How long will CJH’s tenure at Tennessee be?

[EastTNVol6240]

It’s funny watching you go post to post commenting the same thing in the same order begging for attention comparing a coach with zero losing seasons to the previous coaches who had multiple.

You have such limited football knowledge your inability to give realistic comparisons to anyone else really is the funniest thing on this forum. It’s like a free clown show.

When “limited football knowledge” = I’m mad because you want to hold our 10 mil coach responsible for the product on the field. Funny how some refuse to assign 0 responsibility where it deserves to be placed.

 

[VFL-82-JP]

For the SEC coaches that had above a .750 win %, here is how Fulmer fared:

Richt = 3-5
Saban (LSU) = 1-2
Miles = 1-2
Spurrier = 3-7
Meyer = 0-4
Stallings = 2-1-1
Saban (Alabama) = 0-2

Total = 10-23-1 (.303)

Richt was not a .750+ coach. Not even if you only look at his UGa years (his Miami time was worse). He went 145-51 over 15 seasons in Athens. That's a .739 win rate. Close to your floor, but doesn't meet it.

Miles was not a .750+ coach. He was .596 lifetime, and .694 at LSU specifically.

Spurrier was only a .750+ coach if you ONLY look at his time in Florida. Include South Carolina and Duke, and he was .717.

Stallings was not a .750+ coach. Not even if you only look at his Bama years. He went 62-25 over seven seasons in Tuscaloosa, 1990-1996 inclusive. That's a nice win rate (somewhere around 71%), but doesn't meet the floor you set.

The point is that a .750 career win rate is really rare and special. Even most of the guys you put on this short list didn't achieve it. You are comparing Fulmer to the very best coaches in the SEC (plus Stallings), and want us to be shocked he sometimes lost? Heh.

Fulmer was right on the borderline as a .750 coach (.745). He achieved a win rate beyond most of the guys on your list (all but Saban and Meyer). We ought to respect him for that, not look for angles to diminish his accomplishments on behalf of our program.

Go Vols!

 

[vols40]

Richt is second only to Kirby at UGA all-time. The only thing Richt did not have was a natty. While Kirby has ramped it up a notch, any UGA fan truly unhappy with Richt has to be cousins to some our our VN fans. Kirby has about 5 more seasons to have a true total games comparison between the two, so if UGA sprinkles in a few sub-par seasons in today's landscape, won't be much separating them but a couple natty's.

Fulmer had 7 seasons of 15 or 16 (?) with 9 or less wins. Almost half. And we consider that the golden age of Vol ball outside Neyland. Only reason he got a pass was the one Natty and two SEC. Considering his recruiting prowess and rosters, he was the poster child for under-achieving.

As for Natty's Kirby didn't get his first until season 6 and went back to back.

And one was against TCU.

 

[vols40]

When “limited football knowledge” = I’m mad because you want to hold our 10 mil coach responsible for the product on the field. Funny how some refuse to assign 0 responsibility where it deserves to be placed.

10-15% max on the staff. 85-90% on player execution

 

[vols40]

Im guessing you dont know Fulmer was 5-0 against teams ranked #1 during his tenure plus 44-37 against ranked teams
You're read to many whiney team forums

Are you comparing the roster that Fulmer had to what Josh inherited?

 

[EastTNVol6240]

10-15% max on the staff. 85-90% on player execution

I understand what you’re getting at. And there is plenty of individual responsibility to be around. But at the end of the day it all falls on the staff. That’s the way ownership works. I’m willing to bet even Heup would give you the ol “it all falls on me”. If he’s a leader worth anything he would anyway.

Something as simple as tackling. Maybe we need to line them up in a 6 year old drill and go over fundamentals again. Not catching the ball? Maybe they need two hours on the machine? While all are individual tasks, the coach is paid for executed wins at the end of the day.

 

[roadvol]

Not at all. Haupel has done a fantastic job with the dumpster fire he inherited.
Maybe not making myself clear. My bad.
My whole point is that i fear the same type of fans thay were never satisfied after the 98 NC season are repeating themselves that will result in another decade + era of self destruction

Are you comparing the roster that Fulmer had to what Josh inherited?

Ll

 

[roadvol]

Well, he’s going to finish 7-5 this year, with zero quality wins & losses to every team on the schedule with a pulse. Next year will be similar IMO, he might get 8 wins, at best. Then the ‘27 season will bottom out after all the momentum is gone after two bad years in a row & showing clear regression from the first few years. Danny will pull the plug & Tennessee will be at least a semi-attractive job again.

That thinking is how we become another afterthought in NCAA football. You have to realize with the NIL and transfer portal college football is not the same and never will be again.
Gone are the days when a good coach and program could build a powerhouse in 3-4 years .
Every year is a crapshoot.
Your roster has a huge turnover and the odds are even great coaches are going to miss on a transfer or key injuries will ruin your season due to lack of depth due to transfers. Remember if a talented kid doesnt think hes being used to his satifaction...hes gone. No depth .
We had a mediocre year, we lost some key players in the tranfer and even more to injuries..it happens.
Hell...Bama didnt make the pkayoffs last year.

 

[Volanta]

guys we got an amazing coach---hes our guy. keep recriting and developing well. also CJH has shown the ability to make imporvements in the offseason. thats all you can ask for. he sees where he can get better and does it. respect.

 

[roadvol]

Not even close to the same thing

Really?
Fulmer averaged clode to 10 wins a year gor his entire career when we only played 11 regulsr season games and he was the primsry recruiter for the players he inherited .
He inherited a program that had been extremely inconsistant over the previous decade and made one of the winningest programs in the NCAA for the next decade.( 102 wins in the 90's)
Maybe different but similar in the program trajectory

 

[Volfan8282]

Richt was not a .750+ coach. Not even if you only look at his UGa years (his Miami time was worse). He went 145-51 over 15 seasons in Athens. That's a .739 win rate. Close to your floor, but doesn't meet it.

Miles was not a .750+ coach. He was .596 lifetime, and .694 at LSU specifically.

Spurrier was only a .750+ coach if you ONLY look at his time in Florida. Include South Carolina and Duke, and he was .717.

Stallings was not a .750+ coach. Not even if you only look at his Bama years. He went 62-25 over seven seasons in Tuscaloosa, 1990-1996 inclusive. That's a nice win rate (somewhere around 71%), but doesn't meet the floor you set.

The point is that a .750 career win rate is really rare and special. Even most of the guys you put on this short list didn't achieve it. You are comparing Fulmer to the very best coaches in the SEC (plus Stallings), and want us to be shocked he sometimes lost? Heh.

Fulmer was right on the borderline as a .750 coach (.745). He achieved a win rate beyond most of the guys on your list (all but Saban and Meyer). We ought to respect him for that, not look for angles to diminish his accomplishments on behalf of our program.

Go Vols!

I did this analysis a long time ago. Back in 2010. And I think I was only looking at SEC records. Good catches there.

Stallings record is impacted bc of forfeited games. Do with that what you will. Otherwise, he had over 80% win % at Bama.

Fulmer didn’t “sometimes” lose to these guys… 10-23 is getting consistently outmatched. And denigrating some of these guys to say they had a lower win % actually hurts your argument in my opinion. Fulmer beat up on bad SEC coaches and struggled against good/great SEC coaches.

 

[BernardKingGOAT]

Really?
Fulmer averaged clode to 10 wins a year gor his entire career when we only played 11 regulsr season games and he was the primsry recruiter for the players he inherited .
He inherited a program that had been extremely inconsistant over the previous decade and made one of the winningest programs in the NCAA for the next decade.( 102 wins in the 90's)
Maybe different but similar in the program trajectory

I wasn't questioning Fulmer's coaching. The timing and situations are totally different. Especially in the shape of the program when they took over. Your take on the history isn't totally accurate either. We had won 3 SEC titles in the previous 7 years prior to taking over as HC. Nevertheless, Fulmer's last 4 years were nothing like the last 4 from Heupel. That's why it's totally different. And Fulmer actually was on the hot seat after 2005. Heupel isn't on the hot seat at all. That's why the scenarios are totally different. We have a minority of know-nothings on a message board blasting Heupel now. In 2008, there was a much different set of people putting the pressure on Fulmer. Plus Heupel doesn't behave in pressers now like Fulmer was his last few year. Huge difference. Fulmer didn't have a top ten finish in any of his last 7 years. Heupel had a top 5 and top ten in 2 of his first four years

 

[#1fulmerite]

By the time Fulmer took over, Johnny had made us consistent in the winning column but, would lose “the big game” every year. Add into that, they SEC coaching carousel had just started revolving, somewhat. When Fulmer took over, it was in full swing and except for Spurrier and Florida, he was able to take advantage. Saying that, by the end of Spurrier’s tenure at Florida, Fulmer had us toe to toe with him. The problem for Fulmer, and I readily admit it, was the increase in coaching talent coming into the SEC. With that, he wasn’t able to get the out of state kids he and Majors once did.

 

[VFL-82-JP]

I did this analysis a long time ago. Back in 2010. And I think I was only looking at SEC records. Good catches there.

Stallings record is impacted bc of forfeited games. Do with that what you will. Otherwise, he had over 80% win % at Bama.

Fulmer didn’t “sometimes” lose to these guys… 10-23 is getting consistently outmatched. And denigrating some of these guys to say they had a lower win % actually hurts your argument in my opinion. Fulmer beat up on bad SEC coaches and struggled against good/great SEC coaches.

Yah, but that cuts both ways.

If Fulmer's .745 win rate is better than everyone on that list not named Saban or Meyer, and he was losing to them...who were they losing to? They lost even more than he did. Was it mostly to "bad SEC coaches"? They were sure losing more than just to each other.

Worth thinking about.

All in all, Fulmer is objectively the third-best coach on that list. One could argue Spurrier was better, but you'd have to isolate him to JUST Florida. Nothing before or after could count.

Go Vols!

 

[Volfan8282]

Yah, but that cuts both ways.

If Fulmer's .745 win rate is better than everyone on that list not named Saban or Meyer, and he was losing to them...who were they losing to? They lost even more than he did. Was it mostly to "bad SEC coaches"? They were sure losing more than just to each other.

Worth thinking about.

All in all, Fulmer is objectively the third-best coach on that list. One could argue Spurrier was better, but you'd have to isolate him to JUST Florida. Nothing before or after could count.

Go Vols!

Spurrier was at Duke and South Carolina. Dude had three straight 11-2 seasons at SC. He was 1000% better than Fulmer.

 

[Hairy Vols]

When “limited football knowledge” = I’m mad because you want to hold our 10 mil coach responsible for the product on the field. Funny how some refuse to assign 0 responsibility where it deserves to be placed.

I can’t control your perspective. If your idea of holding someone responsible is irrational over emotional fits after every single loss than have at it. Nobody says you’re not allowed to criticize. Nobody says you’re not allowed to subjugate Heupel to the product you see, but when done with personal bias and limited range of conversation you due your side of the argument a disservice.

The fact you rounded up the amount by a million dollars kinds of proves my point. In your mind things are worse than they are and you’re even willing to push solid numbers to a MILLION dollars higher.

I know you won’t take any information I give into account and question your own view to strengthen it so I suppose we can just agree to disagree. I’ve openly said when I am wrong on this message board when I am. I rationally criticize my own views every step and comment I make. Can you say the same?

 

[Hairy Vols]

Spurrier was at Duke and South Carolina. Dude had three straight 11-2 seasons at SC. He was 1000% better than Fulmer.

Agreed. As much as I hate to say it.

 

[BernardKingGOAT]

When “limited football knowledge” = I’m mad because you want to hold our 10 mil coach responsible for the product on the field. Funny how some refuse to assign 0 responsibility where it deserves to be placed.

He makes 9 and is tied for the 12th highest paid coach in the country. I say his compensation is about right for the direction he has taken the program. Through 4 seasons he has 1 top 5, 1 top 10 and 1 top 20 finish. You look silly repeating his salary over and over again given the results he has produced walking into a dumpster fire. Not to mention recruiting is getting better every year.

And no one is mad at you. Some of us are just pointing out the absurdity of your uninformed rants

 

[EastTNVol6240]

He makes 9 and is tied for the 12th highest paid coach in the country. I say his compensation is about right for the direction he has taken the program. Through 4 seasons he has 1 top 5, 1 top 10 and 1 top 20 finish. You look silly repeating his salary over and over again given the results he has produced walking into a dumpster fire. Not to mention recruiting is getting better every year.

And no one is mad at you. Some of us are just pointing out the absurdity of your uninformed rants

I don’t care if it’s 3$ or 9million. The point is he’s paid to be the head coach. Responsibility comes with that title. How long are you and your crew gonna hang on to “the dumpster fire” days? That’s not Tennessee football. You continue to live there if you’d like.

I wasn’t aware placement of salary ranking coincided with results. If that’s the case go ahead and make him #1 so we can get that natty. Wish you’d of told out AD it was that simple.

 

[EastTNVol6240]

I can’t control your perspective. If your idea of holding someone responsible is irrational over emotional fits after every single loss than have at it. Nobody says you’re not allowed to criticize. Nobody says you’re not allowed to subjugate Heupel to the product you see, but when done with personal bias and limited range of conversation you due your side of the argument a disservice.

The fact you rounded up the amount by a million dollars kinds of proves my point. In your mind things are worse than they are and you’re even willing to push solid numbers to a MILLION dollars higher.

I know you won’t take any information I give into account and question your own view to strengthen it so I suppose we can just agree to disagree. I’ve openly said when I am wrong on this message board when I am. I rationally criticize my own views every step and comment I make. Can you say the same?

You missed the whole point. It’s 0 to do with the money. He’s the head coach. His salary can be 9 mil or $5 and I’m going to hold him to the same accountability.

He is directly responsible for the product on the field whether he’s paid 9 mil or in stadium hotdogs.

 

[EZE]

Another moronic thread.

 

[EZE]

If you just go by the words and actions of the Sunshine Pumpers, it seems most likely that he is going to be fired before December 2026. They are in the same mode they were in with Dooley after Kentucky in 2011, with Butch after South Carolina in 2016, and with Pruitt for every single snap of his tenure.

If we lose to Florida and Vandy to end the year and then lose 5 or 6 games next year with a much tougher schedule than he has ever faced, then he is gone. And the people getting angry at any whiff of criticism of him now will blame him for every dumb thing the next guy does.

In any case, he finished out year 5 barring unforeseen health or legal issues, but he isn’t making it to year 10. He is a step in the right direction from where we were, but he has zero chance of getting us where we want to be.

A whole lot of “ifs” in there. Another brilliant post.

 

[sambronkowitz]

By the time Fulmer took over, Johnny had made us consistent in the winning column but, would lose “the big game” every year. Add into that, they SEC coaching carousel had just started revolving, somewhat. When Fulmer took over, it was in full swing and except for Spurrier and Florida, he was able to take advantage. Saying that, by the end of Spurrier’s tenure at Florida, Fulmer had us toe to toe with him. The problem for Fulmer, and I readily admit it, was the increase in coaching talent coming into the SEC. With that, he wasn’t able to get the out of state kids he and Majors once did.

Exactly. Even as sorry of a coach as Ron Zook was at Florida, he still was able to out recruit Fulmer. And Richt was able to get the kids Fulmer was accustomed to getting out of Georgia. During that time, Saban was still at LSU before the NFL and the meteoric rise at Alabama. He was able to out recruit Fulmer. And Tommy Tuberville was recruiting some four and five stars and making Auburn into a juggernaut. That is what really hurt Fulmer and us is that newer and younger blood was coming into the SEC and was out recruiting Fulmer.

 

[BernardKingGOAT]

I don’t care if it’s 3$ or 9million. The point is he’s paid to be the head coach. Responsibility comes with that title. How long are you and your crew gonna hang on to “the dumpster fire” days? That’s not Tennessee football. You continue to live there if you’d like.

I wasn’t aware placement of salary ranking coincided with results. If that’s the case go ahead and make him #1 so we can get that natty. Wish you’d of told out AD it was that simple.

SOS. Bless your heart. More than once you've went on a critical rant using the phrase referring to his compensation as "championship prices". The dumpster fire characterization is referring to his starting point. Apparently you have absolutely zero understanding of reestablishing stability into a traditional, high level program. He's on the right track, certainly requiring constant improvement from him and his staff. You have an extremely immature and uninformed view of the process

 

[Hairy Vols]

You missed the whole point. It’s 0 to do with the money. He’s the head coach. His salary can be 9 mil or $5 and I’m going to hold him to the same accountability.

He is directly responsible for the product on the field whether he’s paid 9 mil or in stadium hotdogs.

And the product he has put on the field has yielded better win totals and post season success more so than any team we have had in the past 20+ years.

If the money doesn't matter then why even bring it up? Lets alone make the number artificially higher than it actually is?