President Joe Biden - Kamala Harris Administration

#43,756
#43,756
85SugarVol said:
Are we experiencing a rash of complaints from adults that had their cleft palates corrected as minors?
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What does that have to do with anything we are discussing???
We were discussing surgeries that would be illegal for children under 18 except for in extraordinary situations and where to set that bar.

And why you would support cosmetic surgery to a child's face but not to other parts of the body.
 
#43,758
#43,758
newyorkvol said:
I don’t think there’s any debate about doing surgery for genetic, embryonic or gestational malformations.

To me, gender re-assignment surgery in children, with or without parental consent, is akin to gastric bypass surgery for an anorexic.
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Yes this couldn't have been said better
 
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#43,759
#43,759
newyorkvol said:
I don’t think there’s any debate about doing surgery for genetic, embryonic or gestational malformations.

To me, gender re-assignment surgery in children, with or without parental consent, is akin to gastric bypass surgery for an anorexic.
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If there was a valid medical reason for performing gastric bypass surgery on an anorexic, I would certainly hope that it had not been made illegal.
 
#43,761
#43,761
kiddiedoc said:
Last comment:

I've been a physician for 22 years, seeing only children, every day. Care to guess how many kids I've encountered that meet the definition you posted?

Zero.
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Maybe I'm misinterpreting your comment, but are you saying that the rare circumstances Luther mentioned either don't exist or don't deserve a potential exception from proposed legislation simply because you haven't dealt with them before?
 
#43,763
#43,763
Grand Vol said:
I'm still trying to figure out how any so called doctor can claim to follow the Hippocratic Oath and perform gender mutilation surgery on minors.

Do no harm. Pretty clear if you ask me.
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I think a few of them heard “Do no harm to the liberal agenda”.

Wife’s an MD. She’s coming to same conclusions.
 
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#43,764
#43,764
luthervol said:
Nope. I am not. I'm equating surgery to lessen the effects of birth defects.
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Being born with either male or female body parts is not a defect. My SIL fixing my my nephews cleft palet over the course of his 21 years and 10 or so operations does not equate in any way shape or form to whacking ole willie off.
 
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#43,765
#43,765
GVF said:
Being born with either male or female body parts is not a defect. My SIL fixing my my nephews cleft palet over the course of his 21 years and 10 or so operations does not equate in any way shape or form to whacking ole willie off.
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I posted a couple of links earlier. One can be born female with male body parts, born male with female body parts, or born with both male and female body parts.
It's rare - like cleft palates.
That's why it is an EXTREORDINARY EXCEPTION.
 
#43,766
#43,766
luthervol said:
What does that have to do with anything we are discussing???
We were discussing surgeries that would be illegal for children under 18 except for in extraordinary situations and where to set that bar.

And why you would support cosmetic surgery to a child's face but not to other parts of the body.
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I’m usually much more willing to dance than most on here, but even this is a bit much.

Fixing a child’s cleft palate, and removing the genitalia of a 12 year old boy are just two peas in the same pod huh?
 
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#43,767
#43,767
luthervol said:
I posted a couple of links earlier. One can be born female with male body parts, born male with female body parts, or born with both male and female body parts.
It's rare - like cleft palates.
That's why it is an EXTREORDINARY EXCEPTION.
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So extraordinary it's likely statistically irrelevant to the discussion. Which is probably why you've steered the discussion toward it
 
#43,768
#43,768
luthervol said:
I posted a couple of links earlier. One can be born female with male body parts, born male with female body parts, or born with both male and female body parts.
It's rare - like cleft palates.
That's why it is an EXTREORDINARY EXCEPTION.
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Your “unique situation” is undefined and can be added to at any time.
 
#43,770
#43,770
85SugarVol said:
Your “unique situation” is undefined and can be added to at any time.
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So? That's part of the coming together and compromising process.
You have to first establish some common sense common ground.
To me the common sense common ground would be....."some surgeries/procedures should be illegal for children under the age of 18, but we need to make sure and provide exceptions for those rare and extraordinary situations."

If people can simply agree to that.......then the process can move forward.
If one enters the conversation with some concrete position from which they are not willing to budge, the process is dead.

Dr. Seuss should have named them "the right going Zax" and "the left going Zax" instead of north and south. (If anyone doesn't get the reference, look it up and give it a quick read.)
 
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#43,771
#43,771
luthervol said:
So? That's party of the coming together and compromising process.
You have to first establish some common sense common ground.
To me the common sense common ground would be.....some surgeries/procedures should be illegal for children under the age of 18, but we need to make sure and provide exceptions for those rare and extraordinary situations.

If people can simply agree to that.......then the process can move forward.
If one enters the conversation with some concrete position from which they are not will to budge, the process is dead.

Dr. Seuss should have named them "the right going Zax" and "the left going Zax" instead of north and south. (If anyone doesn't get the reference, look it up and give it a quick read.)
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No one of sound mind is going to agree that the “common sense common ground” starting point is handing a blank check to Vanderbilt Transgender Health Center.
 
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#43,773
#43,773
85SugarVol said:
No one of sound mind is going to agree that the “common sense common ground” starting point is handing a blank check to Vanderbilt Transgender Health Center.
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Certainly the vast majority would not agree.
See? You're proving my point. There are idiots on both extremes. That doesn't mean there can't be compromise; it actually means there must be compromise.
 
#43,774
#43,774
luthervol said:
Certainly the vast majority would not agree.
See? You're proving my point. There are idiots on both extremes. That doesn't mean there can't be compromise; it actually means there must be compromise.
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Your “compromise” is to simply allow what ever the doc, kid and parent agree to.
 
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