
Hell, if we make the final four with this poorly coached team you can name the university after him. But there's really no point in debating that.
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But that's been pretty much the point of this thread; people saying even if we made the Final Four, they would want Pearl back next season.
 
#39
#39
For many reasons as previously stated, my hope is another job opportunity presents itself to Martin and he accepts.
 
#40
#40
I really don't care about Pearl. I mean, I do. I'd love to have him back. But Pearl or not, my position is that Zo is not a good coach and should not be UT coach. Step 1 is to fire Zo. Step 2 is to find a suitable replacement. Whether that replacement is Pearl or someone else doesn't change Step 1.
 
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#41
#41
JackHVFL said:
to be fair, Pearl had some VERY talented teams (lofton chism smith teams was much more talented than this one)
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Agreed. That's why I said "including" less talented teams. The Elite 8 bunch was a very talented team, as we're a couple of the Chris Lofton/Jujuan Smith teams. Still, hard for anyone to argue that he didn't do more with less, at least at first.
 
#42
#42
NYC Vol said:
I really don't care about Pearl. I mean, I do. I'd love to have him back. But Pearl or not, my position is that Zo is not a good coach and should not be UT coach. Step 1 is to fire Zo. Step 2 is to find a suitable replacement. Whether that replacement is Pearl or someone else doesn't change Step 1.
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Hypothetical...

Let's say Zo gets this team into the NCAA, and they don't win a game, are you for firing him? What about win 1 game? What about making the sweet 16? Or are you for firing him regardless of the outcome of this season?

What if I told you his replacement will be a Larry Eustachy, Donnie Tyndall, Michael White type? Are you still for firing him only to replace him with someone similar?
 
#43
#43
volanatic said:
I also am still a Pearl fan over Martin. I think he is way better for this bball program than Martin. I will support Martin while he is here but if I had my choice I'd take Bruce back in a heartbeat. Also, remember that fans have waited to see how it played out. I remind you we are in year three, and once again on the bubble in a "favorable" position. Bruce took all 6 teams to NCAA including teams with a roster of less talented players. That being said, I hope Martin does in fact succeed and continue to improve in this league. The Texas A&M debacles are mostly what has put us in this very familiar position, and you have to be able to motivate your players consistently to avoid these unnecessary losses year after year.
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I too like Pearl, but what if this team had played defense even close to the way they have the last 4 games when conf. play began? This is a group of upper classmen. Did Martin only start teaching them how to play defense two weeks ago? The difference is like night and day. I've got to put this as much on the players as the coaching staff. The difference is mostly an increased effort on the players part.

Right or wrong, I do not believe Bruce will even be considered by the athletic dept. if a coaching change is made this year.
 
#44
#44
GAVol said:
I haven't been happy with Martin at certain points, but could we please stop acting as if he's winning 10 games a year instead of 20?
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I will admit that part of Martin's problems come from our impatience spilling over from several years of mediocrity in the football program, which is unfortunate for him. But at the same time, why should I not call it like I see it when are in a position to make 3 straight NITs with a team talented enough to be solidly in the Big Dance?
 
#45
#45
NYC Vol said:
I really don't care about Pearl. I mean, I do. I'd love to have him back. But Pearl or not, my position is that Zo is not a good coach and should not be UT coach. Step 1 is to fire Zo. Step 2 is to find a suitable replacement. Whether that replacement is Pearl or someone else doesn't change Step 1.
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Please list some examples of "suitable replacements". Let me guess, Shaka Smart and Greg Marshall would be on that list, right? In the event they turn us down, who would be next?
 
#47
#47
As has been posted several times in this forum, if Hart fired Martin after winning 20+ games and making the tournament (coupled with averaging 20+ wins during his tenure at TN) then GOOD LUCK finding an upper level replacement. Any big name coach would be insane to take a job where 20+ wins/yr isn't acceptable without a guarantee of insane money... I might be wrong though.

Also, can we stop pretending like this team is the 98' Bulls. I know there were some lofty preseason expectations, but a lot of those were predicated on Maymon being his pre-injury self and that hasn't happened. This team has definitely underachieved at points this season, but there aren't many teams in the country who don't have WTF losses.

Good luck in the tourney and GBO!!!
 
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#48
#48
pierce60 said:
Also, can we stop pretending like this team is the 98' Bulls. I know there were some lofty preseason expectations, but a lot of those were predicated on Maymon being his pre-injury self and that hasn't happened. This team has definitely underachieved at points this season, but there aren't many teams in the country who don't have WTF losses.

Good luck in the tourney and GBO!!!
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Don't forget we all expected for Hubbs to come in and be an impact freshman too. That was a huge loss for the team IMO.

Also Barton wasn't the shooter he was at Memphis until just recently. We can see how well this team is now that he is playing at his level.
 
#49
#49
Maymon had an excellent season. He lowered his turnovers significantly from two years ago, raised his free throw shooting %, raised his blocks per game and raised his rebounds. He still shot 53% from the floor and averaged 10.2 points per game vs 12 two years ago. With Stokes and Jordan having much bigger roles in the offense than two years ago, those are great for Jeronne.

It's a fallacy to try and say we're worse than expected this year because he wasn't the player he was two years ago. He's pretty much the same exact player he was two years ago statistically.

Barton was the player he was at Memphis, at Memphis he was a bench level player who occasionally had big games. That's him in a nutshell this season. We just haven't been able to afford to keep him on the bench because Thompson never developed this season.

I'll give you that more was expected from Hubbs. Not sure when the shoulder injury happened, but he didn't look great at any point this year, and some who saw him play a lot in high school questioned how he was a 5 star during his senior year and this summer.
 
#50
#50
40Cap said:
Please list some examples of "suitable replacements". Let me guess, Shaka Smart and Greg Marshall would be on that list, right? In the event they turn us down, who would be next?
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Kind of the point of my hypothetical. Nobody here knows Dave Hart's mindset if a move is made. He has however made it known financials are still a major issue. So if a move was made, do you really wanna fire Zo for a coach like Tyndall, White, Wade or Eustachy.
 
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