2020 Presidential Race

[IPleadInsanity]

They are either uneducated or there is some serious cognitive dissonance going on. There is no other way to describe Trump's continued bailout of the farming industry, to help mitigate the damage of his tariff war (although, that only means that the American people are paying for his tariff war twice), than as a form of "socialism". However, if you were to ask the average Trump supporter, including those who are posting to this thread and railing against the evils of socialism, if they were aware of this... you would mostly find that they are completely oblivious to the Trump $16 billion bailout of the farming industry last month. That doesn't necessarily make them uneducated but it does make them willfully ignorant. It is one or the other.

You believe the CNN hype, consumers will pay the tariffs. You have been boondoggled by the spin. Some may be paying higher prices but the most Chinese companies are forced to drop their prices in order to export into this market, some are splitting the additional cost, most are looking for alternative supply. Thousands of temporary solutions are being found, some products just are not being imported, others placed huge orders with China providing big discounts to sell out their inventories. Few are able to pass the duty along to consumers. 25% is creating a lot of competition in the marketplace. It's far from business as usual. The overall effect will not be clear for months to come. No one, let alone CNN or the NYT's, can say with certainty exactly what is occurring and why.

 

[Weezer]

Every one of these laws I've read explicitly state if the mother's life is in danger. This idea that is going around that Democrats/liberals are waiting in medical offices looking to beat delivered babies to death for sport is one of the more absurd things to pop up during the last few months. The rhetoric changed a few months ago when the right started this current attack on Roe.

While I agree that it is somewhat being blown out of proportion, like I said, there was a law I read(can't remember if it was NY or VA) that was too broadly worded(IMO) and did not specify only if the mother's life was in danger.

 

[tvolsfan]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the New Black Panther Party considered a hate group? They appear to be showing support for the Dems, much the way the Klan supports Trump.

So, should the left be condemned for this as Trump is condemned for the Klan supporting him? I doubt either side has truly solicited the support, but all things being even, shouldn't this be an issue?

@tvolsfan

I think both sides get support they don't necessarily want.

Is there any evidence of support for the democratic party or its candidates? Or just the idea of reparations for black people? I don't even remember seeing the NBBP endorsing Obama.

 

[tvolsfan]

Yes sir.

You will have to be specific about which social programs.

I specifically mentioned health care and education. As far as health care is concerned, I've expressed my position on this. If we can't replicate what is successfully implemented throughout every developed country, we have pretty much failed as a nation. There are numerous models throughout the developed world, basically all of which provide better health care for less money. At this point, I think believing the fear mongering with health care is akin to believing in ghost stories.

Education is trickier. I think struggling schools need to be helped, but I don't really know how we can force people to stay in school. Also, our higher education system is great, but it's extremely expensive. Yes, we would see increased taxes, but we would have to look into reigning in costs.

What other programs are you referring to?

 

[McDad]

You will have to be specific about which social programs.

I specifically mentioned health care and education. As far as health care is concerned, I've expressed my position on this. If we can't replicate what is successfully implemented throughout every developed country, we have pretty much failed as a nation. There are numerous models throughout the developed world, basically all of which provide better health care for less money. At this point, I think believing the fear mongering with health care is akin to believing in ghost stories.

Education is trickier. I think struggling schools need to be helped, but I don't really know how we can force people to stay in school. Also, our higher education system is great, but it's extremely expensive. Yes, we would see increased taxes, but we would have to look into reigning in costs.

What other programs are you referring to?

I thought the democratic socialist candidates were campaigning for more than just health cost reduction and education?

 

[37L1]

Sorry, not sorry.

 

[tvolsfan]

I thought the democratic socialist candidates were campaigning for more than just health cost reduction and education?

I’m not supporting nearly everything they support lol.

 

[tvolsfan]

Sorry, not sorry.

Don’t be dense. Nobody says the USA provides low quality care. We just think it should be for everybody.

 

[McDad]

I’m not supporting nearly everything they support lol.

Are those two things your most important issues? If so, will you vote for someone who wants to expand and create new programs even if those aren't important to you as long as they work on your two issues?

 

[tvolsfan]

Are those two things your most important issues? If so, will you vote for someone who wants to expand and create new programs even if those aren't important to you as long as they work on your two issues?

No. The most important issue is removing Donald Trump and from our democracy.

 

[McDad]

No. The most important issue is removing Donald Trump and from our democracy.

Well, It's a Republic but whatever.

If your wish list is funded fully with reductions in spending in other areas of the budget, would you still want to see overall tax revenue increase?

 

[tvolsfan]

Well, It's a Republic but whatever.

If your wish list is funded fully with reductions in spending in other areas of the budget, would you still want to see overall tax revenue increase?

1. The United Stares is definitely a representative democracy. Not sure why you think the terms are exclusive.
2. Possibly to pay down the debt.

 

[McDad]

1. The United Stares is definitely a representative democracy. Not sure why you think the terms are exclusive.
2. Possibly to pay down the debt.

Would you believe that raising taxes doesn't increase revenue to the Federal coffers?

The US is a federal republic with a rep democracy form of governance, to be precise.

 

[37L1]

Don’t be dense. Nobody says the USA provides low quality care. We just think it should be for everybody.

Like that's going to happen with socialized medicine?

Figures including British pop star Adele to Canadian politician Danny Williams have opted to have medical treatment in the U.S. after recommendations from doctors in their home countries. Adele traveled for vocal cord microsurgery and Williams sought heart surgery.
Bob Moffit, health care senior fellow at the Heritage Foundation, discussed the areas in which the U.S. surpasses other developed countries in health care in a phone interview with TheDCNF.
“In the case of Mick Jagger’s situation, dealing with a heart problem, we basically lead other high-end countries … People say we spend too much on health care. Yes, we spend a lot, but we also have better outcomes in areas where high spending does have a high return on investment,” Moffit said.

“The fact is that in every health care system, people are looking for a unicorn out there. There’s no such thing as a health care system that provides health care to everybody. Every system rations care in some way, including ours. We ration care by price,” Tanner said.
Mick Jagger Is Getting Heart Surgery In The US. Experts Break Down What That Could Mean For The Medicare For All Debate


Also, those with fame and fortune can "jump the line" here in the U.S.

 

[tvolsfan]

Like that's going to happen with socialized medicine?

Figures including British pop star Adele to Canadian politician Danny Williams have opted to have medical treatment in the U.S. after recommendations from doctors in their home countries. Adele traveled for vocal cord microsurgery and Williams sought heart surgery.
Bob Moffit, health care senior fellow at the Heritage Foundation, discussed the areas in which the U.S. surpasses other developed countries in health care in a phone interview with TheDCNF.
“In the case of Mick Jagger’s situation, dealing with a heart problem, we basically lead other high-end countries … People say we spend too much on health care. Yes, we spend a lot, but we also have better outcomes in areas where high spending does have a high return on investment,” Moffit said.

“The fact is that in every health care system, people are looking for a unicorn out there. There’s no such thing as a health care system that provides health care to everybody. Every system rations care in some way, including ours. We ration care by price,” Tanner said.
Mick Jagger Is Getting Heart Surgery In The US. Experts Break Down What That Could Mean For The Medicare For All Debate


Also, those with fame and fortune can "jump the line" here in the U.S.

Right. Let me know when one if the countries with universal healthcare switches to our system.

 

[tvolsfan]

Would you believe that raising taxes doesn't increase revenue to the Federal coffers?

There’s definitely going to be a tradeoff. There’s no magic tax rate that solves all. Sometimes taxes will need to be raised and sometimes they will need to be lowered.

 

[McDad]

There’s definitely going to be a tradeoff. There’s no magic tax rate that solves all. Sometimes taxes will need to be raised and sometimes they will need to be lowered.

But you stated you want taxes raised. My assumption was you wanted to raise federal revenue by raising taxes.

 

[37L1]

Right. Let me know when one if the countries with universal healthcare switches to our system.

They can't now because it's an "entitlement."

Let me know when they provide sufficient funds for their own defense without "Daddy Warbucks" doing it for them. Then we'll see if they can afford both.

 

[BigOrangeD]

There’s definitely going to be a tradeoff. There’s no magic tax rate that solves all. Sometimes taxes will need to be raised and sometimes they will need to be lowered.

The Laffer Curve is a theory developed by supply-side economist Arthur Laffer to show the relationship between tax rates and the amount of tax revenue collected by governments. The curve is used to illustrate Laffer's argument that sometimes cutting tax rates can increase total tax revenue.

 

[37L1]

There’s definitely going to be a tradeoff. There’s no magic tax rate that solves all. Sometimes taxes will need to be raised and sometimes they will need to be lowered.

When has a Democrat Administration ever lowered taxes without someone making them do it?

 

[tvolsfan]

But you stated you want taxes raised. My assumption was you wanted to raise federal revenue by raising taxes.

I certainly don’t want to pay more taxes. However, I’m willing to pay additional taxes if it could lead to improvements in certain areas (education, health care, infrastructure). Obviously it would be better to cut unnecessary waste from the budget.

 

[tvolsfan]

When has a Democrat Administration ever lowered taxes without someone making them do it?

When has a Republican administration cut down the debt?

 

[tvolsfan]

The Laffer Curve is a theory developed by supply-side economist Arthur Laffer to show the relationship between tax rates and the amount of tax revenue collected by governments. The curve is used to illustrate Laffer's argument that sometimes cutting tax rates can increase total tax revenue.

I don’t disagree. Cutting corporate taxes worked pretty well in Ireland fairly recently, IIRC.

 

[37L1]

When has a Republican administration cut down the debt?

Answer my question, I'll answer yours.

 

[McDad]

When has a Republican administration cut down the debt?

Recently? Never. Closest we ever got was Clinton president and Gingrich SoH. Even that was brief...only 2 years.