Where did life begin? (Merged)

[The Ron Mexico]

Factual fact of truth: For most people, determining what is an allegory or metaphor the Bible is based on what they want to believe. There is no master decoder ring to determine those things. If it fits my agenda, it’s literal. If it doesn’t, it’s an allegory and you should know that.

 

[BigO95]

You’re interpreting the Bible the way that suits you best. You’re clearly not any sort of at expert. Yet you spew your interpretation and everyone else is wrong or a lier. I have looked into this for a long time. And torn it apart in the original language with the lifestyle of the time in mind. If you disagree with my interpretation that’s ok because I’m certainly not the ultimate authority either. But my interpretation is clearly just as valid as yours

That is a fair point but at the same time both of us cannot be right one of us must be wrong. Would you not agree with that?
Wether intensionally or not, one of us is telling a falsehood. I do believe you to be as sincere as I by the way.

 

[superdave1984]

When the donkey saw the angel of the Lord, it lay down under Balaam, and he was angry and beat it with his staff. 28 Then the Lord opened the donkey’s mouth, and it said to Balaam, “What have I done to you to make you beat me these three times?”

29 Balaam answered the donkey, “You have made a fool of me! If only I had a sword in my hand, I would kill you right now.”

30 The donkey said to Balaam, “Am I not your own donkey, which you have always ridden, to this day? Have I been in the habit of doing this to you?”

“No,” he said.

31 Then the Lord opened Balaam’s eyes, and he saw the angel of the Lord standing in the road with his sword drawn. So he bowed low and fell facedown.



Hey look
A talking donkey
Allegory or historical fact.

Can you guess which I was taught as a child?

Very good commentary on this passage: That Balaam should answer the ass without expressing any astonishment is certainly more marvelous than that the ass should speak to him. It must, however, in fairness be considered -

1. That Balaam was a prophet. He was accustomed to hear Divine voices speaking to him when no man was near. He had a large and unquestioning faith, and a peculiar familiarity with the unseen.

2. Balaam was a sorcerer. It was part of his profession to show signs and wonders such as even now in those countries confound the most experienced and skeptical beholders. It is likely that he had often made dumb animals speak in order to bewilder others. He must indeed have been conscious to some extent of imposture, but he would not draw any sharp line in his own mind between the marvels which really happened to him and the marvels he displayed to others. Both as prophet and as sorcerer, he must have lived, more than any other even of that age, in an atmosphere of the supernatural. If, therefore, this portent was really given, it was certainly given to the very man of all that ever lived to whom it was most suitable. Just as one cannot imagine the miracle of the stater (Matthew 17:27) happening to any one of less simple and childlike faith than St. Peter, so one could not think of the ass as speaking to any one in the Bible but the wizard prophet, for whom - both on his good and on his bad side - the boundary lines between the natural and supernatural were almost obliterated.

3. Balaam was at this moment intensely angry., and nothing blunts the edge of natural surprise so much as rage. Things which afterwards, when calmly recollected, cause the utmost astonishment, notoriously produce no effect at the moment upon a mind which is thoroughly exasperated.

 

[BigO95]

Family.

Where did they learn about Jesus?

 

[BigO95]

When the donkey saw the angel of the Lord, it lay down under Balaam, and he was angry and beat it with his staff. 28 Then the Lord opened the donkey’s mouth, and it said to Balaam, “What have I done to you to make you beat me these three times?”

29 Balaam answered the donkey, “You have made a fool of me! If only I had a sword in my hand, I would kill you right now.”

30 The donkey said to Balaam, “Am I not your own donkey, which you have always ridden, to this day? Have I been in the habit of doing this to you?”

“No,” he said.

31 Then the Lord opened Balaam’s eyes, and he saw the angel of the Lord standing in the road with his sword drawn. So he bowed low and fell facedown.



Hey look
A talking donkey
Allegory or historical fact.

Can you guess which I was taught as a child?

Do you believe balaam's ass spoke?

 

[BigO95]

When should the Bible be taken literal?

 

[BigO95]

Very good commentary on this passage: That Balaam should answer the ass without expressing any astonishment is certainly more marvelous than that the ass should speak to him. It must, however, in fairness be considered -

1. That Balaam was a prophet. He was accustomed to hear Divine voices speaking to him when no man was near. He had a large and unquestioning faith, and a peculiar familiarity with the unseen.

2. Balaam was a sorcerer. It was part of his profession to show signs and wonders such as even now in those countries confound the most experienced and skeptical beholders. It is likely that he had often made dumb animals speak in order to bewilder others. He must indeed have been conscious to some extent of imposture, but he would not draw any sharp line in his own mind between the marvels which really happened to him and the marvels he displayed to others. Both as prophet and as sorcerer, he must have lived, more than any other even of that age, in an atmosphere of the supernatural. If, therefore, this portent was really given, it was certainly given to the very man of all that ever lived to whom it was most suitable. Just as one cannot imagine the miracle of the stater (Matthew 17:27) happening to any one of less simple and childlike faith than St. Peter, so one could not think of the ass as speaking to any one in the Bible but the wizard prophet, for whom - both on his good and on his bad side - the boundary lines between the natural and supernatural were almost obliterated.

3. Balaam was at this moment intensely angry., and nothing blunts the edge of natural surprise so much as rage. Things which afterwards, when calmly recollected, cause the utmost astonishment, notoriously produce no effect at the moment upon a mind which is thoroughly exasperated.

Another interesting fact of scripture is in the garden of Eden the serpent spoke to Eve. She wasn't surprised either.

 

[BigO95]

You { editr me } misunderstanding in earnest doesn’t make it a lie.

Slice, I believe you to believe the Doctrine that you teach, however I think that you are in error. You can not believe my doctrine and your doctrine both to be correct, so surely you think that I am wrong. That's ok, you should believe it if you are going to teach it. So should I or we would be out right dishonest.
Wether intentionally or not, one of us is telling a big windy!

 

[BigO95]

Slice, if it's any consolation to you, I personally think that most on here would come closer to believing you than me.
That's okay too, I still believe the Bible no matter what anyone else thinks.

 

[hog88]

Where did they learn about Jesus?

I assume from other family.

 

[BigO95]

I assume from other family.

Somebody must've read the Bible some time or another.

 

[hog88]

Somebody must've read the Bible some time or another.

Yeah, including me.

 

[BigO95]

Yeah, including me.

Great! I highly recommend reading the Bible. That book has brought me much joy! I believe it can do the same for you and probably has.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Slice, I believe you to believe the Doctrine that you teach, however I think that you are in error. You can not believe my doctrine and your doctrine both to be correct, so surely you think that I am wrong. That's ok, you should believe it if you are going to teach it. So should I or we would be out right dishonest.
Wether intentionally or not, one of us is telling a big windy!

That’s just it. I don’t teach. The pearls are not mine. I only discuss to establish in my mind what I believe to be the truth. I’m still willing to be convinced I’m wrong. It doesn’t happen much anymore as if been doing this a long time.
I don’t harbor any ill will towards those who disagree with me as my opinion won’t mean **** to them on the day they’re judged.

It’s important to study and know what you believe because you’re going to answer for it alone.

 

[BigO95]

That’s just it. I don’t teach. The pearls are not mine. I only discuss to establish in my mind what I believe to be the truth. I’m still willing to be convinced I’m wrong. It doesn’t happen much anymore as if been doing this a long time.
I don’t harbor any ill will towards those who disagree with me as my opinion won’t mean **** to them on the day they’re judged.

It’s important to study and know what you believe because you’re going to answer for it alone.

You are exactly right about that judgement. Slice, you do quite a bit of teaching on here wether you realize it or not. So do I and OC and whoever else established their doctrinal beliefs on here. You can teach a lot in an open discussion.

 

[LouderVol]

Is G-d the same yesterday today and forever ?
Is G-d a man that he should lie?
Is G-d a man that he should change?

How would any of us know? To answer your question I don't think God changes, we change.

You see a mile tall die (single dice) that actually has 100 sides and 100 corresponding numbers.

today you see 1-50, tomorrow you see 25-75, the next 50-100. Did the die change?

 

[Orangeslice13]

How would any of us know? To answer your question I don't think God changes, we change.

You see a mile tall die (single dice) that actually has 100 sides and 100 corresponding numbers.

today you see 1-50, tomorrow you see 25-75, the next 50-100. Did the die change?

Also known as beachball theory. It depends on which side you stand as to how you see it.

My question was a foundation as to how people view G-d. Those are all questions that are claims made about G-d in Torah.

If you believe that G-d is the same/doesn’t change/doesn’t lie then it has some real implications as to how you view the law/Torah. How you view salvation. And how you view yeshua/Jesus fulfillment of G-ds plan. My childhood friend Frito said he believes something new was being introduced. I feel that a long standing error was being corrected.

Either way it’s an interesting conversation nobody felt like having.

 

[LouderVol]

If evolution is true, does that make the detailed account of Adam and Eve in the garden fiction?
If Genesis chapter 1 through 3 can't be trusted, what portion of the Bible can be trusted?
If only certain portions of the Bible can be trusted, how do you determine what portions can be trusted?
Who gets to decide what can be trusted?
Do you not think that that is a dangerous road to go down?

1. Complete fiction? No.
2. Can't be trusted is a bit much. You are too much black and white. Jesus used parables, why couldn't God?
3. I would suggest prayer, and talking with others. and not just the echo chambers.
4. thats up for each individual. Might as well ask why you trust the KJV vs any of the others? I know you have reasons but there are similar reasons for many of the other types.
5. God gave us free will, fully knowing what we would face. Just because something is dangerous or challenging doesn't make it "wrong" or that it should be avoided.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Factual fact of truth: For most people, determining what is an allegory or metaphor the Bible is based on what they want to believe. There is no master decoder ring to determine those things. If it fits my agenda, it’s literal. If it doesn’t, it’s an allegory and you should know that.

When commen sense makes since seek no other cents.

 

[LouderVol]

That is a fair point but at the same time both of us cannot be right one of us must be wrong. Would you not agree with that?
Wether intensionally or not, one of us is telling a falsehood. I do believe you to be as sincere as I by the way.

no. stop with the extremes. you can easily both be correct, and most likely there is another option in between the two of you that is THE truth. (I probably don't have it either)

Louder: 1+1+1+1=4
BigO95: 2+2=4
Slice: 3+1=4
God: 5-1=4

who is wrong? as you stated we can't all be right.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Louder is on his 15 min break

 

[LouderVol]

Also known as beachball theory. It depends on which side you stand as to how you see it.

My question was a foundation as to how people view G-d. Those are all questions that are claims made about G-d in Torah.

If you believe that G-d is the same/doesn’t change/doesn’t lie then it has some real implications as to how you view the law/Torah. How you view salvation. And how you view yeshua/Jesus fulfillment of G-ds plan. My childhood friend Frito said he believes something new was being introduced. I feel that a long standing error was being corrected.

Either way it’s an interesting conversation nobody felt like having.

I agree, you Jews got it wrong. been saying that for a while

I think Jesus saw the Torah differently than other Jews did.

 

[Orangeslice13]

I think Jesus saw the Torah differently than other Jews did.

Bingo.
Yeshua/Jesus wasn’t opposed to the law. As a matter of fact he said that it wasn’t going away till the end of all things and he didn’t come to destroy it put to fulfill/fully preach it.
Yeshua was against all the man made traditions added to the law that were not from God.
Yeshua was a psalms 119 teaching Rabbi.

 

[BigO95]

no. stop with the extremes. you can easily both be correct, and most likely there is another option in between the two of you that is THE truth. (I probably don't have it either)

Louder: 1+1+1+1=4
BigO95: 2+2=4
Slice: 3+1=4
God: 5-1=4

who is wrong? as you stated we can't all be right.

I'm not talking about a math problem either. I am talking about the Bible.

 

[BigO95]

When commen sense makes since seek no other cents.

Lest you come up with nonsense.(evolution)😀