War in Ukraine

#23,026
#23,026
volgr said:
If the World were Utopia I would agree, but unfortunately it isn't. Ukraine and Russia, like 2 little kids, have both been pickin' at each other (as my granny would say back in the day) for years. Which side was pickin' more is up for debate as is obvious in this thread. At the end of the day, a border is just a line on a map that has to be protected by diplomacy and a military, both of which Ukraine failed at spectacularly.
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So anarchy should reign, and civility is nonsense? Nations should act like toddlers? Ukraine didn't attack Russia, but Russia did attack a smaller and theoretically weaker Ukraine; it's just that simple. A power play and a lust for Ukraine's resources and geography.
 
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#23,034
#23,034
AM64 said:
So anarchy should reign, and civility is nonsense? Nations should act like toddlers? Ukraine didn't attack Russia, but Russia did attack a smaller and theoretically weaker Ukraine; it's just that simple. A power play and a lust for Ukraine's resources and geography.
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I was beginning to think some people in this group would love to have anarchy. Civility is nonsense here in Volnation. You should already know that.
 
#23,036
#23,036
AM64 said:
So anarchy should reign, and civility is nonsense? Nations should act like toddlers? Ukraine didn't attack Russia, but Russia did attack a smaller and theoretically weaker Ukraine; it's just that simple. A power play and a lust for Ukraine's resources and geography.
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Again, the World isnt Utopia and many people see the current conflict different than you.
 
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#23,042
#23,042
AM64 said:
Strategic bombing was still in it's infancy during WW2. Vietnam era fighters could carry a bigger bomb load than B-17s and B-24s. The Norden bombsight was superior to anything else at the time but that and dumb bombs were still just trying to be close - nothing like precision guided munitions of today. Also bomber losses on deep strikes were very heavy until the P-51 as a long range bomber escort came along in numbers and tactics were revised (the best date I've seen is realistically early 1944) and attrition hurt the Germans. The Germans had only so many seasoned fighter pilots, and they weren't rotated, they fought until killed; by late in the war the cream of those pilots were gone. Hitler's micromanaging hurt, too; he kept the German jet fighters from developing faster because he thought they should be bombers.

German strategic bombing failed and it galvanized the British. Allied strategic bombing together with German losses and privations demoralized the German people. Strategic bombing of Japan was probably intended for shock value, and in the end it did work that way.
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What people here may be reluctant to admit but sometimes simply killing people, including civilians IS THE STRATEGY. The desired result to demoralize the enemy so that they give up. This was Germany's goal with London and probably would have been more effective but for one thing. Pearl Harbor. The US then declared war on Japan, who was a German ally and so Germany declared war on us. That probably saved Brittan's bacon. Churchill's speeches certainly helped.

Interesting side note - the first woman in Congress, a Republican from Montana - was the only vote against going to war (she also voted against WW1). Mind you, there has never been another female rep from Montana since.

Point is, it probably would have worked better if America hadnt entered the war. It certainly worked for us when we burned Hamburg (Germany's second largest city) and Dresden to the ground - fire bombing with the specific intent to kill as many as possible - 37,000 dead and 180,000 wounded in Hamburg alone and 25,000+ dead in Dresden over just a few days. This sucked the final life out of Germany. Such a crushing blow, not to its military but to their families at home was the final straw that broke Germany's back. The same could be said for Hiroshima and Nagasaki for Japan.

Was this a good and just end? Most Americans would say so, most especially those who lived at that time.
 
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#23,045
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