Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXXVI

[nicksjuzunk]

I disagree. I think 9-3 could win the East, if we beat UF and Georgia. That would mean losses to Bama, LSU and somebody else, but it could be a matter of Tennessee, UF, Georgia, USC beating each other up and we would likely have the best record against East opponents in that scenario.

Theoretically possible, but unlikely and cumbersome

 

[tomq_123]

Still not buying his hype. USCe is concerning though

Schedule works out better this year than last with UMass between FL and UGA and a bye before USCe, Bama, Kentucky before ending with S. Miss, Muzzou, LSU and Vandy. However, you know Muschamp has that UT game circled on his calendar every year. He really wants to keep his win streak going against us.

 

[Ericvol2096]

We find a way to win the next 4 games and I'll see you guys in Atlanta in December.

We lose 3 of the 4 and I'll see you guys in the coaching search thread.

What a month this will be.

 

[VolinArizona]

.

 

[VolinArizona]

Clemson was set up much better when Dabo took over than when Butch took over at UT, but year 5 for Dabo was 11-2 with an Orange Bowl appearance.

 

[Kingston Vol]

Butch has taken the next step or two up for our program. The next two steps, conference champions and elite status are the hardest to ascend to. Unfortunately, Bama stands in the way of both, making it doubly hard... especially playing them in the regular season annually

It may take longer to get there, which is where patience is needed

There's a line between where we are right now and where you're describing. I expect us to win the East at this point. Not beat Alabama in either the regular season nor the SEC Championship game - its ridiculous to expect to beat them.

 

[drvenner]

My first coach was Doug Dickey. He actually started in 1964 but I think it was a couple years later before I was totally hooked. Truth: at a very young age I was already complaining about why we had a guy from Florida coaching our football team. I wasn't very consistent though because I actually liked Battle, at least for the 1st 3 years. Then Johnny came home, Phil knifed him in the back almost 16 years later, and well here we are, a few decades removed. It's been 53 years since Dickey's first season. We've only had 20 seasons where we won 7 games or less in a year. Whatever you may think winning 7 games or less unless you're one of us will get you fired PDQ. At least that's our history. I'm assuming by your comment you want Butch Jones fired. I personally think it's probably too early for that. I'd give him this year and next, probably. At least that's what I'm thinking right now. But remember I'm not all that consistent.

About that Majors/Fulmer thing, I don't know what happened. Johnny was in the hospital having heart surgery and we were all praying for him then he comes back and gets fired. Fulmer takes over. I figured from that point on we were a pretty ruthless fanbase.

Since 1964 we've had 10+ win seasons 14 times and won the SEC championship 7 times. So we win 7 games or less more often than we win 10 games or more but you can bank on a coach getting run out of town if he delievers on your 7 wins or less hope and most everybody in the Big Orange Nation will get over it PDQ even if the guy is a beloved family member with incredibly sympathetic circumstances. Ruthless. It will take 20 years off a coach's life or so I've heard. This is not a new thing and everybody has their own opinion on all things but anyone with your opinion is likely just itching to get a coach fired. I can't agree with you on that, at least not yet. jmo.

"knifed him in the back" is a good bit too strong IMO.

 

[nicksjuzunk]

There's a line between where we are right now and where you're describing. I expect us to win the East at this point. Not beat Alabama in either the regular season nor the SEC Championship game - its ridiculous to expect to beat them.

Right, the step where we are is perennial division contenders. I didn't state it, but that's how I feel

 

[vol2002]

This is not a new thing and everybody has their own opinion on all things but anyone with your opinion is likely just itching to get a coach fired. I can't agree with you on that, at least not yet. jmo.

Ha ha - looking back my quote was cryptic and could be interpreted any number of ways. It was actually directed at the negavols that haunt this board and constantly demand coaches be fired and forget the hole we're digging our way out of. If they got their way, we'd be right back in the middle of the Fulmer, Kiffin, Dolley years, staring down mediocre season for as far as the eye can see because of the constant roster and coaching staff turnover. Programs need time to be built. It is what it is.

From my vantage point, I can see both sides on CBJ's first 4 years. Another coach might have won more than him in that time, but plenty could also have won a lot less with the adversity we've faced. He deserves more time. If we are highly competitive in every game and win 8 or more games this fall and are in on a top 10 recruiting class, he deserves one more year. I give him a slightly bigger pass than most this year (apparently) because of what we lost and the inexperience we have.

But he would need to win the East next year in my book. I think pretty much every Vol fan would agree that not doing that this year or next would be enough for us to move on.

But he's done a very solid job to this point. He's generally run a clean program, we have a good roster, the football is much more exciting to watch, and I go into pretty much every game thinking we can win. I think folks are crazy that equate him to Dooley or that suggest we haven't made any progress under CBJ.

 

[Kingston Vol]

Right, the step where we are is perennial division contenders. I didn't state it, but that's how I feel

Gotcha - so here's my question: if say, we win 7 or 8 games and finish two games behind Georgia in the East, is that enough to warrant a coaching change? Is two straight underperforming years where you draw the line? Or would it take a disaster like 6-6?

 

[Chief Vol 13]

JMO, but I think UT, UF and UGA should each have a standard that they must win the SECE at least once every 3 years. Given what he inherited, last year was season 1 for CBJ to meet that standard. This is season 2.

Nope. Was a fourth and 10 or whatever it was against Florida from winning the east in 15 and he should have won it last year.

 

[tomq_123]

Gotcha - so here's my question: if say, we win 7 or 8 games and finish two games behind Georgia in the East, is that enough to warrant a coaching change? Is two straight underperforming years where you draw the line? Or would it take a disaster like 6-6?

If we do make a coaching change who do we realistically (not Gruden, Chip Kelly) go and get who would come here? I personally think we'd have to take another chance on a mid-major guy just like we did with Butch. Not sure what that gets us really.

 

[NMVol]

If we do make a coaching change who do we realistically (not Gruden, Chip Kelly) go and get who would come here? I personally think we'd have to take another chance on a mid-major guy just like we did with Butch. Not sure what that gets us really.

Well you could always go the Saban assistant route. b/f

 

[Chief Vol 13]

If we do make a coaching change who do we realistically (not Gruden, Chip Kelly) go and get who would come here? I personally think we'd have to take another chance on a mid-major guy just like we did with Butch. Not sure what that gets us really.

Might take a look at McIntyre out at Colorado. Other than him I can't really think of anyone.

 

[Chief Vol 13]

Well you could always go the Saban assistant route. b/f

If we went the assistant route I'd look at Brent Venables. I'd say he can recruit and he always has elite defenses. Could probably hire a top staff too.

 

[VolinArizona]

If we do make a coaching change who do we realistically (not Gruden, Chip Kelly) go and get who would come here? I personally think we'd have to take another chance on a mid-major guy just like we did with Butch. Not sure what that gets us really.

We could get someone much better now than in 2012/2013. The roster has been mostly rebuilt and the program is in much better shape.

We could easily get someone like Larry Fedora, DJ Durkin, Dana Holgerson, etc. But I wouldn't want those guys.

We'd probably call Dan Mullen and Bobby Petrino. Probably call Dantonio. Probably call Taggart.

But yes, we'd have to end up hiring a G5 guy like Scott Frost.

But I don't like talking about firing a coach when there is almost 0 reason to yet this season.

 

[SpringBokVol]

If Vandy does beat K State they will be unbearable.

The media already love them and the amount of love added will be hard to listen to.

 

[Kingston Vol]

If we do make a coaching change who do we realistically (not Gruden, Chip Kelly) go and get who would come here? I personally think we'd have to take another chance on a mid-major guy just like we did with Butch. Not sure what that gets us really.

I do understand this line of thinking because Tennessee has proven it can really bungle a coaching search, but I don't think you can allow yourself to operate in this manner. If you (John Currie and boosters) think someone is not doing as good a job as they should you have to have confidence that you can hire someone to do better.

As for specific names? Mike MacIntyre intrigues me a lot. He got to 10 wins with a Colorado program that had been a dumpster fire epic proportions before he got there. He has SEC recruiting experience and his dad was the long time coach at Vanderbilt and he spent a lot of time in Tennessee growing up.

 

[JCP201]

Lord knows I have my complaints but hard to not appreciate this.



Record in last 21 games:
Alabama 20-1
Clemson 19-2
Oklahoma 18-3
Tennessee 17-4
Ohio State 17-4

Not to mention we always play one of the toughest schedules and always has a great recruiting class, but let's fire the coach.

 

[Aesius]

The wildcard in the coaching searches is finding guys who are seemingly "locked down" but are unhappy due to broken promises by the AD or just the university's failure to truly invest in the football program, especially after the guy has shown he can be successful. I would imagine there are at least 2-3 guys in the "second-tier" of coaches who might be in that boat.

But Tennessee would have to seriously pony up the cash to get them to leave, and it would have to be an amount that their AD would refuse to match.

I think we could get a proven, top-notch guy, but we'd have to make him a top 5 highest-paid coach in the country.

 

[Kingston Vol]

If we went the assistant route I'd look at Brent Venables. I'd say he can recruit and he always has elite defenses. Could probably hire a top staff too.

He'd definitely get a call if I were making the decisions. He could bring Marion Hobby home as his defensive coordinator too. We would recruit at the very top level and their coaching has been outstanding. Here's the thing though:Venables played at Kansas State for Bill Snyder. It's widely known Currie and Snyder hated each other. I wonder if that may have an effect on whether or not Venables would interview.

 

[LaagerVol]

Ultimately it all falls on him. I think he has much more input on the offense. It is his offense and I think special teams is his baby as well. Best special teams coach in the country in my opinion.

People want him to hire good coordinators and get out of the way, but then if the coordinators crap the bed it's still his fault. Which I understand, ultimately the whole thing is his responsibility but that just gives me a chuckle.

IMO if we don't meet expectations this year and it's because the defense continues to look bad, then you have to look at letting Shoop go.

BUT, I'm really not liking that we are having these conversations two games into the season. TBH I kinda feel bad for the coaches, esp Butch. Imagine you get a new job and the department you took over was the worst in the company and in four years you have turned it into one of the best, but everyone in the company is constantly complaining and saying you should be fired because you haven't turned your department into the best one in the company. Taking personal shots at you. Constantly badgering and ignoring any good you have done.

Has to be frustrating and demoralizing.

 

[mrMet]

We are about to be 3-0 after demoralizing Florida then have UMASS to make it 4-0 then UGA comes to Neyland where we have good odds to be 5-0 for the second straight year and some of you knuckleheads are talking about a coaching search? Come on now

 

[tomq_123]

We could get someone much better now than in 2012/2013. The roster has been mostly rebuilt and the program is in much better shape.

We could easily get someone like Larry Fedora, DJ Durkin, Dana Holgerson, etc. But I wouldn't want those guys.

We'd probably call Dan Mullen and Bobby Petrino. Probably call Dantonio. Probably call Taggart.

But yes, we'd have to end up hiring a G5 guy like Scott Frost.

But I don't like talking about firing a coach when there is almost 0 reason to yet this season.

UT has been very good at getting these types of guys raises at their current position.

 

[NMVol]

We are about to be 3-0 after demoralizing Florida then have UMASS to make it 4-0 then UGA comes to Neyland where we have good odds to be 5-0 for the second straight year and some of you knuckleheads are talking about a coaching search? Come on now

I got into the conversation if only via a blue font comment. It's how the negavol works they flail around looking for salvation and if you reach out to help them from drowning they take you down with 'em. We don't need a coach at present.