Best/worst case scenarios for Vols entering NFL.

#27
#27
kamara- raiders/chiefs (if they dont get lynch ten thats is best fit. if they do he can imediately take over on chiefs)

malone- rams( can grow with goff and become deep threat britt was)

maybin- giants(4-3 scheme and dont have great returning LBs.)

sutton- cowboys( got alot of DBs they need to replace)

Dobbs- bears ( can beat out glennon next year for starting job if he doesnt play well this year)

barnett- honestly any 4-3 scheme

croom- giants ( serious need at TE)

weisman- packers ( serious need at G to replace lang)

vereen - cowboys (they need depth at DE)
 
#28
#28
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Still hanging on to that delusion I see. I thought you were Mr. Facts and data? Mel Kiper, Todd McShay, and your favorite Matt Miller of Bleacher Report are all now saying Dobbs goes by the 3rd round.
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I'M "hanging on to delusion"??? Dear God. So says the most delusional human being on earth. Lol.

I like facts and data, proof and evidence....not projection and prediction. You evidently don't know the difference between the two.

Somebody may "fall in love" with Josh and reach for him early, and given who he is, who could blame them? They may see the great character and mental/emotional makeup and believe they can be the ones to develop the mechanical and physical shortcomings. It's a crapshoot....it sure as hell isnt factual and data driven.

However, keep in mind that when he was actually playing this year, he was projected as a 6th-7th round pick or UDA. Now all of a sudden, he's gonna go second round? What changed?

We've all knowb what a phenomenal kid he is the last 3-4 years. Certainly some analysts, GMs and scouts (all of which you've constantly claimed are all blithering idiots) have had the opportunity to interview him and see his athletic ability up close....but he's made this great leap while not taking a snap, without throwing a pass in live play? I don't buy it.

I think Josh has impressed everybody as most all Vol fans knew he would, and has thrown it a little better than expected.

But at the end of the day, when the rubber hits the road and somebody has to actually pull the trigger and invests millions for the sake of a franchise, no one will do it until the 4th round or later. Jmo.

Btw, I barely even know who Matt Miller even is, he certainly isn't my "favorite"... I have no idea what he's said about Dobbs or anybody else. You (rightly) have so many people coming at you, calling you out, correctly identifying you as a blithering idiot, that you don't know who's who.
 
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#29
#29
KBVol said:
I'M "hanging on to delusion"??? Dear God. So says the most delusional human being on earth. Lol.

I like facts and data, proof and evidence....not projection and prediction. You evidently don't know the difference between the two.

Somebody may "fall in love" with Josh and reach for him early, and given who he is, who could blame them? They may see the great character and mental/emotional makeup and believe they can be the ones to develop the mechanical and physical shortcomings. It's a crapshoot....it sure as hell isnt factual and data driven.

However, keep in mind that when he was actually playing this year, he was projected as a 6th-7th round pick or UDA. Now all of a sudden, he's gonna go second round? What changed?

We've all knowb what a phenomenal kid he is the last 3-4 years. Certainly some analysts, GMs and scouts (all of which you've constantly claimed are all blithering idiots) have had the opportunity to interview him and see his athletic ability up close....but he's made this great leap while not taking a snap, without throwing a pass in live play? I don't buy it.

I think Josh has impressed everybody as most all Vol fans knew he would, and has thrown it a little better than expected.

But at the end of the day, when the rubber hits the road and somebody has to actually pull the trigger and invests millions for the sake of a franchise, no one will do it until the 4th round or later. Jmo.

Btw, I barely even know who Matt Miller even is, he certainly isn't my "favorite"... I have no idea what he's said about Dobbs or anybody else. You (rightly) have so many people coming at you, calling you out, correctly identifying you as a blithering idiot, that you don't know who's who.
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First of all cut down on the essay. You didn't need to write all that to make a non point.

Now onto what you actually said. This comment here is ridiculous and I'm guessing it's the out you are preparing for yourself if Josh is actually drafted before the 4th round. FYI if several teams say you're a 3rd round pick and are targeting you at that spot, that doesn't make you a "reach". It means that is where you are valued.

A reach is Cody Kessler last year when there was no buzz on him before the draft being anything more than a 6th-7th round pick. And then all of a sudden getting picked in the 3rd round by the Browns. Right now Josh has crazy buzz from nearly everyone and is getting projected as a 2nd-3rd round pick. If he gets drafted before the 4th, it won't be because a team reached for him.
 
#30
#30
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
First of all cut down on the essay. You didn't need to write all that to make a non point.

Now onto what you actually said. This comment here is ridiculous and I'm guessing it's the out you are preparing for yourself if Josh is actually drafted before the 4th round. FYI if several teams say you're a 3rd round pick and are targeting you at that spot, that doesn't make you a "reach". It means that is where you are valued.

A reach is Cody Kessler last year when there was no buzz on him before the draft being anything more than a 6th-7th round pick. And then all of a sudden getting picked in the 3rd round by the Browns. Right now Josh has crazy buzz from nearly everyone and is getting projected as a 2nd-3rd round pick. If he gets drafted before the 4th, it won't be because a team reached for him.
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It takes a little bit of text to counter your mind numbing stupidity.

It'll be a huge reach if he goes before the 4th round....and I'm being generous.
 
#31
#31
KBVol said:
It takes a little bit of text to counter your mind numbing stupidity.

It'll be a huge reach if he goes before the 4th round....and I'm being generous.
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I thought you were mr. trust the experts. You kept trying to get on me for saying my opinion superseded that of NFL GMs and scouts. Its seem to me like you're doing exactly what you criticize me for doing right now. You are claiming your opinion that Dobbs is a reach before the 4th round supersedes all the information coming out right now that a lot of people in the NFL value Josh as a 3rd round pick.
 
#32
#32
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Who cares what they thought. I'm talking about what happened. I remember they also thought Jamarcus Russell was the next big thing.
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There are no guarantees in the draft. Dobbs can be a 3 and out player in the NFL, or he can be a good starter for 5-10 years.
 
#35
#35
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
I thought you were mr. trust the experts. You kept trying to get on me for saying my opinion superseded that of NFL GMs and scouts. Its seem to me like you're doing exactly what you criticize me for doing right now. You are claiming your opinion that Dobbs is a reach before the 4th round supersedes all the information coming out right now that a lot of people in the NFL value Josh as a 3rd round pick.
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I, like 100% of other VN posters, trust NFL GMs and scouts over.....so far freaking over...... you.

And I, thankfully, don't do anything like you. I'm not calling any GM or scout or analysts know-nothings or idiots because I may disagree with them. I've explained my position. I think they really like the Josh Dobbs they've gotten to know, who in the world wouldn't? I also think he's acquitted himself very well with his workouts. He's done very well.

But, 3 weeks out from the draft discussing players who are well thought of and who have (surprisingly) impressed more than expected, is far different from actually pulling the trigger and selecting him on draft day. And when the time comes, when it's time to put your money where your mouth is, I think it's highly unlikely anybody reaches for him before the 4th round, and I doubt it'll be even that early. Again, jmho.
 
#36
#36
KBVol said:
I, like 100% of other VN posters, trust NFL GMs and scouts over.....so far freaking over...... you.

And I, thankfully, don't do anything like you. I'm not calling any GM or scout or analysts know-nothings or idiots because I may disagree with them. I've explained my position. I think they really like the Josh Dobbs they've gotten to know, who in the world wouldn't? I also think he's acquitted himself very well with his workouts. He's done very well.

But, 3 weeks out from the draft discussing players who are well thought of and who have (surprisingly) impressed more than expected, is far different from actually pulling the trigger and selecting him on draft day. And when the time comes, when it's time to put your money where your mouth is, I think it's highly unlikely anybody reaches for him before the 4th round, and I doubt it'll be even that early. Again, jmho.
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With the great defensive draft, that can push a lot of offensive players down half a round.
 
#38
#38
Burger said:
In a really bad draft class for QBs, Dobbs is a 3rd to 5th rounder.
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This is not a bad QB draft regardless of what the media heads say. There are 2 franchise QBs in this class (Dobbs and Kaaya). And another with the potential to be very good (Mahomes).
 
#40
#40
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
This is not a bad QB draft regardless of what the media heads say. There are 2 franchise QBs in this class (Dobbs and Kaaya). And another with the potential to be very good (Mahomes).
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Lol. I don't know that there is a franchise qb in this very poor qb draft. But if there is, neither Josh nor Kaaya is it, that I can tell you. If there is one, it's the guy who played incredibly well in each of the last two National title games, on the biggest stage, vs the best defense and head coach in the country....perhaps you've heard of him? His name is Deshaun Watson.
 
#41
#41
KBVol said:
Lol. I don't know that there is a franchise qb in this very poor qb draft. But if there is, neither Josh nor Kaaya is it, that I can tell you. If there is one, it's the guy who played incredibly well in each of the last two National title games, on the biggest stage, vs the best defense and head coach in the country....perhaps you've heard of him? His name is Deshaun Watson.
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Deshaun has a strong probability of being a bust.

First and foremost, the national champion/heisman finalist star college QB rarely becomes a star in the NFL. Cam Newton being the rare outlier. Generally those guys fail (see Vince Young, Matt Leinart, Sam Bradford, Tim Tebow, RG3, etc.). So history is against Deshaun Watson becoming a star QB in the NFL.

Second, I question Watson's durability. He has already had one ACL tear and if you watched the national title game you would have seen he has a tendency to take brutal hits from both inside and outside the pocket like RG3. Dobbs runs just as much as him but seems to have more of a knack of avoiding big hits like Russell Wilson. There is a strong likelihood Deshaun has similar problems to RG3 when it comes to staying healthy in the NFL.

And third, I question Watson's off field character. I don't know if he'll be as dedicated to his craft in the pros when he has tons of money and free time as is necessary to be a franchise QB. There are stories of him in college from people in the know that say there might be some immaturity here. Plus the incident at the Tuscaloosa bar doesn't help.

Dobbs, Kaaya, and potentially Mahomes are the QBs I would target in this draft class. They check the boxes for me and don't have much in the way of glaring red flags.
 
#42
#42
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Deshaun has a strong probability of being a bust.

First and foremost, the national champion/heisman finalist star college QB rarely becomes a star in the NFL. Cam Newton being the rare outlier. Generally those guys fail (see Vince Young, Matt Leinart, Sam Bradford, Tim Tebow, RG3, etc.). So history is against Deshaun Watson becoming a star QB in the NFL.

Second, I question Watson's durability. He has already had one ACL tear and if you watched the national title game you would have seen he has a tendency to take brutal hits from both inside and outside the pocket like RG3. Dobbs runs just as much as him but seems to have more of a knack of avoiding big hits like Russell Wilson. There is a strong likelihood Deshaun has similar problems to RG3 when it comes to staying healthy in the NFL.

And third, I question Watson's off field character. I don't know if he'll be as dedicated to his craft in the pros when he has tons of money and free time as is necessary to be a franchise QB. There are stories of him in college from people in the know that say there might be some immaturity here. Plus the incident at the Tuscaloosa bar doesn't help.

Dobbs, Kaaya, and potentially Mahomes are the QBs I would target in this draft class. They check the boxes for me and don't have much in the way of glaring red flags.
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Tl;dr.
 
#43
#43
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
This is not a bad QB draft regardless of what the media heads say. There are 2 franchise QBs in this class (Dobbs and Kaaya). And another with the potential to be very good (Mahomes).
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Here's a mock draft of the first 3 rounds from Pro Football Focus....they got Trubisky, Watson, Mahomes, Kizer, Peterman and Kaaya going.....no Dobbs. I know, I know, they're a bunchs stupid idiots.....unless they change their minds next week.

http://buff.ly/2o6LIPV
 
#44
#44
KBVol said:
Here's a mock draft of the first 3 rounds from Pro Football Focus....they got Trubisky, Watson, Mahomes, Kizer, Peterman and Kaaya going.....no Dobbs. I know, I know, they're a bunchs stupid idiots.....unless they change their minds next week.

http://buff.ly/2o6LIPV
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Pro Football Focus are not like McShay and Kiper. I don't think they have as many sources in NFL front offices like Kiper and McShay. And I don't think they are trying to match the teams with players they are hearing they are interested. It seems to me like they are just matching teams with players they have heard the teams have high grades on. That is why they have a guy like Solomon Thomas in the mid-teens even though everyone else him going #2 overall because they have heard teams in the top 5 like San Francisco value him highly. And they have Fournette falling to #24 even though sources in NFL front offices are telling guys like Kiper and McShay that Jacksonville at #4 and Carolina at #8 value him highly.

I told you months ago mock drafts are worthless in general until the last couple of weeks before the draft when connected people like McShay, Kiper, and Daniel Jeremiah start finalizing their boards and mock drafts and tell us what they are hearing.

Mock drafts from guys without connections to NFL front office execs and NFL scouts is worthless at this time of the year.
 
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#45
#45
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
This is not a bad QB draft regardless of what the media heads say. There are 2 franchise QBs in this class (Dobbs and Kaaya). And another with the potential to be very good (Mahomes).
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It's just my opinion that this QB class is bad. Not 2013 bad, but not far off. When Trubinsky is the highest rated player, it's bad.
 
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#47
#47
Burger said:
It's just my opinion that this QB class is bad. Not 2013 bad, but not far off. When Trubinsky is the highest rated player, it's bad.
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I can see why you feel that way but that's because the evaluators at bad. Trubisky is #1 because NFL teams are simply bad when it comes to evaluating the QB position. Just look at 2014. You probably woulda said that was a bad QB draft because Bortles and Manziel went in the first round. But then a guy like Derek Carr falls to the second round and he turns into a superstar. In 2016, the QB class was supposed to be bad once again cause Jared Goff goes #1 overall but then a Dak Prescott goes in the 4th round. And he becomes a superstar.

Dobbs and Kaaya will be the Derek Carr/Dak Prescott of this class. They will make this class a good QB class down the road.
 
#48
#48
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
I can see why you feel that way but ythat's because the evaluators at bad. Trubisky is #1 because NFL teams regularly draft busts at the QB position. Just look at 2014. Bortles and Manziel go in the first round so people think it's a bad QB draft but then a guy like Derek Carr falls to the second round. In 2016, the QB class was supposed to be bad once again cause Jared Goff goes #1 overall but then a Dak Prescott goes in the 4th round.

Dobbs and Kaaya will be the Derek Carr/Dak Prescott of this class. They will make this class a good QB class down the road.
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Even the good evaluators have Trubinsky and Kiser as 1 and 2. Goff and Wentz are way better than anyone this year. Bortles is also better than anyone in this class.

I mean when the QB boards are Trubinsky, Kiser, Watson, and Mahomes. That's not a good class at all. There's not that much of a gap between them and Davis Webb.
 
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#49
#49
Burger said:
Even the good evaluators have Trubinsky and Kiser as 1 and 2. Goff and Wentz are way better than anyone this year. Bortles is also better than anyone in this class.

I mean when the QB boards are Trubinsky, Kiser, Watson, and Mahomes. That's not a good class at all. There's not that much of a gap between them and Davis Webb.
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There are no good evaluators in the NFL. There are just those that get it a little less wrong than others. I don't know why you treat their word as gospel.

Derek Carr and Dak Prescott are better than all those first round QBs you named and those guys missed on them. I'm telling you know they are also missing on Dobbs and Kaaya. And potentially Mahomes but he needs a lot of work.
 
#50
#50
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
There are no good evaluators in the NFL. There are just those that get it a little less wrong than others. I don't know why you treat their word as gospel.

Derek Carr and Dak Prescott are better than all those first round QBs you named and those guys missed on them. I'm telling you know they are also missing on Dobbs and Kaaya. And potentially Mahomes but he needs a lot of work.
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I would say GB, Sea, Pitt, NE, KC, Den, Oak, Bal, and quite a few other teams have good evaluators. They're usually in the playoffs consistently. That's only 2 out of 32. Most of the starting QBs in the NFL are first rounders. 20 out of 32 were drafted in the first round.
 
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