Immigration Ban

#377
#377
volprof said:
This is what your cohort doesn't understand.

For real conservatives, it's not about the refugees. While I feel sympathy for them, I put American national security above any one of their individual plights. Talk about taking in 100,000 of them, for instance, is foolish.

But, here's the thing: doing a ban like this will only alienate allies and potential allies in the War on Terror, with significant and disastrous effects upon our security, both at home and abroad.

We have a president who has now pissed off at least half the Muslim world, whether their nation was on the list or not, and there will be real and unintended consequences (well, perhaps intended) to this. Our intelligence on terrorists, our ability to track, arrest, and even fight them here and abroad - whether in Europe or the Middle East - is about to take a significant hit.

As a result of this little stunt, so that Bannon and Flynn could make their power move over the weekend with the NSC while we focus on the refugee ban, more Americans will die than what had to before this action.

This action will produce the exact opposite of what it purports to do.
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Trump should definitely shake hands with the Muslim world like Obama did. I mean he should commit treason like Obama did and arm the Muslim brotherhood even further. I mean nothing bad ever happened while Obama kissed the Muslim worlds hind end. Oh wait...

Your post is one rife with a cowardice that has been born from the last 8 years of a complete and utter sissy president. I would say this is as pathetic as your usual Trump is a Russian double agent schitck but its not quite there. You nor anyone else knows whats going happen. Like always, your post is full of childish overreations and conjecture.
 
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#378
#378
volprof said:
This is what your cohort doesn't understand.

For real conservatives, it's not about the refugees. While I feel sympathy for them, I put American national security above any one of their individual plights. Talk about taking in 100,000 of them, for instance, is foolish.

But, here's the thing: doing a ban like this will only alienate allies and potential allies in the War on Terror, with significant and disastrous effects upon our security, both at home and abroad.

We have a president who has now pissed off at least half the Muslim world, whether their nation was on the list or not, and there will be real and unintended consequences (well, perhaps intended) to this. Our intelligence on terrorists, our ability to track, arrest, and even fight them here and abroad - whether in Europe or the Middle East - is about to take a significant hit.

As a result of this little stunt, so that Bannon and Flynn could make their power move over the weekend with the NSC while we focus on the refugee ban, more Americans will die than what had to before this action.

This action will produce the exact opposite of what it purports to do.
Click to expand...

The thing that you need to keep in mind is that there is nothing we could do to make the vast majority of the Islamic community dislike America and what it stands for anymore than they already do..The media calls this Radical Islam but really it is fundamental Islam..

Thus the reason for this extreme vetting process
 
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#379
#379
BigOrangeTrain said:
Trump should definitely shake hands with the Muslim world like Obama did. I mean he should commit treason like Obama did and arm the Muslim brotherhood even further. I mean nothing bad ever happened while Obama kissed the Muslim worlds hind end. Oh wait...

Your post is one rife with a cowardice that has been born from the last 8 years of a complete and utter sissy president. I would say this is as pathetic as your usual Trump is a Russian double agent schitck but its not quite there. You nor anyone else knows whats going happen. Like always, your post is full of childish overreations and conjecture.
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1. Cowardice...there is nothing brave about asking others to fight.

2. Obama bombed seven countries. W bombed four. Obama dropped 3 bombs per hour last year on the Muslim world. Turn off Fox news and try to incorporate some reality in your world view.

But way to make a fool of yourself while calling another poster's opinion "childish conjecture".
 
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#380
#380
UTCVol said:
How many refugees have committed terrorist attacks on American soil?

How many terrorist attacks have been committed on American soil by individuals from these seven nations?
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Two Iraqi refugees were arrested in Bowling Green, Ky., in 2011 on suspicion of plotting to send weapons to insurgents to kill American soldiers abroad.

An Uzbek refugee who was arrested in 2013 in Boise, Idaho, accused of conspiring to support a terrorist organization, gathering explosive materials, and plotting to carry out an attack on U.S. soil.

After the Kentucky case, the FBI’s director of Terrorist Explosive Device Analytical Center told ABC News that there were dozens of counterterrorism investigations into resettled refugees.

Refugees are screened outside of the United States, and are referred for resettlement mainly by the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees. Asylum-seekers apply for asylum once they are in the United States or at the border. Asylum status is available to people who meet the definition of a refugee; successful asylum-seekers obtain refugee status, though the screening protocol is different.

The Tsarnaev brothers initially were described as refugees in news reports. But later, it was revealed that the brothers ended up in the United States as minors because their father applied for asylum.

There is also the arrest of two Bosnian refugees who immigrated the United States, and gathered money to purchase U.S. military uniforms and tactical gear. They intended to transfer the materials to people fighting with the Islamic State in Syria and Iraq, and were charged with conspiring to provide material support and resources to terrorists.

Here's a different Uzbek refugee whom federal officials identified as a resettled refugee. A federal grand jury indicted him with conspiring and attempting to provide material support of a foreign terrorist organization.
 
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#381
#381
n_huffhines said:
Gross incompetence

"The malevolence of President Trump’s Executive Order on visas and refugees is mitigated chiefly—and perhaps only—by the astonishing incompetence of its drafting and construction.

NBC is reporting that the document was not reviewed by DHS, the Justice Department, the State Department, or the Department of Defense, and that National Security Council lawyers were prevented from evaluating it. Moreover, the New York Times writes that Customs and Border Protection and U.S. Citizen and Immigration Services, the agencies tasked with carrying out the policy, were only given a briefing call while Trump was actually signing the order itself. Yesterday, the Department of Justice gave a “no comment” when asked whether the Office of Legal Counsel had reviewed Trump’s executive orders—including the order at hand. (OLC normally reviews every executive order.)

This order reads to me, frankly, as though it was not reviewed by competent counsel at all.

CNN offers extraordinary details:

'Administration officials weren't immediately sure which countries' citizens would be barred from entering the United States. The Department of Homeland Security was left making a legal analysis on the order after Trump signed it. A Border Patrol agent, confronted with arriving refugees, referred questions only to the President himself, according to court filings. ...

It wasn't until Friday -- the day Trump signed the order banning travel from seven Muslim-majority countries for 90 days and suspending all refugee admission for 120 days -- that career homeland security staff were allowed to see the final details of the order, a person with the familiar the matter said.'" - Benjamim Wittes
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Not only all of this happened. But the walk back Trump is trying to do is beautiful.
 
#382
#382
Temporarily preventing -for 90 days - the entry of those who have no right be here in the first place

Oh the horror!
 
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#383
#383
U.S. District Judge Dolly M. Gee just ruled that an Iranian that was deported must be returned back to the U.S.

"Gee ordered U.S. authorities to bring Vayeghan back to this country and to communicate her instruction to their counterparts in Dubai, declaring that Vayeghan had "demonstrated a strong likelihood of success in establishing that removal violates the Establishment Clause, the Immigration and Nationality Act, and his rights to Equal Protection guaranteed by the United States Constitution."

Gee wrote that Vayeghan had a valid visa to be admitted to the U.S.
 
#384
#384
DynaLo said:
Two Iraqi refugees were arrested in Bowling Green, Ky., in 2011 on suspicion of plotting to send weapons to insurgents to kill American soldiers abroad.

An Uzbek refugee who was arrested in 2013 in Boise, Idaho, accused of conspiring to support a terrorist organization, gathering explosive materials, and plotting to carry out an attack on U.S. soil.

After the Kentucky case, the FBI’s director of Terrorist Explosive Device Analytical Center told ABC News that there were dozens of counterterrorism investigations into resettled refugees.

Refugees are screened outside of the United States, and are referred for resettlement mainly by the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees. Asylum-seekers apply for asylum once they are in the United States or at the border. Asylum status is available to people who meet the definition of a refugee; successful asylum-seekers obtain refugee status, though the screening protocol is different.

The Tsarnaev brothers initially were described as refugees in news reports. But later, it was revealed that the brothers ended up in the United States as minors because their father applied for asylum.

There is also the arrest of two Bosnian refugees who immigrated the United States, and gathered money to purchase U.S. military uniforms and tactical gear. They intended to transfer the materials to people fighting with the Islamic State in Syria and Iraq, and were charged with conspiring to provide material support and resources to terrorists.

Here's a different Uzbek refugee whom federal officials identified as a resettled refugee. A federal grand jury indicted him with conspiring and attempting to provide material support of a foreign terrorist organization.
Click to expand...

The only example in this post that would be affected by this EO is the Bowling Green case, and they were neutralized before they carried out their plan.

I did forget about the OSU terrorist, who was a Somalian refugee. No one died, but they very well could have.
 
#385
#385
OJ said:
Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. the authorities that exist have been established by God. Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves.
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Yo man you need to pump your brakes with all that noise.
 
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#386
#386
golfballs said:
Temporarily preventing -for 90 days - the entry of those who have no right be here in the first place

Oh the horror!
Click to expand...

Does it have to be a horror? Isn't it enough that it's bad government?

Look at it this way...if Trump's intent actually falls within the bounds of the constitution, it was still rolled out in terrible fashion. There is mass confusion among those who are carrying out this ex o, and it's being rolled out in unconstitutional ways. It's a cluster****.
 
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#387
#387
n_huffhines said:
Does it have to be a horror? Isn't it enough that it's bad government?

Look at it this way...if Trump's intent actually falls within the bounds of the constitution, it was still rolled out in terrible fashion. There is mass confusion among those who are carrying out this ex o, and it's being rolled out in unconstitutional ways. It's a cluster****.
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It's akin to a mountain over a mole hill. A very small percentage of people were inconvenienced by it. Bad optics due to media frenzy but hardy the horror it's being portrayed
 
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#388
#388
BigOrangeTrain said:
Trump should definitely shake hands with the Muslim world like Obama did. I mean he should commit treason like Obama did and arm the Muslim brotherhood even further. I mean nothing bad ever happened while Obama kissed the Muslim worlds hind end. Oh wait...

Your post is one rife with a cowardice that has been born from the last 8 years of a complete and utter sissy president. I would say this is as pathetic as your usual Trump is a Russian double agent schitck but its not quite there. You nor anyone else knows whats going happen. Like always, your post is full of childish overreations and conjecture.
Click to expand...

You sound butthurt. Are you butthurt? Butthurt.
 
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#390
#390
n_huffhines said:
1. Cowardice...there is nothing brave about asking others to fight.

2. Obama bombed seven countries. W bombed four. Obama dropped 3 bombs per hour last year on the Muslim world. Turn off Fox news and try to incorporate some reality in your world view.

But way to make a fool of yourself while calling another poster's opinion "childish conjecture".
Click to expand...

Your opinion is noted. Not taken seriously, but noted.
 
#391
#391
golfballs said:
It's akin to a mountain over a mole hill. A very small percentage of people were inconvenienced by it. Bad optics due to media frenzy but hardy the horror it's being portrayed
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The "bad optics" wasn't due to the "media frenzy", it's because there isn't a filter between the hamster in Donnys head and his twitter account.
 
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#392
#392
golfballs said:
It's akin to a mountain over a mole hill. A very small percentage of people were inconvenienced by it. Bad optics due to media frenzy but hardy the horror it's being portrayed
Click to expand...

No. It might be overblown, but it's not a mole hill. It's completely embarrassing and it's a terrible sogn of things to come. There is no communicatiom on Trump's team and he's just shooting from the hip. What happened to all the smart people he was going to rely on?
 
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#393
#393
BigOrangeTrain said:
Your opinion is noted. Not taken seriously, but noted.
Click to expand...

You have a strange penchant for disregarding facts that don't conform to your narrative. If Obama was as passive as you say he was, maybe he deserved his Peace Prize after all.

Of course, we both know that's a lie.
 
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#395
#395
Actually, it's more like butthurt zombies have congregated at airports to infect their diseases upon others
 
#396
#396
n_huffhines said:
No. It might be overblown, but it's not a mole hill. It's completely embarrassing and it's a terrible sogn of things to come. There is no communicatiom on Trump's team and he's just shooting from the hip. What happened to all the smart people he was going to rely on?
Click to expand...

They're squabbling with the black stretch pants women of America who compared her inauguration clothes to that of a revolutionary war soldier. Important stuff.
 
#398
#398
n_huffhines said:
Does it have to be a horror? Isn't it enough that it's bad government?

Look at it this way...if Trump's intent actually falls within the bounds of the constitution, it was still rolled out in terrible fashion. There is mass confusion among those who are carrying out this ex o, and it's being rolled out in unconstitutional ways. It's a cluster****.
Click to expand...

This unconstitutional crap has got to stop immediately!! A lot of America is fed up with this leftist progressive nonsense.. All that fall in that category Read This:

The first provision is Article I, Section 8, Clause 4, which empowers Congress, “To establish a uniform Rule of Naturalization.” Combined with Congress’s shared power with the president to govern the foreign policy of the nation, this provision gives the two elected branches discretion on who enters this country, how long they can stay, under what conditions, and by what process some of them can become citizens.

Regarding the scope of this power, as the Supreme Court held in its 1982 case United States v. Valenzuela-Bernal, “The power to regulate immigration—an attribute of sovereignty essential to the preservation of any nation—has been entrusted by the Constitution to the political branches of the Federal Government.” The Court then quoted a 1976 case, which acknowledged, “The Court without exception has sustained Congress’ plenary power to make rules for the admission of aliens.”
 
#400
#400
checkthetape said:
This unconstitutional crap has got to stop immediately!! A lot of America is fed up with this leftist progressive nonsense.. All that fall in that category Read This:

The first provision is Article I, Section 8, Clause 4, which empowers Congress, “To establish a uniform Rule of Naturalization.” Combined with Congress’s shared power with the president to govern the foreign policy of the nation, this provision gives the two elected branches discretion on who enters this country, how long they can stay, under what conditions, and by what process some of them can become citizens.

Regarding the scope of this power, as the Supreme Court held in its 1982 case United States v. Valenzuela-Bernal, “The power to regulate immigration—an attribute of sovereignty essential to the preservation of any nation—has been entrusted by the Constitution to the political branches of the Federal Government.” The Court then quoted a 1976 case, which acknowledged, “The Court without exception has sustained Congress’ plenary power to make rules for the admission of aliens.”
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I must have missed the part where Trump collaborated with Congress to enact this policy. Unconstitutional indeed.
 
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