Trade Wars and Tariffs

#851
#851
Orangeslice13 said:
Is that the argument that was used here?
“Ya, they’re slaves, but isn’t that better for them than the tribal squalor they’re from?”

Hard pass on the suppression of others for our benefit.
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But, the slaves didn't have any choice.
 
#854
#854
McDad said:
Why are we acting as if they have a choice when they do not?

If the factory pays more and generally has better conditions, isn't that better for those people?
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I think the issue with this argument is its difficult/impossible to prove one way or the other. Not enough information is known on either side to make actual conclusions. there are certainly some cases where it does improve the lot of the workers. there are also certainly cases where it hurts the lot of the workers. and if you are only looking at the workers its easy to miss the collateral damage done.

at best its a case of gentrification, and at worst its the modern equivalent of indentured servitude.

but even at the best it has some draw backs. removing workers from the local economy to a factory that is for export only, means there is less work force in the area. less local work in most of these countries means less food production, and smaller cottage industries that the community relies on. So you have cut supply, while also increasing the amount of money available on the demand side. that disrupts local economies.

a lot of the "benefits" aren't nearly as universal as we would like to assume. Great example is all the work China does to improve a nation's economy, they are adding 500km of road, 200km of rails, a new international airport, and sea port. What they don't tell you is that no local roads connect to that new network, and actually local road use now takes longer because the new highway cut the existing local roads. the rail only runs from the port to factory, the airport only goes back to one city in China, and only Chinese ships can use the port. Its similar with any of these factories. "There wasn't electricity in the area before but we have built a new power plant...that only serves the factory. and the waste from that plant kills off 1/4 of the local food production while damaging local water supplies even more"
 
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#855
#855
Velo Vol said:
That excerpt is a pretty good summary, but specific "facts" all come from somewhere. So the Chat GPT is only good as where it came from.
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Yeah, so if you're going to report something you got from GPT as fact, you need to follow the sources and verify.
 
#858
#858
EasternVol said:
This guy's carry on weighs more than 43 pounds? I don't know how attached he is to reality.
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You can definitely get 43 lbs into a carry-on suitcase. I flew home from the Philippines with 5 bottles of Tanduay. I didn't put them in my carry-on, but I could've. A carry-on holds like 10 gallons, which is over 80 lbs.
 
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#862
#862
mrorange211 said:
Free trade killed the middle class in America. I don't know how anyone can argue otherwise. I don't like tariffs strictly from a selfish pov (I'm in the service sector and heavily invested in stocks), but I understand the play. I think COVID taught us that there are certain industries, like medicine, that we have to have in our country and not outsourced.
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There's free trade and there's fair trade. Fair trade or lack of it is the issue. Let comparative advantages work to our benefit.
 
#863
#863
McDad said:
Do the people working in those factories have choice...do they have agency over themselves and their labor?
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I thought we were not doing the all pilots are drunks thing.
No, in many cases those people are not given a choice. But I believe you knew that already
 
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#864
#864
McDad said:
Would you anticipate Uncle Sam concedes to those countries and their demands or would America opt to cease exporting? Would American employers agree to give 20-30 days mandatory vacation to employees because that meets the standard in Ger, Swi, and Fra?
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That would not be the choice of the United States. (Mexican employers are American too) that would be at the discretion of the business wanting to do business there. If it made financial sense then they would upgrade. If not then they would not.
That’s how the system should work
 
#866
#866
Orangeslice13 said:
Slave wages are not ok.
And what makes you think it’s only 12 hours?
And they are not working here for a few cents in the field.

Now if a few cents in the fields is all they can make there then that’s on their government and their people. But me building a factory to take advantage of them for cheap crap does nothing to elevate their situation.

However, if instead of tariffs we want to pass a law saying you can’t import anything here unless they pay at our minimum wage and manufacture by our osha safety standards then I’m good with that.
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We're as likely to go the other way and get rid of our wage, safety and environmental safeguards. Many here would cheer.
 
#868
#868
e690c92b-e7f6-4aab-bf89-8bb0a17c885d_text.gif
 
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#873
#873
n_huffhines said:
You can definitely get 43 lbs into a carry-on suitcase. I flew home from the Philippines with 5 bottles of Tanduay. I didn't put them in my carry-on, but I could've. A carry-on holds like 10 gallons, which is over 80 lbs.
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Yeah that would be 88 lbs @ 1L = 1 Qt. But I don't see getting 10 gallons into a carry on not to mention duty free allowances, LAG limits and carry on weight limits. Then again just about anything is possible at NAIA. I hope you brought back plenty of dried mangoes.
 
#874
#874
US National Debt: $37 trillion

Amount of income and employment taxes paid by foreign manufacturing workers: $0.00
 
#875
#875
n_huffhines said:
You can definitely get 43 lbs into a carry-on suitcase. I flew home from the Philippines with 5 bottles of Tanduay. I didn't put them in my carry-on, but I could've. A carry-on holds like 10 gallons, which is over 80 lbs.
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What part of the islands? Family, work, or pleasure?

Best flights I've ever been on were on China Eastern between NYC and Shanghai while traveling from CLT to Manila.
 
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