It’s time to change the offense

[zjcvols]

Now, I’d like to say one thing before I start. Tennessee hasn’t lost with a healthy Jaden Springer. Because of his ability to create shots for himself and others plus he can push the pace And he opens up things for everyone. However I think this is more of a larger problem.

Barnes runs what most everyone ran up until the last ten years. A 3 out-2 in motion offense. The idea of a motion offense is run screens and cutters away from the ball to get good looks and mismatches. Barnes’ offense is a little bit different. They don’t run as much off ball screens and instead use post players for handoffs and getting them in high/low post spots to create. Look at Barnes’ history and you’ll see he has coached a lot of talented big man that put up good numbers.

Barnes adjusted the offense in year one because he didn’t have any real post players and had Kevin Punter. Since then the offense has run through a post player. Hubbs/Williams in year 2, Williams in year 3/4, Fulky the last two years. The two Williams years UT was elite offensively but has taken a step back. And this would happen at Texas. Barnes’ offense produce well historically but are usually lower in eFG% and had super high oreb% that lead to effective teams.

Now COVID has made this harder. But I really want Barnes to take a look in the mirror and realize his offense just isn’t as effective unless he has an elite post player. The offense just doesn’t flow. They don’t get easy buckets off cuts or screens. They run very few on ball screens early in the shot clock. They take forever to get into their sets. They don’t push enough. There’s too much passing honestly. They pass up a lot of decent looks and end up not getting anything at the end of the shot clock.

Barnes needs to modernize the offense and rely less on the post game. Especially when you think about what next years team looks like too. They need more pick and roll/pick and pop offense and need to create more spacing away from the ball. Adding maybe some Elevators and Flow type actions could really help the offense some. To me when Springer gets healthy I’d run the offense around him and do a lot of 4 out-1 in options and give him the keys. And this will be very beneficial for next years team with Kennedy Chandler. If Tennessee wants to win anything meaningful this year, it’s time to modernize the offense.

This is just my interpretation of the situation.

 

[firedog28]

I don't watch Barnes press conferences for a reason,because I get bored with the minutia!

 

[Vols1-TN n KY]

This is spot on IMHO.

 

[PACKERVOL]

Barnes has not signed an elite big man since he's been here. Unless one comes from someone qualifying early, it doesn't look like he will sign one this year either. A huge weakness in his recruiting.

 

[TMvol10]

One aspect that is consistent and drives me crazy is the wing players break out for the ball way too early. Vescovi will have one foot over the half court line and our wings are already standing outside the three point line and aren’t open. As a result, Vescovi (or whoever) has to fend off his defender for the next 10 seconds before someone finally gets open to start the offense. That’s a lot to ask for a Pg, it wastes time and it’s just not good basketball.

 

[volmainia2]

Now, I’d like to say one thing before I start. Tennessee hasn’t lost with a healthy Jaden Springer. Because of his ability to create shots for himself and others plus he can push the pace And he opens up things for everyone. However I think this is more of a larger problem.

Barnes runs what most everyone ran up until the last ten years. A 3 out-2 in motion offense. The idea of a motion offense is run screens and cutters away from the ball to get good looks and mismatches. Barnes’ offense is a little bit different. They don’t run as much off ball screens and instead use post players for handoffs and getting them in high/low post spots to create. Look at Barnes’ history and you’ll see he has coached a lot of talented big man that put up good numbers.

Barnes adjusted the offense in year one because he didn’t have any real post players and had Kevin Punter. Since then the offense has run through a post player. Hubbs/Williams in year 2, Williams in year 3/4, Fulky the last two years. The two Williams years UT was elite offensively but has taken a step back. And this would happen at Texas. Barnes’ offense produce well historically but are usually lower in eFG% and had super high oreb% that lead to effective teams.

Now COVID has made this harder. But I really want Barnes to take a look in the mirror and realize his offense just isn’t as effective unless he has an elite post player. The offense just doesn’t flow. They don’t get easy buckets off cuts or screens. They run very few on ball screens early in the shot clock. They take forever to get into their sets. They don’t push enough. There’s too much passing honestly. They pass up a lot of decent looks and end up not getting anything at the end of the shot clock.

Barnes needs to modernize the offense and rely less on the post game. Especially when you think about what next years team looks like too. They need more pick and roll/pick and pop offense and need to create more spacing away from the ball. Adding maybe some Elevators and Flow type actions could really help the offense some. To me when Springer gets healthy I’d run the offense around him and do a lot of 4 out-1 in options and give him the keys. And this will be very beneficial for next years team with Kennedy Chandler. If Tennessee wants to win anything meaningful this year, it’s time to modernize the offense.

This is just my interpretation of the situation.

like Auburn

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

Barnes has not signed an elite big man since he's been here. Unless one comes from someone qualifying early, it doesn't look like he will sign one this year either. A huge weakness in his recruiting.

I think that elite big men want to play alongside guards that distribute rather than are focused on scoring. If Chandler was more likely to be a 3 year player than we’d probably have that elite big. When Bone was the PG TN hadn’t established itself as enough of a winning program to even ensure NCAAT invitations. Building up a program takes time. We aren’t a blue blood with a history to fall back on. Our not too ancient history includes stretches with 4 year players never seeing an NCAAT.

 

[tmack50]

I also don't like our post players specifically Pons and Fulkerson passing up shots within 10 feet of the basket just to pass it back out for a low percentage shot. Grant had the green light when he got it within 10-12 feet of the basket. We played way too passive inside the last 3 games and it stresses the guards to make a play when the clock is winding down. Ahem...Bailey.

 

[Fullfillmer]

Now, I’d like to say one thing before I start. Tennessee hasn’t lost with a healthy Jaden Springer. Because of his ability to create shots for himself and others plus he can push the pace And he opens up things for everyone. However I think this is more of a larger problem.

Barnes runs what most everyone ran up until the last ten years. A 3 out-2 in motion offense. The idea of a motion offense is run screens and cutters away from the ball to get good looks and mismatches. Barnes’ offense is a little bit different. They don’t run as much off ball screens and instead use post players for handoffs and getting them in high/low post spots to create. Look at Barnes’ history and you’ll see he has coached a lot of talented big man that put up good numbers.

Barnes adjusted the offense in year one because he didn’t have any real post players and had Kevin Punter. Since then the offense has run through a post player. Hubbs/Williams in year 2, Williams in year 3/4, Fulky the last two years. The two Williams years UT was elite offensively but has taken a step back. And this would happen at Texas. Barnes’ offense produce well historically but are usually lower in eFG% and had super high oreb% that lead to effective teams.

Now COVID has made this harder. But I really want Barnes to take a look in the mirror and realize his offense just isn’t as effective unless he has an elite post player. The offense just doesn’t flow. They don’t get easy buckets off cuts or screens. They run very few on ball screens early in the shot clock. They take forever to get into their sets. They don’t push enough. There’s too much passing honestly. They pass up a lot of decent looks and end up not getting anything at the end of the shot clock.

Barnes needs to modernize the offense and rely less on the post game. Especially when you think about what next years team looks like too. They need more pick and roll/pick and pop offense and need to create more spacing away from the ball. Adding maybe some Elevators and Flow type actions could really help the offense some. To me when Springer gets healthy I’d run the offense around him and do a lot of 4 out-1 in options and give him the keys. And this will be very beneficial for next years team with Kennedy Chandler. If Tennessee wants to win anything meaningful this year, it’s time to modernize the offense.

This is just my interpretation of the situation.

This certainly has merit and I agree with most but ...... I am not blaming Barnes. I would describe this as more along the lines of halftime adjustments - Truthfully we were beating the crap out of everyone by 20, ranked as high as 6th and Alabama and now everyone else has figured us out. Springer is the straw that stirs the drink, so he makes a tremendous difference, but it is certainly time for a few tweaks and adjustments. They have already tried a few. I am a little surprised that teams are getting away with being so physical against us without drawing fouls, but it is what it is. Against Missouri a few bounces went against us early and we were not ready or able to make the fixes necessary to get back in it. Barnes gets paid a lot more than you or me to fix these issues, so I am sure that his team is hard at it - looking to adjust so that we can get back on track.

The offense does bog down when there is pressure on our point guard the length of the court which slows us getting into our offense and our sets. Now they are also overplaying our passing lanes and pushing us out farther, which in turn pushes out our back court etc. Springer can penetrate when pressed and either score or dish which is critical to the success of our offense. We need next years point guard recruit with this team. I think they will get it figured out.
Pon's constantly on the outside shooting up 3's is not an answer either. If Pons and Fulky have room to operate - they can score, it is how do you create better spacing and room for them to operate. It's still a work in process.

 

[therickbol]

Now, I’d like to say one thing before I start. Tennessee hasn’t lost with a healthy Jaden Springer. Because of his ability to create shots for himself and others plus he can push the pace And he opens up things for everyone. However I think this is more of a larger problem.

Barnes runs what most everyone ran up until the last ten years. A 3 out-2 in motion offense. The idea of a motion offense is run screens and cutters away from the ball to get good looks and mismatches. Barnes’ offense is a little bit different. They don’t run as much off ball screens and instead use post players for handoffs and getting them in high/low post spots to create. Look at Barnes’ history and you’ll see he has coached a lot of talented big man that put up good numbers.

Barnes adjusted the offense in year one because he didn’t have any real post players and had Kevin Punter. Since then the offense has run through a post player. Hubbs/Williams in year 2, Williams in year 3/4, Fulky the last two years. The two Williams years UT was elite offensively but has taken a step back. And this would happen at Texas. Barnes’ offense produce well historically but are usually lower in eFG% and had super high oreb% that lead to effective teams.

Now COVID has made this harder. But I really want Barnes to take a look in the mirror and realize his offense just isn’t as effective unless he has an elite post player. The offense just doesn’t flow. They don’t get easy buckets off cuts or screens. They run very few on ball screens early in the shot clock. They take forever to get into their sets. They don’t push enough. There’s too much passing honestly. They pass up a lot of decent looks and end up not getting anything at the end of the shot clock.

Barnes needs to modernize the offense and rely less on the post game. Especially when you think about what next years team looks like too. They need more pick and roll/pick and pop offense and need to create more spacing away from the ball. Adding maybe some Elevators and Flow type actions could really help the offense some. To me when Springer gets healthy I’d run the offense around him and do a lot of 4 out-1 in options and give him the keys. And this will be very beneficial for next years team with Kennedy Chandler. If Tennessee wants to win anything meaningful this year, it’s time to modernize the offense.

This is just my interpretation of the situation.

I think there is some give and take in your thoughts. I am not sure I agree with the statement that they do not run many off ball screens. They screen quite a bit off the ball. I do think, this year in particular, they do not utilize much early offense and end up taking too long to get into sets. His offensive philosophy relies heavily on making reads using a variation of about 3 different off ball screen actions. What looks different about Barnes offense and what many have gone to is the lack of spacing at times. It is not predicated on spreading the floor and giving space for playmakers to attack and create. His system creates shots off the screen action and out of the feed into the post. Here is the thing about systems. They are made to look great or mediocre based on having players that are either great or mediocre with what they bring to the table in that system. Grant demanded a double-team in the post and that created shots for teammates. Fulky at times has also done that. Right now he is playing very poorly and his post-ups do not create shots for teammates. That leaves us dependent on screen and cuts to get open looks. We do not have tons of shooters or players that create mismatches so teams are clogging the interior and switching most screens and cuts. That means fewer open looks created out of the offense.

 

[Vols8086]

I think there is some give and take in your thoughts. I am not sure I agree with the statement that they do not run many off ball screens. They screen quite a bit off the ball. I do think, this year in particular, they do not utilize much early offense and end up taking too long to get into sets. His offensive philosophy relies heavily on making reads using a variation of about 3 different off ball screen actions. What looks different about Barnes offense and what many have gone to is the lack of spacing at times. It is not predicated on spreading the floor and giving space for playmakers to attack and create. His system creates shots off the screen action and out of the feed into the post. Here is the thing about systems. They are made to look great or mediocre based on having players that are either great or mediocre with what they bring to the table in that system. Grant demanded a double-team in the post and that created shots for teammates. Fulky at times has also done that. Right now he is playing very poorly and his post-ups do not create shots for teammates. That leaves us dependent on screen and cuts to get open looks. We do not have tons of shooters or players that create mismatches so teams are clogging the interior and switching most screens and cuts. That means fewer open looks created out of the offense.

Not to mention we seem to always have 2 of Fulky, Pons, Anosike, or ORN on the floor which clogs the lane. Pons is the only threat from 3 and even he needs plenty of space and time to get his shot off. You can easily sag off of those 4 guys on the backside action, which means very little room for the curl while also providing help in the event we throw the ball on the block from the ball side action. Which allows the defender to chase the curl over the top knowing he has help just parked in the lane.

 

[jeff1vol]

Good luck with that! Barnes aint changing ****! I can guarantee you!

 

[Volfan1000]

Tennessee has the back court depth to run up and down the floor on a consistent basis and I would like Barnes to take a page out of Pearl's playbook and do that at every opportunity.

Springer, Johnson and Bailey all have the ability to create a shot for themselves within the offense as does Vescovi and James.

The game against Mississippi State tomorrow night is a must win game because Kansas will be a very tough game to win at home because Barnes is 6-17 in his career against the Jayhawks.

 

[b_gann]

Now, I’d like to say one thing before I start. Tennessee hasn’t lost with a healthy Jaden Springer. Because of his ability to create shots for himself and others plus he can push the pace And he opens up things for everyone. However I think this is more of a larger problem.

Barnes runs what most everyone ran up until the last ten years. A 3 out-2 in motion offense. The idea of a motion offense is run screens and cutters away from the ball to get good looks and mismatches. Barnes’ offense is a little bit different. They don’t run as much off ball screens and instead use post players for handoffs and getting them in high/low post spots to create. Look at Barnes’ history and you’ll see he has coached a lot of talented big man that put up good numbers.

Barnes adjusted the offense in year one because he didn’t have any real post players and had Kevin Punter. Since then the offense has run through a post player. Hubbs/Williams in year 2, Williams in year 3/4, Fulky the last two years. The two Williams years UT was elite offensively but has taken a step back. And this would happen at Texas. Barnes’ offense produce well historically but are usually lower in eFG% and had super high oreb% that lead to effective teams.

Now COVID has made this harder. But I really want Barnes to take a look in the mirror and realize his offense just isn’t as effective unless he has an elite post player. The offense just doesn’t flow. They don’t get easy buckets off cuts or screens. They run very few on ball screens early in the shot clock. They take forever to get into their sets. They don’t push enough. There’s too much passing honestly. They pass up a lot of decent looks and end up not getting anything at the end of the shot clock.

Barnes needs to modernize the offense and rely less on the post game. Especially when you think about what next years team looks like too. They need more pick and roll/pick and pop offense and need to create more spacing away from the ball. Adding maybe some Elevators and Flow type actions could really help the offense some. To me when Springer gets healthy I’d run the offense around him and do a lot of 4 out-1 in options and give him the keys. And this will be very beneficial for next years team with Kennedy Chandler. If Tennessee wants to win anything meaningful this year, it’s time to modernize the offense.

This is just my interpretation of the situation.

I agree. I hate when the 5 ends up at the top of the key with no threat of shooting it. It’s a waste of time and space. We need more on ball screens to get in the teeth of the defense. Curious to see what Pons at 5 looks like to close games.

 

[Vol49er]

How anyone could disagree with this at this point is beyond me

 

[TartanTurff]

Preseason consensus SEC champs, mentions of a deep tournament run, this shat show with Oregon State looks much like the Syracuse game in 1977 which was the end of the Erne and Bernie show, non competitive in a first round NCAA tournament game, Tennessee was out of this game midway through the first half, perhaps the most disappointing and underachieving basketball team in decades, not sure what the problem is but it will be a long offseason.

 

[zjcvols]

How anyone could disagree with this at this point is beyond me

I remember when posters said we just missed shots against Ole Miss when I was talking about how worried I was

 

[bleedingTNorange]

I remember the posters saying Barnes would never have us dancing, yet 3 in a row lol

 

[mr.checkerboards]

Its been 30 years, he hasnt changed so far, why will he change now?

 

[VolsSportsFan]

I remember the posters saying Barnes would never have us dancing, yet 3 in a row lol

I know it's 3 in a row....but we weren't going dancing last year.

And at one point this team was talked about as a Final Four team and we limp out of the NCAAT getting a beatdown we haven't seen since 2011.

 

[bleedingTNorange]

I know it's 3 in a row....but we weren't going dancing last year.

And at one point this team was talked about as a Final Four team and we limp out of the NCAAT getting a beatdown we haven't seen since 2011.

Something Auburn can’t claim that’s for sure...or Izzo getting knocked off in First Four I suppose

 

[Border Vol]

Change the offense=Change the head coach

 

[cncchris33]

Something Auburn can’t claim that’s for sure...or Izzo getting knocked off in First Four I suppose

Hard to relish in the failure of other teams after what I just watched. I still want Barnes to be successful, but simply saying at least we aren't Auburn or Michigan State isn't a reason to excuse today's effort. I know you'll say that isnt what you're doing, but in actuality, it is. At best, it's deflecting.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Hard to relish in the failure of other teams after what I just watched. I still want Barnes to be successful, but simply saying at least we aren't Auburn or Michigan State isn't a reason to excuse today's effort. I know you'll say that isnt what you're doing, but in actuality, it is. At best, it's deflecting.

Especially when one of those teams still kicked our ass this year with not even their best player. And honestly doing this crap after that performance, the "at least we aren't [insert other team]" crap....I'm sorry but that's just so Vandy.

 

[cncchris33]

And just watch, something like Oklahoma State losing, or Loyola-Chicago beating Illinois is going to happen, too.