Georgia dismisses another projected starter

[Jaws]

I’ve also noticed, with regard to various programs having off field issues, the National media controls the narrative for certain teams. This is getting worse and more obvious. Certain teams are promoted and protected. This is great if your team is one of the “chosen ones” and I’ll admit Florida was one during the Tebow era. How else could a team with dudes like Hernandez and Tony Joiner basically get through 4 years with nothing but glowing stories about Tebow?

But Florida is on the outside now. Recent Paul Finebaum headlines AFTER UGA’s Brenton Cox issue:

- “Georgia has proven in two games against Alabama they can go punch-for-punch with the bully in the league...but can Kirby Smart learn how to finish better.”

- “A bad offseason can be forgotten in a hurry. If Florida comes out and blows the doors off Miami in Week 0.”

See the difference? Georgia already penciled in versus Bama, despite a horrendous offseason, but Florida has to overcome its offseason, which has been somewhat benign to most Gator fans? We’ve seen bad offseasons, and this ain’t one.

Hell, Clemson had a steroid scandal where half the team tested positive for a banned substance. What the hell happened to that story? Can you imagine if that were at Florida or Tennessee? The programs would be shut down by now. But for Clemson, that story just disappeared after Dabo said “we’re handling it in house” or some such.

I guess the solution to this is to win football games. Kick everyone’s butt, make yourself nationally relevant and then you get in, or back in, the protected club.

 

[Jaws]

Regurgitating .. the tweet just came out this morning..

The tweet came out this morning because a local UF beat writer asked a question about it in Mullen’s press conference yesterday, thus bringing it to light again. The Huggins issue has been out there for weeks, since early July at least. This is why UF fans are so pissed at this Matt Baker a-hole at the Tampa Bay Times. Bringing up old news in a press conference instead of asking about how the o-line is coming along or which freshmen are standing out.

 

[Jaws]

Glad you brought this up. I am guessing you live in Florida as I do as well. I don't know about other states but in Florida you can not legally have sex with a woman who is intoxicated if she says after the fact that she didn't want to. Winston admitted to having sex with that chick and every surveillance video of her prior to her and Winston being together showed her completely drunk. The very definition of rape at that point but somehow Tallahassee PD sweeps it under the rug. And I am a Bucs fan too but rape is still rape no matter who it is.

Right. She’s drunk as hell on the video cameras and she claims she was drugged, which looks correct when you see her inability to even walk on the cameras. She’s obviously in bad enough condition that she needed help, yet Winston somehow ends up having sex with her that night? It was sketchy then and it’s sketchy to this day.

 

[05_never_again]

I’ve also noticed, with regard to various programs having off field issues, the National media controls the narrative for certain teams. This is getting worse and more obvious. Certain teams are promoted and protected.

Yes - those who are currently winning, no matter who they are, are promoted and protected because they currently drive ratings.

Florida was absolutely protected during the Urban years, not as much now. Urban himself was generally protected throughout his career.

 

[Jaws]

Yes - those who are currently winning, no matter who they are, are promoted and protected because they currently drive ratings.

Florida was absolutely protected during the Urban years, not as much now. Urban himself was generally protected throughout his career.

Yep, Urban was protected until the Zach Smith issue which even the college football media couldn’t shield him from. Once you get the national political media sniffing around, you’re done. The sports writers take a back seat when that happens, especially if it involves race or violence against women.

 

[05_never_again]

Yep, Urban was protected until the Zach Smith issue which even the college football media couldn’t shield him from. Once you get the national political media sniffing around, you’re done. The sports writers take a back seat when that happens, especially if it involves race or violence against women.

The general environment in the country at large at that time (#MeToo) precluded the media from going to bat for him. If that story broke in say, 2008, he would have had defenders in the media for sure, particularly because the charges were dropped and he was never found guilty of anything.

One of the reasons it was astonishing to me that Schiano had so many defenders in the media after we pulled his offer is because what he was connected to, however tangential it might be (and it was really damn tangential). There typically is zero defending of someone whose name comes up in something like that, even if it was second-hand hearsay from an unreliable witness that wasn't admissible at trial.

 

[TDawg]

Right. She’s drunk as hell on the video cameras and she claims she was drugged, which looks correct when you see her inability to even walk on the cameras. She’s obviously in bad enough condition that she needed help, yet Winston somehow ends up having sex with her that night? It was sketchy then and it’s sketchy to this day.

To make it worse, that guy from TPD that went through the press conference when they were basically letting Winston off the hook was damn near making a joke out of it. The only joke there was the TPD and their investigation.

 

[butchna]

The general environment in the country at large at that time (#MeToo) precluded the media from going to bat for him. If that story broke in say, 2008, he would have had defenders in the media for sure, particularly because the charges were dropped and he was never found guilty of anything.

One of the reasons it was astonishing to me that Schiano had so many defenders in the media after we pulled his offer is because what he was connected to, however tangential it might be (and it was really damn tangential). There typically is zero defending of someone whose name comes up in something like that, even if it was second-hand hearsay from an unreliable witness that wasn't admissible at trial.

When was McQueary deemed “unreliable”? It was second-hand but what McQueary claimed to witness was used to help bury Sandusky and Paterno’s reaction to what McQueary reported to him buried Paterno.

 

[Jax_Vol]

Yep, Urban was protected until the Zach Smith issue which even the college football media couldn’t shield him from. Once you get the national political media sniffing around, you’re done. The sports writers take a back seat when that happens, especially if it involves race or violence against women.

At least we can all agree that what Lane Kiffin said about Urban was indeed true.

 

[05_never_again]

When was McQueary deemed “unreliable”? It was second-hand but what McQueary claimed to witness was used to help bury Sandusky and Paterno’s reaction to what McQueary reported to him buried Paterno.

The main incident he said he saw, yes, helped bury Sandusky. However, a lot of the really damning other stuff he alleged (like the comment he made about Schiano, or other coaches having seen stuff, or other coaches having covered stuff up) was entirely unsubstantiated and inadmissible in court.

 

[butchna]

The main incident he said he saw, yes, helped bury Sandusky. However, a lot of the really damning other stuff he alleged (like the comment he made about Schiano, or other coaches having seen stuff, or other coaches having covered stuff up) was entirely unsubstantiated and inadmissible in court.

The “really damning stuff” was what he witnessed. Everything else was hearsay. Whether it was substantiated or not was irrelevant...it was hearsay and therefore inadmissible. Nothing about him character wise changes case law. And it was gleaned from questioning him...not something he came running into the room screaming. I’m not familiar with the “lot of really damning other stuff”. What else was alleged by him?

 

[05_never_again]

The “really damning stuff” was what he witnessed. Everything else was hearsay. Whether it was substantiated or not was irrelevant...it was hearsay and therefore inadmissible. Nothing about him character wise changes case law. And it was gleaned from questioning him...not something he came running into the room screaming. I’m not familiar with the “lot of really damning other stuff”. What else was alleged by him?

He just alleged a ton of stuff that couldn't be substantiated. You know the "Victim 2" he said he saw in the shower with Sandusky? They never actually found out who that kid was. Doesn't mean it didn't happen (I'm sure it did because lots of other victims came forward). He made a lot of statements to investigators alleging a cover up involving Paterno, other coaches, etc. that could just simply never be substantiated. McQueary was in total CYA mode during that entire trial.

 

[butchna]

He just alleged a ton of stuff that couldn't be substantiated. You know the "Victim 2" he said he saw in the shower with Sandusky? They never actually found out who that kid was. Doesn't mean it didn't happen (I'm sure it did because lots of other victims came forward). He made a lot of statements to investigators alleging a cover up involving Paterno, other coaches, etc. that could just simply never be substantiated. McQueary was in total CYA mode during that entire trial.

His ass wasn’t the one that was in danger. He has to live with what he DIDN’T DO (like pull that kid out of there right then) for the rest of his life, but otherwise he’s the first to actually report anything. He doesn’t deserve any medals but to intimate that he conjured any of this mess makes no sense. He’s essentially unemployable as a coach both for what he failed to do and by the coaching community for what he did do (violate their unwritten code).

 

[05_never_again]

His ass wasn’t the one that was in danger. He has to live with what he DIDN’T DO (like pull that kid out of there right then) for the rest of his life, but otherwise he’s the first to actually report anything. He doesn’t deserve any medals but to intimate that he conjured any of this mess makes no sense. He’s essentially unemployable as a coach both for what he failed to do and by the coaching community for what he did do (violate their unwritten code).

I didn't intimate that he conjured any of the mess. I mean, I don't think he made any of it up - he probably believes every word he said. I simply said he wasn't all that great of a witness, which most observers of the trial (who thought Sandusky was surely guilty) believed.

 

[butchna]

I didn't intimate that he conjured any of the mess. I mean, I don't think he made any of it up - he probably believes every word he said. I simply said he wasn't all that great of a witness, which most observers of the trial (who thought Sandusky was surely guilty) believed.

“Unsubstantiated” just has that ring to it. I know the legalese but we’re not bound by it. It’s an all-around failure with no winners. Victims, the monster who victimized them and the supposed grownups who failed everybody...including themselves. I would say I never want to be considered a great witness with this evil in the background.

 

[GreyWolf1129]

A Florida fan talking about Georgia having a ton of distractions is rich

And a UGA fan on a UT board arguing with a UF fan about whether UGA or UF has more more distractions is not rich...but it is fun to watch.

 

[Nerwen Aldarion]

I have no doubt Schiano know, since marrying into some Penn State connections I’m still astounded by the coverup. Players would crack jokes about it, everyone on that staff knew something. No doubt in my mind.

 

[TDawg]

And a UGA fan on a UT board arguing with a UF fan about whether UGA or UF has more more distractions is not rich...but it is fun to watch.

I think this one is called "Around the NCAA" not "THIS IS THE UT BOARD"

 

[BAMA-DAWG]

Has to do with the trajectory of the program, just like with any other coach.

In 3 years Kirby has gone 8-5, 13-2 with an SEC title/CFP appearance, 11-3 with an East title and NY6 bowl loss. From what I can gather, Dawg fans want him to make the CFP every year, which usually means winning the SEC but not always. A second consecutive year without a playoff appearance will be seen as a pretty obvious regression for him. At that point, Kirby finds himself in a pretty funny spot because the elite recruiting he can point to as a continued positive actually makes him look worse because it'll highlight the underachieving.

IMO, a loss to someone other than Saban in the SECCG (or an outright miss of the SECCG, but that goes without saying) is what it'll take to get his seat really hot. Of course they'll be pulling their hair out at a 3rd consecutive loss to Saban, but then again he is the greatest to have ever coached. If Florida wins the East, or if they lose to someone other than Alabama in the SECCG (like LSU), he probably comes into 2020 having the win the SEC to stay out of dire straits.

With all due respect, I doubt Kirby's going anywhere, not for a very good while. Richt stayed for 15 years, and he wasn't even an alum. DAWG fans are ecstatic to be where we are, and yes, it disappoints to lose two in a row to UA. But with the recruiting going on the way it is, the talent is there. I believe the talent of any team with a top 5 recruiting class is very even. It's the position coaches that will determine how well that talent is developed. What consecutive top 5 classes gets you is depth.

 

[05_never_again]

With all due respect, I doubt Kirby's going anywhere, not for a very good while. Richt stayed for 15 years, and he wasn't even an alum. DAWG fans are ecstatic to be where we are, and yes, it disappoints to lose two in a row to UA. But with the recruiting going on the way it is, the talent is there. I believe the talent of any team with a top 5 recruiting class is very even. It's the position coaches that will determine how well that talent is developed. What consecutive top 5 classes gets you is depth.

I don't think he is either, but if he doesn't get back into the playoff this year he'll be made a little uncomfortable and won't continue to get benefits of the doubt. The program is currently perceived (I think rightly) as being right there on the bumper of Alabama, but you have not been able to actually get around them yet. Your frustration with the previous coach was identical - Richt couldn't ever pass the car in front of him and win a title. Someone said earlier in the thread that how Georgia loses games is probably more of a factor than how many games they actually lose, and that's probably right. Georgia really should have beaten Alabama twice already with one of those wins being a title and the other effectively being a CFP quarterfinal game. Georgia played better than Alabama for a majority of both games, led for almost 100% of the playing time, yet somehow lost both.

If Kirby continues to recruit the way he does but cannot get around Alabama, or whoever the major foil is, that has a way over time of actually increasing the pressure on him. People start grumbling about why he can't win with these insane recruiting classes.

 

[butchna]

I think this one is called "Around the NCAA" not "THIS IS THE UT BOARD"

Which board did I click on ?

 

[Atlanta917]

I don't think he is either, but if he doesn't get back into the playoff this year he'll be made a little uncomfortable and won't continue to get benefits of the doubt. The program is currently perceived (I think rightly) as being right there on the bumper of Alabama, but you have not been able to actually get around them yet. Your frustration with the previous coach was identical - Richt couldn't ever pass the car in front of him and win a title. Someone said earlier in the thread that how Georgia loses games is probably more of a factor than how many games they actually lose, and that's probably right. Georgia really should have beaten Alabama twice already with one of those wins being a title and the other effectively being a CFP quarterfinal game. Georgia played better than Alabama for a majority of both games, led for almost 100% of the playing time, yet somehow lost both.

If Kirby continues to recruit the way he does but cannot get around Alabama, or whoever the major foil is, that has a way over time of actually increasing the pressure on him. People start grumbling about why he can't win with these insane recruiting classes.

Richt was fired because the game passed him by, not because of Bama. Not hard to see his failures at Miami. As far as the UGA Bama games, Bama was favored by 10+ in both games. Not sure how an underdog is considered a favorite. Kirby is a third year coach. Saying he's bad because he hasn't won a championship in 3 years is a bit ridiculous, especially when the only reason he hasn't won one is that he was blocked by the GOAT. It took Saba, Dabo, Urban, and Spurrier more than 3 total years of coaching to win their first championships, so why is Kirby being held to a different standard? Same for players leaving in the off season. Bama has 2 5* players transfer this off season as well. That's what happens when you recruit at an elite level. In today's age players, QB's more than any other, would rather transfer and start than sit and win the position.

 

[05_never_again]

Richt was fired because the game passed him by, not because of Bama. Not hard to see his failures at Miami. As far as the UGA Bama games, Bama was favored by 10+ in both games. Not sure how an underdog is considered a favorite. Kirby is a third year coach. Saying he's bad because he hasn't won a championship in 3 years is a bit ridiculous, especially when the only reason he hasn't won one is that he was blocked by the GOAT. It took Saba, Dabo, Urban, and Spurrier more than 3 total years of coaching to win their first championships, so why is Kirby being held to a different standard? Same for players leaving in the off season. Bama has 2 5* players transfer this off season as well. That's what happens when you recruit at an elite level. In today's age players, QB's more than any other, would rather transfer and start than sit and win the position.

Richt was fired because he couldn't get over the hump - "the hump" wasn't always the same team. It was Alabama once, it was Florida a bunch of times, it was LSU early in his career. It's early, but so far Kirby hasn't been able to get over it either. Just so happens it's been Alabama both times.

I know Georgia wasn't favored in either game against Alabama. I said they should have won because they blew multi-possession leads in both games and outplayed Alabama for significant portions of both games. Even if you are an underdog, losing in the fashion they did is a rough way to go.

 

[Booker512]

Richt was fired because he couldn't get over the hump - "the hump" wasn't always the same team. It was Alabama once, it was Florida a bunch of times, it was LSU early in his career. It's early, but so far Kirby hasn't been able to get over it either. Just so happens it's been Alabama both times.

I know Georgia wasn't favored in either game against Alabama. I said they should have won because they blew multi-possession leads in both games and outplayed Alabama for significant portions of both games. Even if you are an underdog, losing in the fashion they did is a rough way to go.

Yep. Kind of the way I see it too. UGA was the better team both times they played Alabama. The last game with that fake punt on 4th and a million miles. I mean. Yikes. That was some Butch Jones shizzz if I’ve ever seen it. And I have

 

[TUSKtimes]

Georgia really should have beaten Alabama twice already with one of those wins being a title and the other effectively being a CFP quarterfinal game. Georgia played better than Alabama for a majority of both games, led for almost 100% of the playing time, yet somehow lost both.

You haven't figured out how Georgia got beat in both Bama games yet? This is the total points they've scored against our defense in the 4th quarter of both games: 0, that's spelled zero.

This magnificent QB they have, what do you think is the deal with that? Does he have the clutch gene? Can he carry a team on his shoulders with all that talent and be the difference-maker?