Why Josh Deserves The Criticism

#201
#201
BernardKingGOAT said:
It requires both. Adequate talent with a great scheme can compete with superior talent anywhere on the field
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Well this is the first year we’ve done that with the line of scrimmage battle against UGA. Take from that what you will. To me, it means we are pretty close to our OL being on par with their DL.
 
#205
#205
Heupel's Offseason Beard said:
You don't understand college football if you don't get how a reduction in scholarships, official visits, evaluation time, and limited communication can affect recruiting and on the field results. I'm sorry, that's just a genuine fact of how the sport works. You guys are quick to make opinions heard after having no knowledge of the facts. And by the way, it's been a reduction of 28 scholarships over the course of five years. Read things.

View attachment 788332

Just a few of the things. Ask questions if you don't understand
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So go ahead and tell the class what restrictions we’re operating on right now since you didn’t want to acknowledge it…. Just another excuse from a pumper for why we’ve regressed in year 5. Nice try.

While you’re at it, tell us what schollies restrictions have to do with unprepared teams, undisciplined teams yearly, atrocious clock management repeatedly, yearly losses that shouldn’t happen. Please somehow link these for me since you’re great at condescending posts with 0 backing to them. We have lots to clean up, and that list of clean up has 0 to do with restrictions.
 
#206
#206
EastTNVol6240 said:
So go ahead and tell the class what restrictions we’re operating on right now since you didn’t want to acknowledge it…. Just another excuse from a pumper for why we’ve regressed in year 5. Nice try.

While you’re at it, tell us what schollies restrictions have to do with unprepared teams, undisciplined teams yearly, atrocious clock management repeatedly, yearly losses that shouldn’t happen. Please somehow link these for me since you’re great at condescending posts with 0 backing to them. We have lots to clean up, and that list of clean up has 0 to do with restrictions.
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🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
 
#207
#207
Heupel's Offseason Beard said:
Both things can be true. I just want you guys to understand why the roster is so young and not up to par. Please read and fully ingest the severity of these punishments. Ask questions if you don't understand
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Our roster is in no way the bad shape you like to point to. We are right in the mix with the exception of the top,top schools. That’s due to NIL expenditures, not scholarships. Rosters aren’t built on recruiting freshmen the way they used to be. Rosters are built on paying guys millions. In some sense, the NIL really played to our advantage here.

You think a freshmen cares about a schollie if we can pay him a million? Not saying that’s happening but it’s the easy work around. “Yeah sorry we’re down 2 schollies, we can’t pay your 35K tuition this year but we sure can pay you a mil in NIL”.

Just ask if you have questions.
 
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#209
#209
EastTNVol6240 said:
While we’re not on par with some top teams, we’re not as far apart as some like to say. I don’t feel like we’ve been “out talented” in any loss this year. I think it’s always just the easy excuse for a loss.
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I don't see anyone claiming that is solely our issue just like I don't see anyone saying Heupel is beyond criticism. You, however, does the same tired narrative in every post. I realize you don't know any better, but that doesn't make it any less comical.
 
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#210
#210
Heupel's Offseason Beard said:
And if Tennessee wins, you'll celebrate and give the coaches and team credit for sticking it out right? RIGHT?!!
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Absolutely because they are suppose to win this game. This year it is expected. No excuses for losing this game. If they lay an egg it will be very telling on our future, How could YOU excuse a loss to Florida this year? Seriously, I’d like to hear why this would be acceptable. I’m not saying Heupel should be fired for losing it because I do not want to be in this years coaching search charade but still…you don’t lose this game in coaching year 5!!!!!!!
 
#212
#212
VOL931 said:
Then hire someone to help. That's what Kirby does.

Heupel is resistant to change and doesn't want to release any control.

Oh and he hires his OK friends. If he loses to Vandy, I hope his butt is on fire.
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Vandy? How about losing to this Florida team??? Vandy at least is competitive
 
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#213
#213
BernardKingGOAT said:
I don't see anyone claiming that is solely our issue just like I don't see anyone saying Heupel is beyond criticism. You, however, does the same tired narrative in every post. I realize you don't know any better, but that doesn't make it any less comical.
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It’s only tired because you don’t like it. It’s okay to stamp your feet and and throw things when you see an opinion you don’t like. It’s mostly a new generation thing but I’ll look over it for you Bernard.

And yes, there are plenty of posts here saying people are morons for criticizing Heupel, as well as in this very thread saying our biggest problem is a few scholarships- anything we can do to keep responsibility off of highly paid staff.
 
#214
#214
EastTNVol6240 said:
It’s only tired because you don’t like it. It’s okay to stamp your feet and and throw things when you see an opinion you don’t like. It’s mostly a new generation thing but I’ll look over it for you Bernard.

And yes, there are plenty of posts here saying people are morons for criticizing Heupel, as well as in this very thread saying our biggest problem is a few scholarships- anything we can do to keep responsibility off of highly paid staff.
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Didn't say any of that. If you need to make a narrative up about me, that's cool. You are the only one who seems upset anytime anyone offers a reasonable take on the season. You just repeat the same things over and over. Like I said, you don't know any better
 
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#215
#215
BernardKingGOAT said:
Didn't say any of that. If you need to make a narrative up about me, that's cool. You are the only one who seems upset anytime anyone offers a reasonable take on the season. You just repeat the same things over and over. Like I said, you don't know any better
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Not once been “upset” at anything on this forum. And you may want to read again…. If possible. I didn’t say you. I said “there are posts”. Same thing over and over?

It’s almost as if each person here has different thoughts, opinions, and agendas that don’t change daily and they may mention “over and over”. It’s even almost like every forum in the world is comprised of exactly that. If it makes you uncomfortable, there’s a good chance it’s not for you.
 
#216
#216
EastTNVol6240 said:
It’s only tired because you don’t like it. It’s okay to stamp your feet and and throw things when you see an opinion you don’t like. It’s mostly a new generation thing but I’ll look over it for you Bernard.

And yes, there are plenty of posts here saying people are morons for criticizing Heupel, as well as in this very thread saying our biggest problem is a few scholarships- anything we can do to keep responsibility off of highly paid staff.
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A large portion are not being declared morons FOR criticizing CJH, they are demonstrating that they are morons while coincidentally posting about CJH. They evidence it redundantly on multiple topics.

Pretty easy to see with some of our agenda driven faithful.
 
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#217
#217
EastTNVol6240 said:
Not once been “upset” at anything on this forum. And you may want to read again…. If possible. I didn’t say you. I said “there are posts”. Same thing over and over?

It’s almost as if each person here has different thoughts, opinions, and agendas that don’t change daily and they may mention “over and over”. It’s even almost like every forum in the world is comprised of exactly that. If it makes you uncomfortable, there’s a good chance it’s not for you.
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You mention quite often how we look unprepared. We haven't looked unprepared in any of our 3 losses. We were up 21-7 after the first qtr against GA. We were on the one yard line at the end of the first half against Bama and threw a pick six. We were in those positions because we were prepared. I agree with some of the discipline issues, but heck we were much improved às to penalties in the OU game. Heupel certainly has areas that he needs to improve upon as a HC, but he can't execute the plays on the field. He can only prepare us to be in position to make those plays that can be the difference between winning and losing
 
#219
#219
BernardKingGOAT said:
You mention quite often how we look unprepared. We haven't looked unprepared in any of our 3 losses. We were up 21-7 after the first qtr against GA. We were on the one yard line at the end of the first half against Bama and threw a pick six. We were in those positions because we were prepared. I agree with some of the discipline issues, but heck we were much improved às to penalties in the OU game. Heupel certainly has areas that he needs to improve upon as a HC, but he can't execute the plays on the field. He can only prepare us to be in position to make those plays that can be the difference between winning and losing
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That’s such a weird argument to make. He’s not out there scoring touchdowns, either.

And he does have some control over the execution. We switched the wide receiver coach and OC between the 2005 to 2006 seasons and the hilarious drops ceased. The bad tackling, Kitselman and Staley drops, some of that can be worked out in practice.
 
#220
#220
West Vol said:
That’s such a weird argument to make. He’s not out there scoring touchdowns, either.

And he does have some control over the execution. We switched the wide receiver coach and OC between the 2005 to 2006 seasons and the hilarious drops ceased. The bad tackling, Kitselman and Staley drops, some of that can be worked out in practice.
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I'm not making an argument.
 
#224
#224
VolTom1 said:
This post is to point out why those who are saying Josh deserves no criticism are wrong, and why I personally don't think Josh will achieve anything beyond the occasional play off appearance here at Tennessee. That being said this is not a call to fire Josh, that would be stupid with all of the coaching changes going on right now. Also if you are fine with mediocrity, if you are fine being average and not great, Josh is the prefect guy for you, just move along from this post, call me stupid for my concern, all of the typical BS I get instead of listening to the legitimate complaints.

1. Clock management - He has no idea what the rules are. Josh literally didn't know the clock was not stopping late into the Oklahoma game, not the first game he has mismanaged the clock. In this past game he had to have the ref explain the rules to him right at the two minute mark. This is a huge red flag, how are the players suppose to know the rules if the coaches don't know them, how can a staff this big not know the rules over half way through the season?

2. Stubbornness - He adapts slowly, refuses to play the best players if they are younger, most of the time. He also gives players and coaches more chances than they deserve. He didn't change up the offense for two years, we had two years of stagnation and he refused to change until this year. He has yet to force the D to change, we continue to play the same regardless if we are getting sacks or not, DB's continue not to turn and locate the ball even when they could etc...

3. Talent Evaluation/Development - While we have some good talent evaluators at Tennessee, Josh himself has been really bad at evaluating QB talent, at least since he has been at Tennessee. Also WR was an issue till this year it seemed, why did it take so long to fix these things? Hopefully they figured that blind spot out, remember though, If it was not for Joe Milton getting hurt Hendon Hooker would have sat on the bench, if it was not for the COVID year players we would have been in a world of hurt last year and this year to a degree.

4. Preparedness - Multiple games every year we go into not prepared, making critical mistakes and losing or almost losing to inferior teams. We win many of these games just because we have better overall talent, but those games should never be that close. TBF Other teams do this from time to time, Georgia comes to mind, But Georgia has one or two of these games a year, that they normally win, we on the other hand have about 4 and we are lucky if we win half of them.

5. Blindness - This is the biggest issue I see with Josh. Anyone who pays attention could clearly see we need more people on the DL, proven talent and depth. Anyone could see we were about to lose TONS of production from 2024, the type of production that you can't just get back without using the transfer portal. Think about it, it's very scary to think that if Nico stayed, just how bad would we be. Josh is very LUCKY, becasue for all the mistakes Joey makes, he also makes some really good plays, that I doubt Nico would make, and they fully expected Nico to be our QB this year. How can we lose so much of our production and think we are going to be ok with Nico at QB. This is what we lost from 2024, Omari Thomas, Omarr Norman-Lott, Elijah Simmons, James Pearce Jr, Jayson Jenkins, Jakobe Thomas, and Will Brooks. I can recall many plays from each one of these guys that helped us win games, critical plays that we might not win the game if they don't make them. I can't be the only one who seen this coming, our D taking huge steps back, this concerns me because as I said above, if Nico stays we are probably lose the Arkansas and Mississippi state games. We would be 1-5 in the SEC.. and Josh would probably be fired.

All of this being said I don't want Josh to be fired, I want him to make changes, but I'm losing confidence that he will do it, or do it fast enough to save his job, and our program from being bad again. If you get mad at me over that, I don't care, I've been a VFL and will always be, I just don't want a repeat of the bad years. I want Tennessee to be how I was when I was a kid, dominant, feared, winning championships, and we will never get there if Josh settles with the state of things now and makes no changes. I have hope he will, hopefully this past game will be the catalyst for change.



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Amen brother that was a concise and on point post . You captured my sentiment exactly. If you truly want to evolve into an elite program you have to continually improve and make changes. And yes that is a real problem with heupel he doesn’t want to make changes and cut loose the excess baggage that is holding the program back . Like I said before and was criticized for doing so . I feel that heupel has a bad case of Apathy.
 
#225
#225
EastTNVol6240 said:
So go ahead and tell the class what restrictions we’re operating on right now since you didn’t want to acknowledge it…. Just another excuse from a pumper for why we’ve regressed in year 5. Nice try.

While you’re at it, tell us what schollies restrictions have to do with unprepared teams, undisciplined teams yearly, atrocious clock management repeatedly, yearly losses that shouldn’t happen. Please somehow link these for me since you’re great at condescending posts with 0 backing to them. We have lots to clean up, and that list of clean up has 0 to do with restrictions.
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Fine I will.
-Probation still going on
-while there are only two scholarship reductions this year, they have to reduce scholarships by 28. Between 2021-2023 we reduced scholarships by 16. You wanna know why we have so few upperclassmen???? Start at 2021/2022 and start counting to four. What year are we at now? Is it clicking yet?

-A reduction in football official visits by a total of 36 during the term of probation, including a reduction of at least four per year. Official visits are where you make your BIG pitch to players. It is where you can pull out all the stops. So over the course of 5 years, we got 36 less chances to do a big pitch to a recruit. It means we got to take less chances as up until this year, there was a cap of 70 per year per team. And we had an average of 7 less per year than other teams. The specifics on this year specifically are murky but we know for a fact we get at least 4 less than other teams

-A reduction in football unofficial visits by a total of 40 weeks during the term of probation, including at least six weeks per year. This is when recruits just come visit/ juniors/ sophomores check out the school for the first time. It's when the conversations start happening or guys come back to visit again after their OV. Recruits can take as many unofficials as they want, except in our case, in which 6 weeks out of the year, nobody can come visit.

-A total 28-week ban on recruiting communications during the term of probation, including at least three weeks per year. This will include one week each in December and January and one week from March to June. So presently/ every year our coaches can't call or even text recruits for a week during two of the most important months of the year for recruiting (signing day is in january....) If you follow recruiting, you know that recruiting is a 24/7 job. We have dozens of coaches/ staffers who reach out to the players every day. These recruits hear from the team literally every day trying to convince them to commit. Except us. For an average of five weeks per year and when it matters most. If you recall, we had an elite safety committed last year, Lagonza Hayward, but he decommitted right before signing day. His reason, and I quote "I didn't hear from Tennessee for a whole week"... take a second and absorb that last one.

-A total reduction in evaluation days by 120 during the term of probation. Evaluation days are when coaches go to the school of the recruit and watch them play games or practice. Like I said, recruiting is a 24/7 thing. And having SIX MONTHS less time over 5 years where our coaches can watch a recruit in person is going to have SIGNIFICANT effects on their ability to accurately identify prospective players. Scouting players is not done by coaches through high school highlights. It's done in person. And teams are already only allowed 173 evaluation days per year. We've only been allowed about 150 over the last couple of years including this year

I really hope you made it to the end of this. I hope that this answers some of your questions.
"Why don't we have elite talent like bama and Georgia?"- recruiting restrictions
"Why do we miss out on some big time recruits?" -recruiting restrictions
"Why do we have to play so many young players leading to careless mistakes?" -recruiting restrictions

I know that Heupel isn't perfect. I know that he gets in his own way with time management and playing too conservative. I know that his scheme leads to a lot of penalties. But it also leads to more yards and points than any team Tennessee has ever fielded. The point I'm trying to make is that our coaches have had to fight an absolute uphill battle in recruiting and the fact that we won 30 games in 3 seasons is legitimately astounding. I don't know of many coaches who could have do this. I truly believe that. This season was always going to be a rebuild, but to think that it's NEVER going to get better just because you think we've hit our peak is silly. If they can win like they have here while being forced to recruit at a completely lower level than every other team, just imagine what they'll be able to accomplish when the shackles are off. Just think about it. The grass may be greener, but very few could have won 11 games in 2022 with the roster Heupel had. Give it time and stop trying to run off our damn coach lol

Source: Hundreds of violations occurred in Tennessee football program over 3 seasons - NCAA.org
 
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