Arizona Election Audit

#726
#726
BowlBrother85 said:
I'm not pretending that anything is one sided. The topic of this thread has nothing to do with the 2016 Presidential Election. This thread concerns the 2020 Presidential Election and an audit which is currently taking place in the state of Arizona.

Also, when analyzing the conduct of the two respective losing candidates in the last two elections, instead of the entire parties, you see a big difference in how they both reacted to the loss. Hillary Clinton never claimed that she was cheated. She never referred to the 2016 Presidential Election as having been "rigged". She didn't call individual Secretaries of State around the country and plead with them to "find the votes" needed for her to overturn the result. She didn't file over 50 law suits, and she didn't boycott Donald Trump's inauguration. She did, however, give a gracious concession speech the day after the 2016 Presidential Election.
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So your saying she never made disparaging comments about Trump? Did she handle it better? Yes. Did she call for the Democratic Party to stop foolishly chasing impeachment? Did she call for them to stop chasing the investigation rooted in the unverified dossier she helped fund? No. She could have, she didn't. Both parties lost their mind over losing.
 
#728
#728
Weezer said:
So your saying she never made disparaging comments about Trump? Did she handle it better? Yes. Did she call for the Democratic Party to stop foolishly chasing impeachment? Did she call for them to stop chasing the investigation rooted in the unverified dossier she helped fund? No. She could have, she didn't. Both parties lost their mind over losing.
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She made disparaging comments about Trump, but Trump made just as many, if not more, disparaging comments about her. Are saying it's okay for Trump to call her "Crooked Hillary", and lead "Lock her up!" chants... but she is somehow out of line if she responds in kind?

Are you seriously equating "disparaging comments" with the way Trump has behaved since November 3rd? She was obviously not in Congress after Trump took office. She had no control over whether or not House Democrats moved forward with articles of impeachment. Trump has redefined what it means to be a sore loser.
 
#730
#730
BowlBrother85 said:
She made disparaging comments about Trump, but Trump made just as many, if not more, disparaging comments about her. Are saying it's okay for Trump to call her "Crooked Hillary", and lead "Lock her up!" chants... but she is somehow out of line if she responds in kind?

Are you seriously equating "disparaging comments" with the way Trump has behaved since November 3rd? She was obviously not in Congress after Trump took office. She had no control over whether or not House Democrats moved forward with articles of impeachment. Trump has redefined what it means to be a sore loser.
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lmao Are you saying it's okay for Hillary and other Dems to sink to Trump's level? You criticize Trump for his behavior, then defend your heroes when they sink to his level with a playground excuse. "He did it first!" What happened to be the better person? I'm tired, and ready to go to sleep, so I'm not going to type out some long argument. It's obvious you can't have a real conversation on the topic because in your eyes, the left can do no wrong. Just when you halfway admit something, you immediately turn back and go on the defense. They're all a bunch of corrupt ass holes that act like petulant children. That's practically every politician. Maybe there's a good one somewhere, but they're harder to find than Bigfoot.
 
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#731
#731
Weezer said:
lmao Are you saying it's okay for Hillary and other Dems to sink to Trump's level? You criticize Trump for his behavior, then defend your heroes when they sink to his level with a playground excuse. "He did it first!" What happened to be the better person? I'm tired, and ready to go to sleep, so I'm not going to type out some long argument. It's obvious you can't have a real conversation on the topic because in your eyes, the left can do no wrong. Just when you halfway admit something, you immediately turn back and go on the defense. They're all a bunch of corrupt ass holes that act like petulant children. That's practically every politician. Maybe there's a good one somewhere, but they're harder to find than Bigfoot.
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It's obvious you can't have a real conversation and stay on topic. It always circles back to one "what-about-ism" after another... and I was critical of the left during one of your "what-about-isms" earlier when you brought up the IRS targeting of conservative media.

There is no comparing Trump's behavior since November 3rd to that of any other politician after an election defeat. He has broken the mold on how to be a sore loser.... and he is still sticking with it, over 3 months after the damn inauguration of his opponent.
 
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#732
#732
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#733
#733
BowlBrother85 said:
I'm not pretending that anything is one sided. The topic of this thread has nothing to do with the 2016 Presidential Election. This thread concerns the 2020 Presidential Election and an audit which is currently taking place in the state of Arizona.

Also, when analyzing the conduct of the two respective losing candidates in the last two elections, instead of the entire parties, you see a big difference in how they both reacted to the loss. Hillary Clinton never claimed that she was cheated. She never referred to the 2016 Presidential Election as having been "rigged". She didn't call individual Secretaries of State around the country and plead with them to "find the votes" needed for her to overturn the result. She didn't file over 50 law suits, and she didn't boycott Donald Trump's inauguration. She did, however, give a gracious concession speech the day after the 2016 Presidential Election.
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Good grief, man; do you never tire of peeing on legs and claiming it's rain? Clinton did EXACTLY that, as did Democrats and leftist media. WhereTF have you been? This continued for FOUR years and even today! Here's a sampling:

"You can run the best campaign, you can even become the nominee, and you can have the election stolen from you," she said to cheers on the Los Angeles stop of her "Evening with the Clintons" tour with her husband, former President Bill Clinton.
"There is no effort to try to have an organized national response to that," Clinton said. "Social media is still an incredible channel to communicate information that is untrue and defamatory about someone else."
Clinton said Americans need to "make sure that the election is not interfered with in that 'sweeping and systemic' way that Mueller found it was in the prior election" and how to "protect our candidates from that."
"Because Trump took up so much of the oxygen if I said one thing about Trump in a speech and then 30 minutes of something about jobs, the one thing I said would be what would be covered," Clinton said of the dynamic in 2016. Hillary Clinton warns 2020 Democratic candidates of 'stolen' election

Hillary Clinton is still bitter about her presidential election loss in 2016.
“I was the candidate that they basically stole an election from,” Clinton said Monday on the New York Times podcast “Sway.”
“I was the candidate who won nearly three million more votes. So no matter how they cut it, it wasn’t the kind of win that people said, ‘OK, it wasn’t my candidate, but OK.’ This election is still front and center in people’s psyches. And people fight about it every day online, because there is a deep sense of unfairness and just dismissiveness toward his victory, and he knows it,” Clinton said.
Clinton blamed her loss in certain key states on former FBI Director James Comey’s letter Congress announcing the existence of emails under investigation. “I absolutely thought I was going to win. So did everybody else. I mean, I know people look back now and say, well, it wasn’t — we were going to win. We were absolutely going to win.”
Four Years Later, Bitter Hillary Clinton Claims 2016 Election Was 'Stolen' From Her

“No, it doesn’t kill me because he knows he’s an illegitimate president,” she said. “I believe he understands that the many varying tactics they used, from voter suppression and voter purging to hacking to the false stories – he knows that – there were just a bunch of different reasons why the election turned out like it did.”
In June, former president Jimmy Carter used similar language to diminish Trump’s presidency. Carter said that in his view Trump lost the 2016 election and was put in office by the Russians. Asked if he considered Trump to be illegitimate, Carter said, “Based on what I just said, which I can’t retract.”
Clinton compared her election loss to “applying for a job and getting 66 million letters of recommendation and losing to a corrupt human tornado. And so I know that he knows that this wasn’t on the level. I don’t know that we’ll ever know what happened.”
Hillary Clinton: Trump is an ‘illegitimate president’

In May 2017, then-House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi tweeted, "Our election was hijacked. There is no question." Democrats aren't innocent bystanders and outright called Trump an illegitimate president in Aug 27 '20.
As did John Lewis:
John Lewis captures spotlight after calling Trump illegitimate

As did Joe Biden, agreeing that Trump is illegitimate: Biden 'absolutely' agrees with woman who blasts Trump presidency by calling it 'illegitimate'
One-third of congressional Dems boycotted the inauguration because 'Trump is illegitimate'. Dems called to not certify the election:
A third of Dem voters believe Trump was illegitimate in Dec. '16, which became a majority of 62% who believed Russia changed vote tallies to elect Trump in Nov. '18, according to a YouGov poll.

In addition to damning your false assertion, I assume you'll find this "long and boring".
 
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#735
#735
BowlBrother85 said:
BS. It has everything to do with Republicans placating Trump's ego, and his losing the 2020 Presidential Election. If Trump had won, Republicans in Arizona wouldn't care about the "safeguarding of our future elections". They would accept the results as valid with no questions asked. How do I know this? Because they didn't audit results following the 2016 Presidential Election.... and the electoral college vote totals were the same then, as they are now (306 to 232).

... and let's face it, if the Republication-controlled Arizona State Legislature's primary mission was simply to arrive at the truth, they would have hired someone other than Doug Logan's firm "Cyber Ninjas Inc." to conduct their audit. Doug Logan has posted provably false claims about Dominion Voting Systems on the website of Trump attorney, Sidney Powell, which she is now being sued for.

Logan has also called the 2020 Presidential Election "rigged". An independent auditor should never pick sides like that, and make a conclusive determination before the audit has even started. It's unprofessional and his company should not be thought of as an objective finder of fact as a result. It's pretty clear why Logan's company (based out of Florida) was chosen. The Republican Arizona State legislature hand-picked "Cyber Ninjas Inc." because they didn't want an objective audit... they wanted someone who would conclude what they want to hear - and Logan already has.
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This is what people like you still don't get; ANYone with an America first message, a robust economy and energy independence in practicality instead of Marxist New Green Deal promises, and whipping the bureaucratic state back into their proper place, would enjoy EXACTLY the same support Trump enjoys. It isn't about the man, Trump, but the American idea Trump.

If Logan's group claims explosive findings, it will be painstakingly and publicly scrutinized. If it turns up nothing, that takes a lot of air out of the "Trump won" faction. Both are desirable outcomes. You can't have nearly half the country - for EIGHT YEARS (in 2024) - considering elections invalid. Nations do not survive that, and the Marxists running the donkey salivate at the prospect.
 
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#736
#736
LouderVol said:
so its our VP's job to determine what other countries investigate (to his gain), but not the president's job to determine what other countries investigate (to his gain)......
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Joe Biden didn't have anything to gain personally from an investigation into Viktor Shokin. Once again, Hunter Biden was not under investigation. Burisma Holdings was under investigation, but that stemmed from activity that pre-dated his board membership in the company.

However, Donald Trump did have a lot to gain personally from a publicly announced investigation into the Bidens.
 
#737
#737
BowlBrother85 said:
It's obvious you can't have a real conversation and stay on topic. It always circles back to one "what-about-ism" after another... and I was critical of the left during one of your "what-about-isms" earlier when you brought up the IRS targeting of conservative media.

There is no comparing Trump's behavior since November 3rd to that of any other politician after an election defeat. He has broken the mold on how to be a sore loser.... and he is still sticking with it, over 3 months after the damn inauguration of his opponent.
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Always "whataboutism". Seems like it's okay when you do it, yet always a conversation sin when someone else does. Ever consider whataboutism is just natural in conversation?
 
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#738
#738
NCFisher said:
It's as okay as our election meddling abroad and outright toppling of governments.

No one voted for Trump because Russia bot ads echoed conservative talking points.
Just like no Bernie or Stein supporters voted for Trump when Russia ads no longer supported Bernie and Stein after Clinton's nomination. Russian-funded Facebook ads backed Stein, Sanders and Trump

Okay, maybe a few schizophrenic voters.
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You could probably say that Voice of America did it's own bit to influence foreign decisions in the past - supported by our government. Then there's the CIA if you really want to get into election meddling. We can't even keep our own people (like the press) from meddling in elections, so why with all the new communications would anyone in his right mind believe we could keep foreign citizens from meddling in ours. As you said earlier, someone playing with political ads on FB isn't collusion; there definitely is opportunity for people to break campaign law and support foreign ads - or use foreign money - that seems to have been a Clinton Obama thing though. The only way I know to crack down on all that would be public financing for elections and strict control of the media and ads ... not happening.
 
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#739
#739
NCFisher said:
. You can't have nearly half the country - for EIGHT YEARS (in 2024) - considering elections invalid. Nations do not survive that, and the Marxists running the donkey salivate at the prospect.
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What we shouldn't have is half the Country believing "The Big Lie". Unfortunately people like you continue to buy into this nonsense and perpetuate the myth, that's the problem with our Country right now. The Trump Cult lives in a fact-free echo chamber and our Democracy suffers.
 
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#740
#740
TN Ribs said:
What we shouldn't have is half the Country believing "The Big Lie". Unfortunately people like you continue to buy into this nonsense and perpetuate the myth, that's the problem with our Country right now. The Trump Cult lives in a fact-free echo chamber and our Democracy suffers.
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As of 2019, 2/3rds of Dem voters think Russia "Definitely" or "Probably" changed vote tallies to get Trump elected, thus he was illegitimately elected. We know that is fiction.
2/3rds of Republican voters and 1/3rd of Independents think Biden is illegitimate. Just 60% of Voters Think Biden Win Is Legitimate

Your 2016 candidate - to this day - asserts the election was stolen and that Trump was illegitimate, as does your president Biden. Just a few posts up from your reply is a detailed response to BB85 - and now you - regarding the lie that Republicans are doing something now that Democrats aren't guilty of.

We know Democrats broke state and federal election laws across the nation; that is simply inarguable. If they cheat openly in such fashion, why not furtively? Either they did - because Trump is, you know, a NAZI!! - or else their corruption is such that no vile accusation is beneath them for the sake of power.

Now, go clean your own toilet, ya' Marxist fluffer.
 
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#743
#743
Weezer said:
Always "whataboutism". Seems like it's okay when you do it, yet always a conversation sin when someone else does. Ever consider whataboutism is just natural in conversation?
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Not the constant way you use it. You employ a "what-about-ism" in damn near every reply, and you seem to think that it either serves as a defense for, or a justification of, the misconduct being discussed. It does neither. You then like to project an inconsistent standard onto the person you're replying to. It basically goes something like this: "You didn't mind when Obama did it... so why do you care now?" This is often wrong, however. That is practically every post of yours in a nutshell.
 
#744
#744
BowlBrother85 said:
Not the constant way you use it. You employ a "what-about-ism" in damn near every reply, and you seem to think that it either serves as a defense for, or a justification of, the misconduct being discussed. It does neither. You then like to project an inconsistent standard onto the person you're replying to. It basically goes something like this: "You didn't mind when Obama did it... so why do you care now?" This is often wrong, however. That is practically every post of yours in a nutshell.
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Lol
You just what about the what about.
 
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#745
#745
VolinWayne said:
CNN is doing what they do best....Creating their own narrative.



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And what narrative is that? I see nothing wrong with this video. They are calling a spade a spade. This "audit" is bogus and completely unnecessary.

BTW have they found anything yet?
 
#746
#746
BowlBrother85 said:
Not the constant way you use it. You employ a "what-about-ism" in damn near every reply, and you seem to think that it either serves as a defense for, or a justification of, the misconduct being discussed. It does neither. You then like to project an inconsistent standard onto the person you're replying to. It basically goes something like this: "You didn't mind when Obama did it... so why do you care now?" This is often wrong, however. That is practically every post of yours in a nutshell.
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Whataboutism matters. Most people think standards are important.

But you have died on the whataboutism hill. People are just holding you to your own standard. What’s the problem?
 
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#747
#747
K-town Vol Fan said:
And what narrative is that? I see nothing wrong with this video. They are calling a spade a spade. This "audit" is bogus and completely unnecessary.

BTW have they found anything yet?
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I'm sure they have. If there was no fraud the libs and mainstream media wouldn't be so scared. We all know this election was stolen
 
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#749
#749
This conspiracy theory about Dominion is not a new thing. Check out this video that was made in 2016 documenting Dominion stealing votes in Memphis


 
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