8 Vols assistants reject UT pay cut to help with losses due to covid

#203
#203
Volsfaninva917 said:
Tennessee football: 8 assistants reject pay cuts. Martin, Graham accept

  • Offensive coordinator Jim Chaney
  • Defensive coordinator Derrick Ansley
  • Offensive line coach Will Friend
  • Quarterbacks coach Chris Weinke
  • Inside linebackers coach Brian Niedermeyer
  • Outside linebackers coach Shelton Felton
  • Tight ends coach Joe Osovet
  • Strength and conditioning coach A.J. Artis
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I'd throw out Will Friend and Chris Weinke ASAP when the season ends...Nieds has been underpaid for a couple of years while putting in a good recruiting effort. Don't know much about Shelton or Osovet to recommend anything. S&C coach Artis is making a third of Fitzgerald, so we'll need to see if the team is stronger next year. Sit down with Chaney and Ansley to see who to hire to replace the dead beats...
 
#205
#205
howie87 said:
Lmao, careful with that ethics arguement... That's a looooooong rabbit hole to tumble down... It's not the responsibility of those employees to mismanage the Universities finances, which has been done for years... It's not those employees that are using football program profits to prop up other athletics that don't bring in revenue... Be careful with "what is ethical"...
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If we have to EXPLAIN why it’s unethical to you...well...then you PROBABLY won’t understand why we feel that way.
 
#206
#206
hog88 said:
I know the endowment has nothing to do with athletics but the guy I responded to was saying they should help the university out. The university doesn't need help other than better management.

I don't fault the guys who agreed to a pay cut, it's an individual decision. But I do not fault the ones that refused.
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I am not necessarily going to fault them for doing it because it is their choice. I do think it shows a lack of unity on our staff, but I will also say that I am not sure they all thought it through. This decision over 10% could backfire because of the publicity it has created. Even if you take out the part about them not helping their fellow employees, I am not sure it was the best decision personally.
 
#207
#207
I'm less about hostility toward those who aren't opting for a pay cut, than I am rewarding the ones who did take a pay cut when the money comes back. No point grousing over the ones who made business decisions. But the ones who were willing to drop some dollars to help the UTAD out? Remember them. And reward them when it's appropriate to do so.
 
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#208
#208
1967vol said:
Didn't the "Boss' set an example and take a pay cut? State employees took a pay cut, but some of these Football contract coaches refused, while in other sports they did. I think Fulmer now knows a little better what type of Football staff he has.
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So? The boss has made millions off of the University, the boss never turned back any of his buyout when the athletic department was facing hard financial times now did he?

Fulmer should know what kind of staff he has, a bad one starting with the head coach.
 
#210
#210
BalledUPfists said:
You must not work at a place that has seen people lose jobs while management gets insane salaries and bonuses. Lucky for you....
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This is true. But years ago I have deferred my own salary a time or two so that I could make payroll and not lay anyone off. Didn't seem to build any loyalty in the troops.
 
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#212
#212
hog88 said:
So? The boss has made millions off of the University, the boss never turned back any of his buyout when the athletic department was facing hard financial times now did he?

Fulmer should know what kind of staff he has, a bad one starting with the head coach.
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Fulmer wasn't working for the University during the time you mentioned. "Fulmer should know what kind of staff he has, a bad one starting with the head coach." We agree with that!!
 
#213
#213
IPleadInsanity said:
Doing a job they would gladly do for 80% less. They only make what they make because of the desire by fans to win, not based on actual value to the university. Just eliminate the coaches with no buy out clause to get to the budget. The remaining coaches can double up. Could not be worse than it is now.
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Pay them half for a halfazz job.
 
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#214
#214
BalledUPfists said:
If we have to EXPLAIN why it’s unethical to you...well...then you PROBABLY won’t understand why we feel that way.
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Your response indicates you actually didn't understand my entire point, which I'm not surprised about coming from "balledupfists"... "Errr, I don't understand this, I smash, me no think..." I get it, not your forte, no worries...

My point was- what is ethical is within the relative lens of what you are looking at... How much of the issue are you actually considering... How much context are you applying to the situation... If you want to settle an ethical dilemma based on A, B, and C factors, it may seem right at face value... Now imagine someone comes along and adds D, E, and F factors... The tenor of your decision has changed from "ethically good" to possibly "ethically neutral"... Okay, now imagine ANOTHER person comes along and adds G, H, I, J, K, L, M, N, etc factors and all of a sudden your decision that seemed ethically good, when all of the factors and context have been explained, is now actually ethically wrong based on ALL of the available data...

Be extremely, extremely careful with how you decide to spend OTHER individual's money based on what is "ethically right" when you don't have all of the context...
 
#215
#215
allvol123 said:
Sounds like you're not good at explaining your beliefs.
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No, people have become numb and unreasonable in their stubborn beliefs that there isn’t right and wrong. Common sense tells us that it’s a bad look and selfish to not take a small fraction cut. ESPECIALLY when you have had poor job performance.
 
#216
#216
There is no reason to overcomplicate this case. Just look at the "grouping' of the coaches who refused. If they gave a whit about public opinion they would have worked out "something" with the University to allow them to take this cut now for rewards later. No, they are not going to be fired this year nor next, most likely. If they are not smart enough to figure this out, maybe that explains their coaching results.
 
#217
#217
BalledUPfists said:
No, people have become numb and unreasonable in their stubborn beliefs that there isn’t right and wrong. Common sense tells us that it’s a bad look and selfish to not take a small fraction cut. ESPECIALLY when you have had poor job performance.
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Common sense doesnt tell me that. Their salary isnt dependent on the revenue of a for profit business. Them taking a pay cut isnt a move to help a for profit business stay afloat. So given that, why take a pay cut.

They are hired mercenaries. If you dont understand that by now, you're too dumb to be having conversations on ethics.
 
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#218
#218
howie87 said:
Your response indicates you actually didn't understand my entire point, which I'm not surprised about coming from "balledupfists"... "Errr, I don't understand this, I smash, me no think..." I get it, not your forte, no worries...

My point was- what is ethical is within the relative lens of what you are looking at... How much of the issue are you actually considering... How much context are you applying to the situation... If you want to settle an ethical dilemma based on A, B, and C factors, it may seem right at face value... Now imagine someone comes along and adds D, E, and F factors... The tenor of your decision has changed from "ethically good" to possibly "ethically neutral"... Okay, now imagine ANOTHER person comes along and adds G, H, I, J, K, L, M, N, etc factors and all of a sudden your decision that seemed ethically good, when all of the factors and context have been explained, is now actually ethically wrong based on ALL of the available data...

Be extremely, extremely careful with how you decide to spend OTHER individual's money based on what is "ethically right" when you don't have all of the context...
Click to expand...

(Sigh). My Name is a satirical reference to Penny Hardaway’s reference of our basketball team having balled up fists. It’s OK, not everybody gets the reference.

I don’t need a lesson on the alphabet man. Ethics are pretty simple. You do what’s right. The majority of people realize this is a horrible look, and a selfish move based on their job performance. People lost jobs at UT that could have remained employed if these coaches all freed up some additional funds. So, that’s the deal.
 
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#221
#221
allvol123 said:
Common sense doesnt tell me that. Their salary isnt dependent on the revenue of a for profit business. Them taking a pay cut isnt a move to help a for profit business stay afloat. So given that, why take a pay cut.

They are hired mercenaries. If you dont understand that by now, you're too dumb to be having conversations on ethics.
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They are overpaid employees that have under performed their duties this year. Therefore, they should be subject to the consequences of that. The ethics component comes into play where if you know you’re under performing while other people out there (within your organization) are getting fired; to CHOOSE to continue your current rate of pay is selfish and unethical decision.
 
#222
#222
BalledUPfists said:
They are overpaid employees that ave under performed their duties this year. Therefore, they should be subject to the consequences of that. The ethics component comes into play where if you know you’re under performing while other people out there (within your organization) are getting fired; to CHOOSE to continue your current rate of pay is selfish and unethical decision.
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I get it, your feelings hurt because the ball team sucks. Too bad, they signed contracts. It is a business of hired mercenaries, there is no reason to hand out favors in either direction.

To continue to expect a contract to be executed as written, is completely ethical.
 
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#223
#223
BalledUPfists said:
No, people have become numb and unreasonable in their stubborn beliefs that there isn’t right and wrong. Common sense tells us that it’s a bad look and selfish to not take a small fraction cut. ESPECIALLY when you have had poor job performance.
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Maybe look up ethical in the dictionary and start there. I think you have latched onto the wrong term.
 
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#224
#224
BalledUPfists said:
No, people have become numb and unreasonable in their stubborn beliefs that there isn’t right and wrong. Common sense tells us that it’s a bad look and selfish to not take a small fraction cut. ESPECIALLY when you have had poor job performance.
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They refused in May/June, that was coming off of a winning streak.
 
#225
#225
hog88 said:
This is true. But years ago I have deferred my own salary a time or two so that I could make payroll and not lay anyone off. Didn't seem to build any loyalty in the troops.
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I’d recommend to re-evaluate my troops then. I want people on my team that are true team first kind of people. Unfortunately, that’s rare these days.
 
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