Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXXVI

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#8,426
#8,426
It almost seems like the staff is trying to prove QD is the clear starter and forcing it at times. Goal line is a microcosm
 
#8,427
#8,427
Difference between McElwain and Jones. McElwain learned from Saban the ultimate point is to win the football game. Jones has learned this yet. Otherwise you get Kelly the ball inside the 10 and you are in prevent regardless at the end of game.

It's why McElwain has 2 east titles and beat LSU last year. The point is to win the game.
 
#8,428
#8,428
Le Diplomate said:
No question the coaches made some poor decisions, but consider the flip side of the last few minutes:

1) If the Vols run Kelly three times into run blitzes and the field goal gets blocked (or Medley, not exactly Mr. Reliable, misses it), then we're all upset that Butch was too predictable. "Why didn't we open up the playbook to try and win the game?" I thought Tennessee should have run the ball at least once in that sequence, but remember that Kelly drops a sure touchdown pass on first down. Clearly the Florida defense didn't expect that play.

2) MacElwain said in the press conference afterward that the Gators were trying to pick up 25 yards or so, call a timeout, and give Pinero (a really good, big-legged kicker) a shot at the game winner. If Shoop plays three-deep or quarters zone coverage, or worse yet, only rushes three, then it plays right into the Florida play-call.

I'm as pissed as anyone at the end of the game, but if Kelly catches that touchdown pass, Kongbo doesn't let Franks escape containment, or Abernathy (I think he was the safety on Cleveland) doesn't take one false step, Tennessee wins that ballgame. Note that I'm not blaming any of the individual players-- win as a team, lose as team-- but execution absolutely crushed the Vols all day.

The biggest indictment of Butch (and Scott, if he had a free hand to call plays) is the offensive gameplan in the first half. That first-and-goal sequence was terrible, and relying on first year receivers (Palmer) at the goal line is a recipe for disaster. Watching Henderson return the tipped pass for a touchdown gave me PTSD flashbacks to the immortal AJ Suggs against Georgia back in the early 2000s.

TL;DR: The game never should have come down to Florida's best WR against a safety in single coverage, because Tennessee should have been up 13-6 or more at halftime. Who knows how the game plays out if the Vols have a halftime lead, but I don't think Tennessee loses on a Hail Mary.
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1. If we give the ball to Kelly 3 times and get stuffed, then he can say "we went with the best player on the field." He'll get some criticism, but we can live with it.

2. I'm not super upset about the playcall to end the game. We were in quarters. They were trying for a FG. WR didn't know the play and ran deep and QB scrambled and took a shot. Sucks that it happened, but it wasn't a Hail Mary by any means.


But it never should've come down to that. Horrendous playcalling by Butch and Scott left 6-14 points on the field.
 
#8,430
#8,430
Bassmaster_Vol said:
If we don't put JG in we have no chance to win a big game this year. None.
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I don't think it's that drastic.

We can win with Dormady IF the coaches adjust playcalling and formations to his strengths.


If Butch is so set in his way that's he's incapable of doing that (and this very well may be the case), then I agree we need to just go with JG.
 
#8,431
#8,431
InVOLuntary said:
It's a roll of the dice. I think JGs legs are his only advantage over QD. I fully admit I am basing it on limited snaps but what I saw out of JG in the ISU game was very, very raw. Talented, but raw.
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Absolutely. My point is QD doesn't execute the plays that cater to his skillset. Definitely not his fault they continue to run the read option. Dobbs was very raw if I remember correctly.
 
#8,433
#8,433
Well now we're in an intense battle to finish 3rd in the East and hopefully win another bowl game against some sucky big 10 team. Yippy.
 
#8,434
#8,434
Darth_Shiveman said:
1. If we give the ball to Kelly 3 times and get stuffed, then he can say "we went with the best player on the field." He'll get some criticism, but we can live with it.

2. I'm not super upset about the playcall to end the game. We were in quarters. They were trying for a FG. WR didn't know the play and ran deep and QB scrambled and took a shot. Sucks that it happened, but it wasn't a Hail Mary by any means.


But it never should've come down to that. Horrendous playcalling by Butch and Scott left 6-14 points on the field.
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100 percent right on
 
#8,436
#8,436
rekinhavoc said:
Absolutely. My point is QD doesn't execute the plays that cater to his skillset. Definitely not his fault they continue to run the read option. Dobbs was very raw if I remember correctly.
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Dobbs was very raw and he wasn't very good either. His strength even last year, was extending plays with his legs. And remember, we were all clamoring for Dobbs to keep it more on the ZR, even last year. I would expect that to be the case wth JG. I just don't think switching qbs this year will change much of anything. If we were building form the future like when Dobbs played initially, I could go for it, sacrificing the current form the future, but we need to win now. I do think JG needs to see a lot of PT next week.
 
#8,439
#8,439
TechnoVol said:
Cat... all three are likely. Immediately mad last night, sad today and then the very real danger is that fan apathy will set in with a loss to UGA.
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Wouldn't be he worst thing. If a change is needed it's going to take fans stop going to games, tuning in, etc.
 
#8,440
#8,440
InVOLuntary said:
This. QD is not the problem. JG has a bright future but the ISU game proved to me he has a lot of work to do. Anyone thinking JG will be our savior this year is going to be severely disappointed.
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I agree
Dobbs compounded the stereotype by 1000.
Too many people already believe the backup is always the answer, Dobbs unbelievable running ability has made it that much worse. If the backup was the man before, add "mobile" or "dual-threat" beside his name.
I still watch highlights of Josh and can't believe he broke through some of those tackles.
But he was absolutely the exception, not the rule.
 
#8,443
#8,443
rekinhavoc said:
Butch reminded me of Ted Cruz last night . All red faced and embarrassed that he should've endorsed Trump in his speech but too stubborn to do it.

You have the read option in your playbook . You have two QB's and only one has the skillset to run the play. You run the play with the QB who doesn't have that skillset.
The other QB has a cannon for an arm. Yet you continue to play the 1st QB who has already thrown 3 picks (1 pick 6 on a high throw) hoping he will get hot. Luck ran out.


JG deserves a shot. Give him the chance to learn on the job.

C'mon Ted/Butch swallow your pride and endorse JG.
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Lyin' Butch
 
#8,444
#8,444
One thing Doug Matthews spoke a little bit on this morning that I hadn't thought about:

If Butch is just absolutely opposed to going under center and running the ball in short yardage situations, why don't they have some sort of package to run the ball when you need a yard?

Surely with all the RB depth we have we could put together a wildcat or something and direct snap to Kelly/Chandler.


You've gotta have SOMETHING in your offense for when you need a yard and want to run the ball. The simplest solution is lining up under center and running or sneaking it, but there are other options toon



Absolutely baffling to me that in 5 years here Butch has refused to put in SOMETHING for these situations.
 
#8,445
#8,445
Darth_Shiveman said:
One thing Doug Matthews spoke a little bit on this morning that I hadn't thought about:

If Butch is just absolutely opposed to going under center and running the ball in short yardage situations, why don't they have some sort of package to run the ball when you need a yard?

Surely with all the RB depth we have we could put together a wildcat or something and direct snap to Kelly/Chandler.


You've gotta have SOMETHING in your offense for when you need a yard and want to run the ball. The simplest solution is lining up under center and running or sneaking it, but there are other options toon



Absolutely baffling to me that in 5 years here Butch has refused to put in SOMETHING for these situations.
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He's stupid IMO
 
#8,447
#8,447
Darth_Shiveman said:
One thing Doug Matthews spoke a little bit on this morning that I hadn't thought about:

If Butch is just absolutely opposed to going under center and running the ball in short yardage situations, why don't they have some sort of package to run the ball when you need a yard?

Surely with all the RB depth we have we could put together a wildcat or something and direct snap to Kelly/Chandler.

You've gotta have SOMETHING in your offense for when you need a yard and want to run the ball. The simplest solution is lining up under center and running or sneaking it, but there are other options toon



Absolutely baffling to me that in 5 years here Butch has refused to put in SOMETHING for these situations.
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Don't recall a wildcat to a RB ever. Think we have used it a couple of times last year with JJ. Wildcat to Kelly with a lead blocker (Jakob J) would have been a surprising call in the RZ
 
#8,449
#8,449
I don't understand

How is a formation change going to help Dormady with his issues thus far?

Mechanics and decision making are his problems IMO
 
#8,450
#8,450
Volator said:
Don't recall a wildcat to a RB ever. Think we have used it a couple of times last year with JJ. Wildcat to Kelly with a lead blocker (Jakob J) would have been a surprising call in the RZ
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Used it in 2014 with Hurd/Lane while Worley was the guy. We had trouble getting the run game goin at times so Bajakian would go to it to get the ball in Hurd's hands and let him get going faster.

Stopped using it once Dobbs took over because no need with such a good running QB.
 
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