Cruitin' Forum Football Talk V

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#701
#701
Yes, these class rankings are not as indicative of our talent level as they should be: we've had plenty of defections and Dooley did not recruit for posterity on the lines and in the LB core. But, to Ron's point, do not underestimate the significance of competent coaching. That team last year should have won 8 or 9 games with a competent head coach and a competent defensive scheme (ie Wilcox).
 
#705
#705
Somebody just needed to make themselves useful by writing an article that would garner semi-national attention for a few moments.
 
#707
#707
allvol_12 said:
Most of those players that boosted up those class rankings either got kicked off, or are not here. A couple of those classes would be in the 30's or worse now...

Mainly speaking of 2012
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Vandy (or every other team we play) doesn't also experience attrition? Sure they do. We have much more talent on our roster than Vandy does. Losing Bray, Hunter and CP early to the NFL just gives the group of highly rated players behind them the opportunity to play now.
 
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#708
#708
allvol_12 said:
Most of those players that boosted up those class rankings either got kicked off, or are not here. A couple of those classes would be in the 30's or worse now...

Mainly speaking of 2012
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we havent had that much attrition - i mean vandy only signed 4 4 star guys total in 2009,2010,2011,2012 - the talent level isnt even close
 
#709
#709
Ron Swanson said:
Rivals rankings:

2010, UT - 9th, VU - 61st

2011, UT - 13th, VU - 70th

2012, UT - 17th, VU - 29th

2013, UT - 21st, VU - 19th

The only class Vandy comes close to UT is 2013 and very few of them will make an impact this fall anyway. And yes, UT has lost quite a few due to attrition and going to the NFL early but still, UT has waaaaaay more talent than Vandy. We've just had awful coaching the last few years.

And I'm not trying to call you out, Kingston, you're a good poster. I'm just trying to point out that we shouldn't lose to Vanderbilt and the only reason we did last year is because of awful coaching, not a lack of talent. I expect UT to destroy them this fall.
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Not trying to call u out but I disagree that our talent has been waaaay better. Did u see ours guys at their pro day couple weeks ago? Talk about stinkin it up man it was terrible, especially compared to nfl standards nfl standards. Only one that was decent was CP and everyone here know he doesn't have the greatest catching ability. Also hunter was not the same player as he was before his injury. And our lineman and dbs were slower than Christmas.
If people be honest on this board then they will acknowledge that dooley n company wasn't only "bad" coaches but also "bad" recruiters as well. We got our buttt handed to us by vandy fair n square. Hate to say it but its truth man. Pains me to say that cause I can't stand vandy. And I like franklin even less.....here's to butch n co for gettin done in 13'....GBO
 
#710
#710
We got beat by Vandy because Franklin is a better coach than Dooley.

Those slower than Christmas DB's were apart of a top 30 D the year before. Coaching was the problem in 2012. Why is that so hard to see? And those DB's are gone now, faster DB's will be on the field this fall.
 
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#711
#711
I'm not complaining in the least little bit but I'd really like to see some recruiting momentum with some big uglies on both sides of the ball. It's probably a toss-up as to whether both lines, LB, and DB are bigger needs, as you could make convincing arguments for all four, but I haven't heard many linemen mention UT....yet.
 
#712
#712
Ron Swanson said:
We got beat by Vandy because Franklin is a better coach than Dooley.

Those slower than Christmas DB's were apart of a top 30 D the year before. Coaching was the problem in 2012. Why is that so hard to see? And those DB's are gone now, faster DB's will be on the field this fall.
Click to expand...

Cant beleive you're having to argue this.

Guess you'll be explaining that water is actually wet next.
 
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#713
#713
SCvol333 said:
we havent had that much attrition - i mean vandy only signed 4 4 star guys total in 2009,2010,2011,2012 - the talent level isnt even close
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So a 4 star by rivals means they automatically play at that level? Correct?
 
#714
#714
Ron Swanson said:
We got beat by Vandy because Franklin is a better coach than Dooley.

Those slower than Christmas DB's were apart of a top 30 D the year before. Coaching was the problem in 2012. Why is that so hard to see? And those DB's are gone now, faster DB's will be on the field this fall.
Click to expand...

People also like to forget Waggner's ball skills because of how slow he was. When he was in a scheme that didn't consistently put him one-on-one with a burner, he was making plays. A switch back to a 4-3 covers some of our lack of athleticism problems on the back end of our defense and will make us see improvement. My only worry for this year is pass rushing.
 
#715
#715
allvol_12 said:
So a 4 star by rivals means they automatically play at that level? Correct?
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No, but when one team has 40 of them and the other has 4 I think it is fair to say the one with 40 is going to have more talent the vast majority of the time
 
#716
#716
Ron Swanson said:
We got beat by Vandy because Franklin is a better coach than Dooley.

Those slower than Christmas DB's were apart of a top 30 D the year before. Coaching was the problem in 2012. Why is that so hard to see? And those DB's are gone now, faster DB's will be on the field this fall.
Click to expand...

The same coaches that you, optimist Ron, believed would succeed last year?

Yeah, they sucked, but we don't have alot of talent this year. The homer in you is coming out again saying the talent difference is not close. But, as expected.
 
#717
#717
Ron Swanson said:
We got beat by Vandy because Franklin is a better coach than Dooley.

Those slower than Christmas DB's were apart of a top 30 D the year before. Coaching was the problem in 2012. Why is that so hard to see? And those DB's are gone now, faster DB's will be on the field this fall.
Click to expand...

Haha....not disagreeing with u bout the coaching...it was terrible and u don't have to explain it cause I AGREE with u.......but......I'm just saying that based off of our pro day a couple weeks ago that maybe our talent was alittle suspect as well. In other words....it seems to me that dooley was not only a bad coach....but....poor recruiter too.
Now....I think CP has tons of talent as a runner but not as a pass catcher...especially for what nfl expects to see. I hope he proves me wrong tho because I am a fan!...I hope all of our guys become great pros!!
 
#718
#718
allvol_12 said:
The same coaches that you, optimist Ron, believed would succeed last year?

Yeah, they sucked, but we don't have alot of talent this year. The homer in you is coming out again saying the talent difference is not close. But, as expected.
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I wasn't the only one who thought Sunseri was a good hire. If Wilcox was coaching the D last year the Vols would have won 9+. Sunseri ended up being an awful hire.

We don't have a lot of talent? Says who? The recruiting services say we do and with good coaching we'll see plenty of talent this fall.

How can you argue, with a straight face, that Vandy is close to the talent level of UT? I don't get it.

Sorry for being an optimist and seeing the positives in my favorite team, my bad.
 
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#719
#719
TennesseeStudVOL said:
Haha....not disagreeing with u bout the coaching...it was terrible and u don't have to explain it cause I AGREE with u.......but......I'm just saying that based off of our pro day a couple weeks ago that maybe our talent was alittle suspect as well. In other words....it seems to me that dooley was not only a bad coach....but....poor recruiter too.
Now....I think CP has tons of talent as a runner but not as a pass catcher...especially for what nfl expects to see. I hope he proves me wrong tho because I am a fan!...I hope all of our guys become great pros!!
Click to expand...

Dooley didn't recruit P. Wags and Teague. He inherited them from Kiffin/Fulmer.
 
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#720
#720
TennesseeStudVOL said:
Haha....not disagreeing with u bout the coaching...it was terrible and u don't have to explain it cause I AGREE with u.......but......I'm just saying that based off of our pro day a couple weeks ago that maybe our talent was alittle suspect as well. In other words....it seems to me that dooley was not only a bad coach....but....poor recruiter too.
Now....I think CP has tons of talent as a runner but not as a pass catcher...especially for what nfl expects to see. I hope he proves me wrong tho because I am a fan!...I hope all of our guys become great pros!!
Click to expand...

Dooley didn't recruit the guys you're referring to. They were Fulmer and Kiffin recruits.
 
#722
#722
Ron Swanson said:
We got beat by Vandy because Franklin is a better coach than Dooley.

Those slower than Christmas DB's were apart of a top 30 D the year before. Coaching was the problem in 2012. Why is that so hard to see? And those DB's are gone now, faster DB's will be on the field this fall.
Click to expand...

On top of coaching, Sal put weight on just about everyone on D. Obesity loves company or something like that....

I agree that we don't have an elite D, but all things were equal except coaching on D in 12 and 13 for the most part.
 
#723
#723
Don't be surprised if Dann Kabala joins the Tennessee football office as a key member of the Vols' recruiting efforts. Kabala has been at Pittsburgh but has a sterling reputation and previous SEC experience at Arkansas.

-VQ

Kabala will help out with the logistics and marketing of recruiting. He will help oversee official/unofficial visits.

Dann Kabala - ArkansasRazorbacks.com - Official Site of Arkansas Razorback Athletics

Dann Kabala Bio - PittsburghPanthers.com - University of Pittsburgh Official Athletic Site

Since arriving on campus, Kabala has helped the football team achieve the highest team GPA in the history of the Razorbacks. He also initiated the Game Day Guest Professor program, organized the first annual Razorback scholar-athlete breakfast, implemented the football academic game plan and restructured the entire football academic program. He also has been named to two University Committees, the curriculum review committee and the new university graphic identity committee.
 
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#724
#724
Ron Swanson said:
I wasn't the only one who thought Sunseri was a good hire. If Wilcox was coaching the D last year the Vols would have won 9+. Sunseri ended up being an awful hire.

We don't have a lot of talent? Says who? The recruiting services say we do and with good coaching we'll see plenty of talent this fall.

How can you argue, with a straight face, that Vandy is close to the talent level of UT? I don't get it.

Sorry for being an optimist and seeing the positives in my favorite team, my bad.
Click to expand...
Ok, without quoting Hubbs, who is gonna magically appear as a pass rusher? Our LB core is awful. Our Corners? They gonna improve that much? We have a good O-line, but the offense may not be pretty.

So yes, I can say that we are not that much more talented. I could care less about the recruiting services. I like being a realist about things.
 
#725
#725
Ron Swanson said:
You honestly think Vandy's talent level is almost on par with UT right now? I think many of us are just used to bad coaching, which makes our talent level look much worse than it really is. Good coaching on defense last fall and we would have played in a January bowl game.
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We could've (maybe should've) been in the SEC championship game last fall with the talent we had on offense. But most of that talent is gone. Our great offensive line is back, but they don't score points. The QB play is what scares me the most. If Peterman or Worley can just limit their mistakes I think we'll be fine. But I'll believe it when I see it.
 
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