Beals
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Neyland I (Formerly known as Gruden Thread)
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Orangeredblooded
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TenUhSee
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Keaton's bullying made Yahoo's main page:
Ricky Martin, Millie Bobby Brown and More Stars Rally Around Bullied Tennessee Student
Ricky Martin, Millie Bobby Brown and More Stars Rally Around Bullied Tennessee Student
G8rh8r
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I cant imagine. I have two girls and I cant imagine sending my child to a school every day where I knew he was going to be treated like that and have an administration that did nothing. Id be furious.
As parents, we have to stop this by teaching our kids not only acceptance and tolerance, but also how to stand up for those who are being bullied.
Leximax
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Leximax
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From the RF:
DG's TL;DR Take on Pruitt, Coaching Search, Etc
The craziest coaching search in college football history is over. Here are my thoughts on it all.
The search
The fan revolt was a success. We wont know if the Pruitt hire will be a success till several years down the road, but one thing is clear: this was a better hire than Greg Schiano. I firmly believe that Schiano wouldve set the program back decades; as in, we couldve seen 30,000 empty seats in Neyland in Year 1 for a new coach. We wouldve been the laughing stock of college football for years. Id rather take one week of negative publicity than 3+ years of a trainwreck hire. Schiano was a disaster at Tampa; an abusive autocrat who alienated anyone and everyone around him. He couldnt land a single college or NFL job for two years because he was so toxic. While he improved Rutgers, the media often overstates this; Schiano improved recruiting, but never made Rutgers elite; he took them from a cellar-dwellar to middle-of-the-road program. While many fans latched onto the Sandusky scandal, that was far from the only reason to question his integrity, and its his time in Tampa that makes people less likely to believe him on Sandusky. The media may have demonized us, but we were 100% in the right; Schiano wouldve been one of the worst hires in college football history.
The decline of Haslam. Even more importantly, the revolt pushed the man who has doomed our program for the past decade out of power: Jimmy Haslam. His imprint has been all over every failure. He is now denying involvement with the search but I dont buy it. Haslam wanted to hire Schiano at Cleveland, a few years earlier when no one else wanted to touch him. Which makes it quite a spectacular coincidence that his name would just randomly pop up as the #1 candidate at UT (and the only candidate seriously considered). I dont know how Fulmer will fare, but without a doubt, the future is brighter without Haslam calling the shots.
Dont blame Fulmer. Whether or not Pruitt is a success, Fulmer took over the AD role in less than ideal circumstances. Most of the best coaches had already made their moves by the time Currie was fired. Fulmer has some weaknesses, but I do think he'll get the Athletic Department back in order as it's been one of the biggest things hampering us over the past decade.
Dont Eeyore UT. I get sick of the no one great wants to coach at Tennessee narrative. Its simply not true. We have the best facilities in the nation. We have more resources than any other program. We have a strong tradition. Our recruiting base has improved significantly over the past decade and were a top 10 program on recruiting advantages. The idea that no great coaches want to come here is absurdly false. Its not that great coaches dont want to be here. Gary Patterson wanted the job in 08. Kirby Smart wanted it in 12. Mike Leach wanted it this year. You wouldnt believe the names weve passed up on over the past decade. The problem is that we have had several ADs (under the influence of Haslam) who didnt want to sell and hire top candidates; Haslam wanted the candidate willing to grovel and beg for the job, rather than the great candidate who we mightve had to sell. Its not like Nick Saban was knocking down Alabamas doors in 2006; Bama sold him.
Mike Leach. Im not down on the Pruitt hire, but I do feel like we missed a golden opportunity to hire Leach. Leach has succeeded with less talent consistently. Hes 9-3 this season at Washington State. Wash State is arguably the toughest (or 2nd toughest behind Oregon State) program to win at in the Pac-12. Remember, the only season where Mike Leach arguably had top 30 talent, he went 11-2 at Texas Tech with Jeremy Crabtree. With the resources of a place like Tennessee, I think Leach couldve competed for a national title within 3-8 years. We made a reasonable hire in Pruitt, but we also missed a golden opportunity. Lets hope we dont regret it.
The Pruitt hire.
Jeremy Pruitt. Pruitt knows defense well. I had many reservations about him due to his time in Georgia (where he was seen as causing locker room chaos), but the more Ive read, the more I like him. That said, this is not a home run hire by any stretch. This is a High Risk, High Reward type hire. Pruitt is a great DC who could turn out to be a great HC. We know the defense will be good. We dont know if he can fix the offense. Well have to wait and see.
Dont judge the hire based on the list. Pete Carroll was USCs 4th or 5th choice and was considered a poor hire. The Clemson search that resulted in Dabo Swinney getting hired was considered a complete failure. Bama had RichRod at the altar in 06, before he backed out at the last minute, and they had to settle for Nick Saban. Meanwhile, Jim Mora at UCLA and Kevin Sumlin at A&M were considered 1st choice home run hires. The success of our coach is not dependent upon how many people rejected us first. Some of the sports websites are giving our hire an F because the process, but its not exactly like were the first school to have a disastrous coaching search before and some of those disastrous searches yielded people like Dabo Swinney, Pete Carroll, and Nick Saban. In fact, it almost seems like the trainwreck searches have resulted in better candidates --- this may be because the smooth searches can yield guys like Greg Schiano. Or Herm Edwards out in Arizona State (good guy, but that was a terrible hire.)
Offensive staff hires will be crucial. The good news is that we have a ton of talent on offense. The bad news is that its not been developed properly for years. You can make a legitimate case that on a talent-adjusted basis, we had the worst offense in the NCAA this season. You dont recover from that instantly. Can Pruitt bring in the right guys to get the offense moving again? The answer to that question will tell you a lot about how Pruitt fares in Rocky Top.
Worst case scenario: Will Muschamp. This is my nightmare scenario for Pruitt. Muschamp turned Floridas defense into an elite unit, but the offense was pretty awful for most of his time in Gainesville. During Year #2, it looked like Muschamp had turned the corner with an 11-2 Season and a trip to the Sugar Bowl. Muschamp went 10-13 the next two seasons after that. Just because Pruitt has been good on D doesnt mean he can magically fix the offense.
Best case scenario: Dabo Swinney. The assistant that takes over a major program, struggles for a few seasons, before turning it into a superpower. Unfortunately, there have been very few Dabo Swinneys in college football history. There are some very promising things about Pruitt, though, so this isnt far-fetched either. I do think Pruitt will be smarter than Muschamp and that Pruitts track record suggests he might be a better guy to run an organization.
Staff hires. One of my concerns on Pruitt is that virtually every person on this staff is getting a promotion from a previous position. Tyson Helton is a QB coach at USC, who will likely be our OC. Kevin Sherrer is an LB coach at Georgia who will be our DC. These promotion type hires are the least likely to work out; which isnt to say they couldnt work. But you can see our recent history is littered with failures of this type: Sal Sunseri and Larry Scott both fit into this bucket. Whereas, our more successful coordinators have had experience at their position before (Chaney, Wilcox).
Reasons for optimism on staff. While I would rather get a proven OC like Tee Martin, I like that were getting a guy familiar with the USC offense in Tyson Helton. I think the USC style offense (also similar to Kiffins offense) is a good fit for the University of Tennessee. While I can complain that Pruitt is mostly promoting rather than getting proven guys, I will say that the guys hes getting are generally regarded very highly. Helton is a great QB coach and will be a major upgrade over Butch Jones era QB coaches. Will Friend looks like a good hire for O-line. Id be happy to see Chris Weinke on staff. Tracy Rocker was highly regarded at Georgia. Kevin Sherrer is also highly regarded at Georgia. So I at least view these promotion type hires to be more likely to succeed than Butch Jones promotion hires last season which had huge question marks. Still, its a wait and see thing for me.
Pruitt is a better hire than Kiffin 08, Dooley, or Butch. I was not a fan of our last three hires; and I dont simply mean in hindsight. I thought Kiffin and Dooley were both poor hires when they happened. I thought Butch was an OK, but not great hire. Pruitt is the best of the bunch, but still far from 1st tier. Lets hope he fares better than the last three.
Pruitt understands the Saban-system. I do think Pruitt understands the Saban system better than almost anyone else outside of Kirby Smart and thats a plus. Hes making some interesting moves that seem to mimic or expand upon things Saban has been doing to get an edge.
Great recruiters. Pruitt is bringing in some great recruiters. Thats good, but I guess you can say Im less impressed by this than I might have been a few seasons ago. Butch brought in great recruiters that couldnt coach. Im hoping Pruitt brings in great recruiters who can also coach well.
Aight! Pruitt wasnt my first choice, but Im behind him 100% right now.
Next season
The SEC just got tougher. Florida just got a major upgrade with Dan Mullen. Arkansas and Texas A&M also likely got upgrades with Chad Morris and Jimbo Fisher, respectively. This conference is a Murderers Row that can eat up even very good coaches. Kevin Sumlin was a very good coach that failed at A&M. Even if Pruitt is very good, to succeed in this league, you have to be great right now. Its a very difficult standard. Hopefully, he at least gets us beating Vandy, Kentucky, Mizzou, and SC again. If you cant do that consistently, you stand no shot at Bama, Florida, and Georgia.
Dont expect miracles. Our development on offense is so far behind the curve at this point, its unfair to expect it to suddenly turn elite in a single season. I think its Years 2 and 3 that will be critical for Pruitt. We have the talent, but its been undercoached for so long, that I dont think were going to see the offense magically click simply because we have a new coach. No one wants to hear it, but if Pruitt makes it to 6-6 and gets us to a bowl game in 18, be happy. Save your great expectations for 19 and 20.
The good news. When Butch was hired, I said don't expect to see great results until at least Year 3 or Year 4. Butch inherited a trainwreck. Pruitt is inheriting a much better situation talent and depth-wise. If Pruitt is good, I think we can start seeing improved results in Year 2.
Hybrid defense. Pruitt ran the 3-4 defense at Bama and Georgia. He ran the 4-3 Multiple defense at Florida State. Pruitt has stated he wants to get the best players on the field and scheme around that, which probably means we have a look more similar to his time at Florida State next season. We probably don't have the personnel to run the 3-4 right now, but don't be surprised if we see a slow evolution towards it.
Refreshing ability to adapt. I will say it's refreshing to have a guy who is going to try to scheme around his own player's strengths and weaknesses, rather than have a guy who's going to constantly try to fit square pegs into round holes. Butch Jones was one of the least adaptive coaches I can ever recall being here and it was a major reason for his failure.
Recruiting class. Obviously, it would be nice to finish strong, but realistically, we know that any year with a coaching change is going to be a weaker class. If we can finish with a top 20 class, Id say be pretty happy. But its the 2019 class thats really going to show how this staff can recruit.
GBO!
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dduncan4163
Have at it Hoss
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DG's TL;DR Take on Pruitt, Coaching Search, Etc
The craziest coaching search in college football history is over. Here are my thoughts on it all.
The search
The fan revolt was a success. We wont know if the Pruitt hire will be a success till several years down the road, but one thing is clear: this was a better hire than Greg Schiano. I firmly believe that Schiano wouldve set the program back decades; as in, we couldve seen 30,000 empty seats in Neyland in Year 1 for a new coach. We wouldve been the laughing stock of college football for years. Id rather take one week of negative publicity than 3+ years of a trainwreck hire. Schiano was a disaster at Tampa; an abusive autocrat who alienated anyone and everyone around him. He couldnt land a single college or NFL job for two years because he was so toxic. While he improved Rutgers, the media often overstates this; Schiano improved recruiting, but never made Rutgers elite; he took them from a cellar-dwellar to middle-of-the-road program. While many fans latched onto the Sandusky scandal, that was far from the only reason to question his integrity, and its his time in Tampa that makes people less likely to believe him on Sandusky. The media may have demonized us, but we were 100% in the right; Schiano wouldve been one of the worst hires in college football history.
The decline of Haslam. Even more importantly, the revolt pushed the man who has doomed our program for the past decade out of power: Jimmy Haslam. His imprint has been all over every failure. He is now denying involvement with the search but I dont buy it. Haslam wanted to hire Schiano at Cleveland, a few years earlier when no one else wanted to touch him. Which makes it quite a spectacular coincidence that his name would just randomly pop up as the #1 candidate at UT (and the only candidate seriously considered). I dont know how Fulmer will fare, but without a doubt, the future is brighter without Haslam calling the shots.
Dont blame Fulmer. Whether or not Pruitt is a success, Fulmer took over the AD role in less than ideal circumstances. Most of the best coaches had already made their moves by the time Currie was fired. Fulmer has some weaknesses, but I do think he'll get the Athletic Department back in order as it's been one of the biggest things hampering us over the past decade.
Dont Eeyore UT. I get sick of the no one great wants to coach at Tennessee narrative. Its simply not true. We have the best facilities in the nation. We have more resources than any other program. We have a strong tradition. Our recruiting base has improved significantly over the past decade and were a top 10 program on recruiting advantages. The idea that no great coaches want to come here is absurdly false. Its not that great coaches dont want to be here. Gary Patterson wanted the job in 08. Kirby Smart wanted it in 12. Mike Leach wanted it this year. You wouldnt believe the names weve passed up on over the past decade. The problem is that we have had several ADs (under the influence of Haslam) who didnt want to sell and hire top candidates; Haslam wanted the candidate willing to grovel and beg for the job, rather than the great candidate who we mightve had to sell. Its not like Nick Saban was knocking down Alabamas doors in 2006; Bama sold him.
Mike Leach. Im not down on the Pruitt hire, but I do feel like we missed a golden opportunity to hire Leach. Leach has succeeded with less talent consistently. Hes 9-3 this season at Washington State. Wash State is arguably the toughest (or 2nd toughest behind Oregon State) program to win at in the Pac-12. Remember, the only season where Mike Leach arguably had top 30 talent, he went 11-2 at Texas Tech with Jeremy Crabtree. With the resources of a place like Tennessee, I think Leach couldve competed for a national title within 3-8 years. We made a reasonable hire in Pruitt, but we also missed a golden opportunity. Lets hope we dont regret it.
The Pruitt hire.
Jeremy Pruitt. Pruitt knows defense well. I had many reservations about him due to his time in Georgia (where he was seen as causing locker room chaos), but the more Ive read, the more I like him. That said, this is not a home run hire by any stretch. This is a High Risk, High Reward type hire. Pruitt is a great DC who could turn out to be a great HC. We know the defense will be good. We dont know if he can fix the offense. Well have to wait and see.
Dont judge the hire based on the list. Pete Carroll was USCs 4th or 5th choice and was considered a poor hire. The Clemson search that resulted in Dabo Swinney getting hired was considered a complete failure. Bama had RichRod at the altar in 06, before he backed out at the last minute, and they had to settle for Nick Saban. Meanwhile, Jim Mora at UCLA and Kevin Sumlin at A&M were considered 1st choice home run hires. The success of our coach is not dependent upon how many people rejected us first. Some of the sports websites are giving our hire an F because the process, but its not exactly like were the first school to have a disastrous coaching search before and some of those disastrous searches yielded people like Dabo Swinney, Pete Carroll, and Nick Saban. In fact, it almost seems like the trainwreck searches have resulted in better candidates --- this may be because the smooth searches can yield guys like Greg Schiano. Or Herm Edwards out in Arizona State (good guy, but that was a terrible hire.)
Offensive staff hires will be crucial. The good news is that we have a ton of talent on offense. The bad news is that its not been developed properly for years. You can make a legitimate case that on a talent-adjusted basis, we had the worst offense in the NCAA this season. You dont recover from that instantly. Can Pruitt bring in the right guys to get the offense moving again? The answer to that question will tell you a lot about how Pruitt fares in Rocky Top.
Worst case scenario: Will Muschamp. This is my nightmare scenario for Pruitt. Muschamp turned Floridas defense into an elite unit, but the offense was pretty awful for most of his time in Gainesville. During Year #2, it looked like Muschamp had turned the corner with an 11-2 Season and a trip to the Sugar Bowl. Muschamp went 10-13 the next two seasons after that. Just because Pruitt has been good on D doesnt mean he can magically fix the offense.
Best case scenario: Dabo Swinney. The assistant that takes over a major program, struggles for a few seasons, before turning it into a superpower. Unfortunately, there have been very few Dabo Swinneys in college football history. There are some very promising things about Pruitt, though, so this isnt far-fetched either. I do think Pruitt will be smarter than Muschamp and that Pruitts track record suggests he might be a better guy to run an organization.
Staff hires. One of my concerns on Pruitt is that virtually every person on this staff is getting a promotion from a previous position. Tyson Helton is a QB coach at USC, who will likely be our OC. Kevin Sherrer is an LB coach at Georgia who will be our DC. These promotion type hires are the least likely to work out; which isnt to say they couldnt work. But you can see our recent history is littered with failures of this type: Sal Sunseri and Larry Scott both fit into this bucket. Whereas, our more successful coordinators have had experience at their position before (Chaney, Wilcox).
Reasons for optimism on staff. While I would rather get a proven OC like Tee Martin, I like that were getting a guy familiar with the USC offense in Tyson Helton. I think the USC style offense (also similar to Kiffins offense) is a good fit for the University of Tennessee. While I can complain that Pruitt is mostly promoting rather than getting proven guys, I will say that the guys hes getting are generally regarded very highly. Helton is a great QB coach and will be a major upgrade over Butch Jones era QB coaches. Will Friend looks like a good hire for O-line. Id be happy to see Chris Weinke on staff. Tracy Rocker was highly regarded at Georgia. Kevin Sherrer is also highly regarded at Georgia. So I at least view these promotion type hires to be more likely to succeed than Butch Jones promotion hires last season which had huge question marks. Still, its a wait and see thing for me.
Pruitt is a better hire than Kiffin 08, Dooley, or Butch. I was not a fan of our last three hires; and I dont simply mean in hindsight. I thought Kiffin and Dooley were both poor hires when they happened. I thought Butch was an OK, but not great hire. Pruitt is the best of the bunch, but still far from 1st tier. Lets hope he fares better than the last three.
Pruitt understands the Saban-system. I do think Pruitt understands the Saban system better than almost anyone else outside of Kirby Smart and thats a plus. Hes making some interesting moves that seem to mimic or expand upon things Saban has been doing to get an edge.
Great recruiters. Pruitt is bringing in some great recruiters. Thats good, but I guess you can say Im less impressed by this than I might have been a few seasons ago. Butch brought in great recruiters that couldnt coach. Im hoping Pruitt brings in great recruiters who can also coach well.
Aight! Pruitt wasnt my first choice, but Im behind him 100% right now.
Next season
The SEC just got tougher. Florida just got a major upgrade with Dan Mullen. Arkansas and Texas A&M also likely got upgrades with Chad Morris and Jimbo Fisher, respectively. This conference is a Murderers Row that can eat up even very good coaches. Kevin Sumlin was a very good coach that failed at A&M. Even if Pruitt is very good, to succeed in this league, you have to be great right now. Its a very difficult standard. Hopefully, he at least gets us beating Vandy, Kentucky, Mizzou, and SC again. If you cant do that consistently, you stand no shot at Bama, Florida, and Georgia.
Dont expect miracles. Our development on offense is so far behind the curve at this point, its unfair to expect it to suddenly turn elite in a single season. I think its Years 2 and 3 that will be critical for Pruitt. We have the talent, but its been undercoached for so long, that I dont think were going to see the offense magically click simply because we have a new coach. No one wants to hear it, but if Pruitt makes it to 6-6 and gets us to a bowl game in 18, be happy. Save your great expectations for 19 and 20.
The good news. When Butch was hired, I said don't expect to see great results until at least Year 3 or Year 4. Butch inherited a trainwreck. Pruitt is inheriting a much better situation talent and depth-wise. If Pruitt is good, I think we can start seeing improved results in Year 2.
Hybrid defense. Pruitt ran the 3-4 defense at Bama and Georgia. He ran the 4-3 Multiple defense at Florida State. Pruitt has stated he wants to get the best players on the field and scheme around that, which probably means we have a look more similar to his time at Florida State next season. We probably don't have the personnel to run the 3-4 right now, but don't be surprised if we see a slow evolution towards it.
Refreshing ability to adapt. I will say it's refreshing to have a guy who is going to try to scheme around his own player's strengths and weaknesses, rather than have a guy who's going to constantly try to fit square pegs into round holes. Butch Jones was one of the least adaptive coaches I can ever recall being here and it was a major reason for his failure.
Recruiting class. Obviously, it would be nice to finish strong, but realistically, we know that any year with a coaching change is going to be a weaker class. If we can finish with a top 20 class, Id say be pretty happy. But its the 2019 class thats really going to show how this staff can recruit.
GBO!
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dduncan4163
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I had a thought yesterday...well, several in fact, but anyway.
Concerning the Helton hire. I wonder if perhaps Tee turned us down since he's likely in line for a HC gig at some point in the next little bit, but recommended Helton to Fulmer/Pruitt. I really don't think Tee would ever turn his back on us completely and you have to think he and Fulmer are still tight. "I'm honored, but I would rather wait for a head coach gig. But I have this guy on staff that's sharp..."
I like to think Tee still has us in his heart and wouldn't want to see the Vols fail. And I can't make any link with Pruitt and Helton, so it might stand to reason he'd take the advice of Fulmer if Tee planted the bug in his ear.
My conspiracy theory for the day.
Concerning the Helton hire. I wonder if perhaps Tee turned us down since he's likely in line for a HC gig at some point in the next little bit, but recommended Helton to Fulmer/Pruitt. I really don't think Tee would ever turn his back on us completely and you have to think he and Fulmer are still tight. "I'm honored, but I would rather wait for a head coach gig. But I have this guy on staff that's sharp..."
I like to think Tee still has us in his heart and wouldn't want to see the Vols fail. And I can't make any link with Pruitt and Helton, so it might stand to reason he'd take the advice of Fulmer if Tee planted the bug in his ear.
My conspiracy theory for the day.
ButchPlz
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0nelilreb
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We tend to think of things as fans so in those terms why wouldnt anyone come back home if or when we needed them but asking a coach and his family to just uproot everything theyve been working toward and building on for years I would imagine would be a very hard decision for anyone especially if you look at the job your being asked to do and see instability and uncertain outcomes . That why I try to look at it from their point of view and try not to be upset if it doesnt happen .
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