Recruiting Forum Football Talk LX

Status
Not open for further replies.
#176
#176
Chief Vol 13 said:
Don't mention the fact that he was at Mississippi State, in arguably the toughest division in college football over the last ten years.
Click to expand...

"We are who our record says we are"
Bill Parcells

Sure, he was in a tough division. But that's still about a 17% win rate. That's not good no matter how you try to take up for it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#177
#177
OTR_Vol said:
"We are who our record says we are"
Bill Parcells

Sure, he was in a tough division. But that's still about a 17% win rate. That's not good no matter how you try to take up for it.
Click to expand...

He's a good coach and I don't see how anyone can deny that.

That doesn't mean he's invincible. He isn't.
 
#178
#178
BoseefusTheVol said:
Dools is a way better football coach than Butch. Don't get me wrong, Dooley was an awful coach, but Butch Jones was a con artist.
Click to expand...

Yea, whatever you want to believe. Not saying Butch is a great coach, but he at least won 9 games twice after taking over a Dooley team. Con artist or not, he recruited good players, and that led to better teams. Dooley got worse.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 people
#180
#180
OTR_Vol said:
"We are who our record says we are"
Bill Parcells

Sure, he was in a tough division. But that's still about a 17% win rate. That's not good no matter how you try to take up for it.
Click to expand...

It's a little different in college. When you're at a cellar dweller like Mississippi State, you're just not on a level playing field with Bama, LSU, Auburn, and A&M. I don't think Mullen is some dyamite coach, but he is very good. They'll win 9 and 10 on the regular down there, which might not be acceptable for them.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#181
#181
OTR_Vol said:
Hey, he's beaten ranked opponents 7 times. 7. That's really impressive.

Don't worry about what that 34 next to the 7 means.
Click to expand...

Chief Vol 13 said:
Don't mention the fact that he was at Mississippi State, in arguably the toughest division in college football over the last ten years.
Click to expand...

OTR_Vol said:
"We are who our record says we are"
Bill Parcells

Sure, he was in a tough division. But that's still about a 17% win rate. That's not good no matter how you try to take up for it.
Click to expand...

I just waded through his time at State via Wikipedia, taking notes on his ranked wins. Please note that these are the rankings of their opponents at the time of the game, NOT end-of-year rankings.

2009: They beat 25th ranked Ole Miss, who finished with a 9-4 record. (They lost to the 7th, 25th, 1st, and 2nd ranked teams in other match-ups that year)

2010: 22nd Florida (finished 8-5); Lost to 21st, 15th, 11th, and 13th ranked teams in other match-ups that year.

2011: No ranked wins; Lost to 3rd, 15th, 4th, and 6th ranked teams in other match-ups that year.

2012: No ranked wins; Lost to 1st, 16th, and 5th ranked teams in other match-ups that year.

2013: No ranked wins; Lost to 13th, 10th, 14th, 11th and 1st ranked teams in other match-ups that year.

2014: They beat 8th LSU, 6th A&M, and 2nd Auburn, all of whom finished with an 8-5 overall record. This was their ascent to #1 for a few weeks... until they lost to the 5th, 18th, and 10th ranked teams as part of their downfall.

2015: No ranked wins; Lost to 14th, 14th, 3rd and 19th ranked teams in other match-ups that year.

2016: Beat 7th ranked Texas A&M, who finished with an 8-5 record. Lost to 20th and 1st ranked teams in other match-ups.

2017: Beat 12th ranked LSU (who finished 9-4) and lost to 12th, 13th, and 1st ranked other teams.

Doing the math, the average end-of-year record of the ranked teams they beat: 8.29 - 4.71

Record against gametime rankings 21-25th: 2-2
Record against gametime rankings 16-20th: 0-3
Record against gametime rankings 11-15th: 1-11
Record against gametime rankings 6-10th: 3-4
Record against gametime rankings 1-5th: 1-11

Bless, that 2014 year was some fools gold if I've ever seen it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 5 people
#183
#183
BoseefusTheVol said:
Dools is a way better football coach than Butch. Don't get me wrong, Dooley was an awful coach, but Butch Jones was a con artist.
Click to expand...

Wins: butch
Nfl drafted players: butch
Revenue: butch
Graduation rate: butch
Bowl wins: butch
Weeks in top 25: butch
Recruiting: butch

Now how was dooley better? I will wait
 
  • Like
Reactions: 7 people
#186
#186
ChismsHeadband said:
I just waded through his time at State via Wikipedia, taking notes on his ranked wins. Please note that these are the rankings of their opponents at the time of the game, NOT end-of-year rankings.

2009: They beat 25th ranked Ole Miss, who finished with a 9-4 record. (They lost to the 7th, 25th, 1st, and 2nd ranked teams in other match-ups that year)

2010: 22nd Florida (finished 8-5); Lost to 21st, 15th, 11th, and 13th ranked teams in other match-ups that year.

2011: No ranked wins; Lost to 3rd, 15th, 4th, and 6th ranked teams in other match-ups that year.

2012: No ranked wins; Lost to 1st, 16th, and 5th ranked teams in other match-ups that year.

2013: No ranked wins; Lost to 13th, 10th, 14th, 11th and 1st ranked teams in other match-ups that year.

2014: They beat 8th LSU, 6th A&M, and 2nd Auburn, all of whom finished with an 8-5 overall record. This was their ascent to #1 for a few weeks... until they lost to the 5th, 18th, and 10th ranked teams as part of their downfall.

2015: No ranked wins; Lost to 14th, 14th, 3rd and 19th ranked teams in other match-ups that year.

2016: Beat 7th ranked Texas A&M, who finished with an 8-5 record. Lost to 20th and 1st ranked teams in other match-ups.

2017: Beat 12th ranked LSU (who finished 9-4) and lost to 12th, 13th, and 1st ranked other teams.

Doing the math, the average end-of-year record of the ranked teams they beat: 8.29 - 4.71

Record against gametime rankings 21-25th: 2-2
Record against gametime rankings 16-20th: 0-3
Record against gametime rankings 11-15th: 1-11
Record against gametime rankings 6-10th: 3-4
Record against gametime rankings 1-5th: 1-11

Bless, that 2014 year was some fools gold if I've ever seen it.
Click to expand...

I've taken part in the Dan Mullen argument several times now. The bottom line is, the guy is a really good football coach. There's absolutely no disputing that. You don't do the things at Mississippi State that he did and not be really good.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 people
#187
#187
#Vol4Life1991 said:
Wins: butch
Nfl drafted players: butch
Revenue: butch
Graduation rate: butch
Bowl wins: butch
Weeks in top 25: butch
Recruiting: butch

Now how was dooley better? I will wait
Click to expand...

Butch Jones sucks. He was a far better recruiter, was not a better football coach IMO.
 
#189
#189
Chief Vol 13 said:
I've taken part in the Dan Mullen argument several times now. The bottom line is, the guy is a really good football coach. There's absolutely no disputing that. You don't do the things at Mississippi State that he did and not be really good.
Click to expand...

.
 
#192
#192
Butch was a better coach than Dooley.

Just because Dooley was a competent DC away from holding the job for another year or two, doesn't change the fact that he was statistically the worst HC in UT Football history.

Butch was a con-man because he tricked many of us into thinking he was a better coach than he was capable of being. Coming in after Dooley (and subsequently being compared favorably to Dooley) made him look like the coach we needed in 2013, 2014, and into 2015.

Butch's main problem is that he coached with a small-school mentality. At Cincinnati, you can make promises to all of your star recruits because there's no way you land them all. Here, he landed a lot of them, and that's where we had roster management issues. At Cincinnati and CMU, you can have a down year as you reload, because the fanbase is generally happy with more W's than L's (especially at a 9-4 clip). Here at Tennessee, with a roster like what we had in 2016, there were no excuses. But his excuses revealed that Butch is only G5 good, nowhere close to P5 and even further from SEC good.

Bringing it back around, Dooley wasn't even C-USA good, save for that one 8-5 year at LaTech. Sure, throwing out of a quasi-pro-style rather than dual threating it out of the spread makes it look like you know more about football, but if Dooley had more football IQ, he would've made a better hire than Sal freakin' Sunseri at such a crucial juncture.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 7 people
#193
#193
Chief Vol 13 said:
I've taken part in the Dan Mullen argument several times now. The bottom line is, the guy is a really good football coach. There's absolutely no disputing that. You don't do the things at Mississippi State that he did and not be really good.
Click to expand...

Take the "really" off of that, and I'll agree with you. State is a difficult place to win at.

A "really good" football coach would scare me at Florida. Right now, especially based off their recruiting, Mullen looks like a decent threat, but nothing more.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#195
#195
volfanngatorland said:
dCAvsZ8.gif
Click to expand...

one more flip of the car and he was a goner! I love how he just got up, dusted himself off, and acted like nothing happened. LOL
 
#196
#196
I’ve found it best to refrain from coaching predictions until they’ve actually coached a game. JMO
 
#198
#198
ChismsHeadband said:
Butch was a better coach than Dooley.

Just because Dooley was a competent DC away from holding the job for another year or two, doesn't change the fact that he was statistically the worst HC in UT Football history.

Butch was a con-man because he tricked many of us into thinking he was a better coach than he was capable of being. Coming in after Dooley (and subsequently being compared favorably to Dooley) made him look like the coach we needed in 2013, 2014, and into 2015.

Butch's main problem is that he coached with a small-school mentality. At Cincinnati, you can make promises to all of your star recruits because there's no way you land them all. Here, he landed a lot of them, and that's where we had roster management issues. At Cincinnati and CMU, you can have a down year as you reload, because the fanbase is generally happy with more W's than L's (especially at a 9-4 clip). Here at Tennessee, with a roster like what we had in 2016, there were no excuses. But his excuses revealed that Butch is only G5 good, nowhere close to P5 and even further from SEC good.

Bringing it back around, Dooley wasn't even C-USA good, save for that one 8-5 year at LaTech. Sure, throwing out of a quasi-pro-style rather than dual threating it out of the spread makes it look like you know more about football, but if Dooley had more football IQ, he would've made a better hire than Sal freakin' Sunseri at such a crucial juncture.
Click to expand...

Butch Jones hired Larry Scott, Walt Wells, Mike Canales and Kevin Beard lol. All four ended up being terrible hires. Neither one were good football coaches, but I think on the field, Dooley was better at X's and O's/football IQ. To say Jones was bad at this level in those two areas would be an understatement. Saban hired him two different times, and tried to a third time. Best Jones could do was get on as an intern.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#200
#200
ChismsHeadband said:
Take the "really" off of that, and I'll agree with you. State is a difficult place to win at.

A "really good" football coach would scare me at Florida. Right now, especially based off their recruiting, Mullen looks like a decent threat, but nothing more.
Click to expand...

Mississippi State is the Kentucky of the west, and he got them to number one in the country. Idc what anyone says, especially when it's never been done before in 100+ years of football, that's a heck of an accomplishment. Sherril won that division when it was complete horse crap. Mississippi State is by far the worst school to coach football at in the west.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
New Posts

Status
Not open for further replies.
Advertisement



Back
Top