Kelvin Taylor > Derrick Henry...and other bold NFL Draft predictions

[bamawriter]

Why are you trying to evaluate football if you never played organized football? You really don't know Football until you suit up in pads. You're essentially VN's Beth Mowins.

Except that Beth Mowins has bigger balls.

 

[KBVol]

He has no argument here and he knows it. There are 16 players in the NFL that got double digit sacks last year. He's one of them. He was a rookie. He didn't play in 4 games. There isn't a teammate that helped him get that number as the Charger d-line leaves a lot to be desired.

He was an impact rookie. It's not in dispute

Really, really impactful. As in Defensive Rookie of the Year impactful.

Yet, I guarantee you, according to D4H, Robert Nkemdiche, who recorded all of one assisted tackle last year as a rookie, is clearly a better, more dominant future player and first ballot hall of gamer. Why, when RN is winning MVP awards here in a year or two, Bosa will clearly be out of the league, selling insurance or something. After all, "tape don't lie".

 

[Burger]

What D4H is going to miss everytime is intracite details that make a player a bust or a legend.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Only played basketball. Never played football. Too violent a game for me.

I did play flag football a lot and had a good arm. People did try to convince me to play but I never wanted to.

 

[RikidyBones]

Only played basketball. Never played football. Too violent a game for me.

I did play flag football a lot and had a good arm. People did try to convince me to play but I never wanted to.

hahaha too violent. I'm not surprised by this at all.

 

[LouderVol]

Why are you trying to evaluate football if you never played organized football? You really don't know Football until you suit up in pads. You're essentially VN's Beth Mowins.

I never understood this. I played a lot of sports in high school, no football though. But playing those sports has not made me a better talent elevator than someone who didn't. It always strikes me as just another way to relive the glory days for the people who peaked in HS.

 

[Burger]

I never understood this. I played a lot of sports in high school, no football though. But playing those sports has not made me a better talent elevator than someone who didn't. It always strikes me as just another way to relive the glory days for the people who peaked in HS.

There are certain details that will be missed if somebody has never played the game at all. This mainly is with defensive and offensive linemen.

 

[BearCat204]

I never understood this. I played a lot of sports in high school, no football though. But playing those sports has not made me a better talent elevator than someone who didn't. It always strikes me as just another way to relive the glory days for the people who peaked in HS.

I agree, there are a ton of football coaches at the Div I college football level who never played a down of football. There are also a few at the NFL head coach level who didn't really play past a year or two in high school.

 

[k-town_king]

I never understood this. I played a lot of sports in high school, no football though. But playing those sports has not made me a better talent elevator than someone who didn't. It always strikes me as just another way to relive the glory days for the people who peaked in HS.

Especially since literally everyone makes the football team in hs. Its not like you have to even know how to play. You have to actually make the basketball and baseball teams.

 

[BearCat204]

Especially since literally everyone makes the football team in hs. Its not like you have to even know how to play. You have to actually make the basketball and baseball teams.

Really depends on where you live. It was opposite for us as in literally everyone who tried out was on the basketball team and baseball team, but they were very selective with football because of the size and success of our program, but I agree with your point that just because you played high school football, doesn't really mean you have a clue

 

[bamawriter]

There are certain details that will be missed if somebody has never played the game at all. This mainly is with defensive and offensive linemen.

I agree in part. But I played high school ball, played multiple positions in fact, and had some schollie offers from smaller schools because I was a decent place kicker. However, my high school team was poorly coached ("terribly coached" may be a more appropriate description) and I can't honestly say that my playing time put me in a position to accurately assess the intricacies of the college or pro game. So, I don't know that it's fair to rip on D4H over his lack of playing time.

That said, I do get paid to write about football. And I've spent more hours than I could ever possibly count talking to players and coaches and various other experts. What I've learned about the game, I've learned from them. I know many, many writers who have never played a down of football, but who can break down the game better than just about anyone. And those guys can do so because they've dedicated so much time to learning about the game from the guys who know it best. Mind you, I am not claiming to be an expert. I try to know the limitations of my knowledge.

That's really where D4H's nonsense breaks down. I can say with absolute certainty that he's never spent any time trying to absorb knowledge from players and coaches. He spouts buzzwords that he hears and reads from the talking heads (the same guys he dismisses when they disagree with him), but none of those buzzwords translate to real insight.

 

[Burger]

I agree in part. But I played high school ball, played multiple positions in fact, and had some schollie offers from smaller schools because I was a decent place kicker. However, my high school team was poorly coached ("terribly coached" may be a more appropriate description) and I can't honestly say that my playing time put me in a position to accurately assess the intricacies of the college or pro game. So, I don't know that it's fair to rip on D4H over his lack of playing time.

That said, I do get paid to write about football. And I've spent more hours than I could ever possibly count talking to players and coaches and various other experts. What I've learned about the game, I've learned from them. I know many, many writers who have never played a down of football, but who can break down the game better than just about anyone. And those guys can do so because they've dedicated so much time to learning about the game from the guys who know it best. Mind you, I am not claiming to be an expert. I try to know the limitations of my knowledge.

That's really where D4H's nonsense breaks down. I can say with absolute certainty that he's never spent any time trying to absorb knowledge from players and coaches. He spouts buzzwords that he hears and reads from the talking heads (the same guys he dismisses when they disagree with him), but none of those buzzwords translate to real insight.

I've seen many writers not know a lick about the sport their reporting.

 

[bamawriter]

I've seen many writers not know a lick about the sport their reporting.

Unfortunately, that group is large. Some guys and gals don't take the time to learn about the game. It requires dedicating a lot of time to sitting with the experts and going over stuff that will never make it to print because it would bore the reader to tears. But I think it's a critical step because it allows the writer to not just write about what is happening, but why.

Interestingly, D4H has not given me any reason to believe that he knows the slightest bit about the what or the why. Which is probably why he's typing novels on VN between shifts at Denny's.

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

Unfortunately, that group is large. Some guys and gals don't take the time to learn about the game. It requires dedicating a lot of time to sitting with the experts and going over stuff that will never make it to print because it would bore the reader to tears. But I think it's a critical step because it allows the writer to not just write about what is happening, but why.

Interestingly, D4H has not given me any reason to believe that he knows the slightest bit about the what or the why. Which is probably why he's typing novels on VN between shifts at Denny's.

I never claimed to know football. I watch a lot so I've picked up on some things. But I never claimed to be an expert on the game.

All I've said is that I have a gift for spotting talent.

 

[bamawriter]

All I've said is that I have a gift for spotting talent.

And you keep proving yourself wrong.

 

[Burger]

I never claimed to know football. I watch a lot so I've picked up on some things. But I never claimed to be an expert on the game.

All I've said is that I have a gift for spotting talent.

No you don't. What you did in this year's draft analysis is essentially said almost everyone is good.

Football is a complex game that it takes years of learning to become an expert. The difference between somebody like Vince Young and Randall Cunningham are actually almost insignificant. Someone who took the time to learn the game knows why one busted and another was great.

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

And you keep proving yourself wrong.

Its been 1 year. And I never even said the 2016 class was that talented. You guys think you have something because I rated Kelvin Taylor above Derrick Henry. Honestly, neither was that special.

The 2017 class is my defining class. Its an all-time great class with a bunch of all-time great players in it. I believe I've done a great in identifying them. I'm confident that history will ultimately prove me right.

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

No you don't. What you did in this year's draft analysis is essentially said almost everyone is good.

That's because we are dealing with an all-time great draft class. The 2017 NFL Draft will go down as one of the best in NFL history. It should produce as many individual pro bowlers as any draft in history.

This class doesn't have a ton hall of famers. What it does have is incredible depth. There should be a ton of reliable starters and pro bowlers from this class.

I believe I've done a good job of identifying those mid to late round gems that will define this class.

 

[cncchris33]

All I've said is that I have a gift for spotting talent.

No, you really don't. You have a knack for hitting about 20% of your projections and then projecting that less than modest success into this delusion that you hold an advanced level of talent scounting.

 

[Burger]

That's because we are dealing with an all-time great draft class. The 2017 NFL Draft will go down as one of the best in NFL history. It should produce as many individual pro bowlers as any draft in history.

This class doesn't have a ton hall of famers. What it does have is incredible depth. There should be a ton of reliable starters and pro bowlers from this class.

I believe I've done a good job of identifying those mid to late round gems that will define this class.

If you are 100% correct about the 2017 draft, Canton would be adding a new wing for one draft class. With the NFL Draft turning more into a boom or bust ordeal, you will never see a draft class like 1989 ever again.

 

[bamawriter]

Its been 1 year. And I never even said the 2016 class was that talented. You guys think you have something because I rated Kelvin Taylor above Derrick Henry. Honestly, neither was that special.

If you didn't think Taylor was "that special" then why say things like:

While Taylor reminds me of Frank Gore. He's got great initial burst and can cut on a dime.

Or is Frank Gore not "that special?"

Kelvin on the other hand is amazing at creating for himself.

Or does the word "amazing" equate to "not that special" in your personal lexicon?

He'll be a big-time steal.

How many other "big-time steals" weren't that special?

Kelvin Taylor has exceptional cutting ability.

According to Roget's Thesaurus, "special" is a synonym of "exceptional."

There are others, but I think the point is made.

 

[hndog609]

All I've said is that I have a gift for spotting talent.

You specifically cited 3 RB and 3 QB's as your top picks in last years draft. 4 of those 6 combined for 198 yards, 1 TD and two INT's. One RB is 0 for 3 on making a roster (and still isn't) and one QB that couldn't get on the field even once...and for the Jets.

Are you sure you didn't mean a talent for mis-spotting talent?

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

If you are 100% correct about the 2017 draft, Canton would be adding a new wing for one draft class. With the NFL Draft turning more into a boom or bust ordeal, you will never see a draft class like 1989 ever again.

The 1989 draft wasn't that great. It just had 4 all-time Hall of Famers in the first 5 picks. Not much depth after that. There are at least 3 other draft classes in just the last 30 years that are better (1996, 2007, and 2011).

1996 is definitely the best draft of the last 30 years. Most pro bowlers ever. And should have 6-7 guys in the Hall of Fame eventually. It had tremendous depth and top end talent.

2017 draft reminds me of 1996. This draft should produce 6-7 Hall of Famers but more importantly it will produce a record number of pro bowlers. The depth of this draft is just incredible.

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

If you didn't think Taylor was "that special" then why say things like:



Or is Frank Gore not "that special?"



Or does the word "amazing" equate to "not that special" in your personal lexicon?



How many other "big-time steals" weren't that special?



According to Roget's Thesaurus, "special" is a synonym of "exceptional."

There are others, but I think the point is made.

When I say a player reminds me of player X, I'm talking in terms of PLAYING STYLE. I'm rarely saying they will have the exact same success or impact. You should know this considering the fact I continually compare Dobbs to Randall Cunningham. Yet I always have Dobbs having more NFL success than Cunningham had.

And just because I said Kelvin had one exceptional ability doesn't mean I thought he would be an exceptional RB. I just thought he would be a real good value given where he was projected in the draft.

I thought and still believe Kelvin Taylor can be a reliable productive starting RB in the NFL. He might even make a pro bowl or two. However, I don't believe he will be a borderline hall of famer (which is essentially what Frank Gore has become).

 

[Burger]

The 1989 draft wasn't that great. It just had 4 all-time Hall of Famers in the first 5 picks. Not much depth after that. There are at least 3 other draft classes in just the last 30 years that are better (1996, 2007, and 2011).

1996 is definitely the best draft of the last 30 years. Most pro bowlers ever. And should have 6-7 guys in the Hall of Fame eventually. It had tremendous depth and top end talent.

2017 draft reminds me of 1996. This draft should produce 6-7 Hall of Famers but more importantly it will produce a record number of pro bowlers. The depth of this draft is just incredible.

So you think there will be a whole new wing of Canton?