Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXVI

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#1,651
#1,651
BigZiti09 said:
Agree and good post.

I didn't delve into the argument off the bat because I've been down this road before and it ends the same way. Posters telling me I am an idiot because I don't believe in stats. Well I don't always trust stats and I have valid reasons.

We should feel great about Shoop but I cringe when I see posters doing the "Shoop was top 25 at PSU and Vandy. Can you imagine what he's going to do here?" talk. It's not that simple. Sure, we should feel great about the hire but we won't know if he can do what he was brought here to do until we see him do it.
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It's understandable to have reservations until you see it here. It's also understandable to be optimistic based on Shoop's previous statistics. My earlier post was pointing out that it's not just about the teams that you face, but more the offenses you face. And the offenses he'll face here are on par with the ones he faced at PSU, where he was more successful than Jancek was for us. Sure, I could be wrong, but I'll be optimistic until proven otherwise.
 
#1,652
#1,652
zhangliao04 said:
As a career chemist....everything new is unproven until proven in the state that it is being referenced in.
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What is your hypothesis on our defense's performance this year? I think that we will be awesome, but am also very eager to see the evidence game in and game out :)
 
#1,653
#1,653
Kristy* said:
It's understandable to have reservations until you see it here. It's also understandable to be optimistic based on Shoop's previous statistics. My earlier post was pointing out that it's not just about the teams that you face, but more the offenses you face. And the offenses he'll face here are on par with the ones he faced at PSU, where he was more successful than Jancek was for us. Sure, I could be wrong, but I'll be optimistic until proven otherwise.
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I am optimistic.

I disagree with you on the offenses he faced at PSU being on par with what he will face here. SEC speed > Big10 slow. Also, like I said above we brought him in to get us over the hump versus the big dogs. What he does/did vs slow big 10 teams or UK/Vandy and the like isn't relevant.
 
#1,654
#1,654
BigZiti09 said:
Agree and good post.

I didn't delve into the argument off the bat because I've been down this road before and it ends the same way. Posters telling me I am an idiot because I don't believe in stats. Well I don't always trust stats and I have valid reasons.

We should feel great about Shoop but I cringe when I see posters doing the "Shoop was top 25 at PSU and Vandy. Can you imagine what he's going to do here?" talk. It's not that simple. Sure, we should feel great about the hire but we won't know if he can do what he was brought here to do until we see him do it.
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Absolutely. What we do know is, in his two previous stops, he did wondrous things with what he had. Reason 1 for optimism. We also know what Butch told him when hired. You were brought here to get us 2 more wins. I see that as CBJ saying, if we get to 10 wins regular season, then we have accomplished something and there is a really good chance we are in the SECCG and possibly the playoffs. Reason 2 for optimism.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with people having optimism for those reasons, but the fact still remains, all the fan optimism....or pessimism for that matter, is not going to be what wins or loses games. It will be the play on the field and coaching that does that. Neither of which we have seen for 2016 yet. Should we be a great team. My answer. Absolutely. Will we be a great team. Who knows. We'll start finding out in a couple of months.

My Orange shades answer.......15-0 baby!
 
#1,655
#1,655
So thinking about our trend last year of getting out to big leads early and letting them slip away (OK, UF, ARK, SC). A lot of that IMO had to do with Butch and Debo not trusting the O fully yet and having a bit too much trust in the D.

How much do you all see that changing this year?

In my opinion, Butch and Debo will SLIGHTLY get more aggressive with leads. It won't be a huge shift but I think it will be more aggressive then we were used to last year. BUT, the good news is I think now with Shoop and our D getting that much more talented and experienced they will actually be able to answer that call this year.

So all in all I think that general strategy could play out again this year but the results could be significantly different.

Thoughts?
 
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#1,657
#1,657
BigZiti09 said:
I am optimistic.

I disagree with you on the offenses he faced at PSU being on par with what he will face here. SEC speed > Big10 slow. Also, like I said above we brought him in to get us over the hump versus the big dogs. What he does/did vs slow big 10 teams or UK/Vandy and the like isn't relevant.
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The scoring offenses against PSU were higher than the scoring offenses against Tennessee. Something to remember - he had a slow Big 10 defense to stop those slow Big 10 offenses. Here he'll have plenty of speed to match the speed of the SEC offenses he'll face. It's not just what you're working against but what you're working with. I understand what you're staying, but I think he will take us up that level to be able to stop anyone.
 
#1,658
#1,658
utvols88 said:
I'm not allowed to attend confession anymore...
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I tried going to confession once. I left, feeling like maybe there was no hope for me, when I heard the priest throwing up on the other side of the little window and then heard the door slam as he was running away.




I'm not sure he ever returned. I may be screwed. :cray:
 
#1,659
#1,659
Ericvol2096 said:
So thinking about our trend last year of getting out to big leads early and letting them slip away (OK, UF, ARK, SC). A lot of that IMO had to do with Butch and Debo not trusting the O fully yet and having a bit too much trust in the D.

How much do you all see that changing this year?

In my opinion, Butch and Debo will SLIGHTLY get more aggressive with leads. It won't be a huge shift but I think it will be more aggressive then we were used to last year. BUT, the good news is I think now with Shoop and our D getting that much more talented and experienced they will actually be able to answer that call this year.

So all in all I think that general strategy could play out again this year but the results could be significantly different.

Thoughts?
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IMO, this will be interesting to see unfold. On one hand, Butch doesn't want to be passive on offense again and wants to put teams away. On the other hand, Butch trusts his new DC more than last year, and an errant throw here and there by Dobbs could lead to shorter fields.

I am not saying which way I would lean; just that it will be interesting to see what they do.
 
#1,660
#1,660
Kristy* said:
The scoring offenses against PSU were higher than the scoring offenses against Tennessee. Something to remember - he had a slow Big 10 defense to stop those slow Big 10 offenses. Here he'll have plenty of speed to match the speed of the SEC offenses he'll face. It's not just what you're working against but what you're working with. I understand what you're staying, but I think he will take us up that level to be able to stop anyone.
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It's also about his philosophy. His defensive philosophy is absolutely relevant regardless of past numbers.

We will have an aggressive defense that is flying all over the field.
 
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#1,661
#1,661
Maybe look at it this way.. Do you think Shoop would be 5-10 plays better on defense than Jancek? I say yes. Those 5-l0 plays would have gained us a couple more wins. JMO
 
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#1,664
#1,664
Ericvol2096 said:
So thinking about our trend last year of getting out to big leads early and letting them slip away (OK, UF, ARK, SC). A lot of that IMO had to do with Butch and Debo not trusting the O fully yet and having a bit too much trust in the D.

How much do you all see that changing this year?

In my opinion, Butch and Debo will SLIGHTLY get more aggressive with leads. It won't be a huge shift but I think it will be more aggressive then we were used to last year. BUT, the good news is I think now with Shoop and our D getting that much more talented and experienced they will actually be able to answer that call this year.

So all in all I think that general strategy could play out again this year but the results could be significantly different.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Playing not to lose is the easiest way to lose. I hope more than anything, that is what CBJ learned from last year.
 
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#1,666
#1,666
Go Fight Win said:
Kongbo is growing out dreads





15-0
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6' 5", 265 DE with dreads. Sounds familiar.



North+Carolina+v+South+Carolina+kfYFxgdK37Rl.jpg
 
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#1,673
#1,673
BigZiti09 said:
I disagree with you on the offenses he faced at PSU being on par with what he will face here. SEC speed > Big10 slow. Also, like I said above we brought him in to get us over the hump versus the big dogs. What he does/did vs slow big 10 teams or UK/Vandy and the like isn't relevant.
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I get that you don't value his Big 10 time. The part of you're argument I'm having trouble understanding is how you are dismissing some of his work at Vandy by bringing up UK. He played just as much of an SEC schedule as anyone else in the conference (with arguably less talent to work with than he has here).
 
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#1,674
#1,674
The SEC superiority is maxed out.

We're talking about the Big10. Not the WAC or Sun Belt. Yes, I know we beat some middle tier teams big in bowl games.
 
#1,675
#1,675
WallyBalls said:
I get that you don't value his Big 10 time. The part of you're argument I'm having trouble understanding is how you are dismissing some of his work at Vandy by bringing up UK. He played just as much of an SEC schedule as anyone else in the conference (with arguably less talent to work with than he has here).
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Go compare UT's schedule to Vandy's schedule during that time. IIRC we had an unbelievably difficult draw while Vandy was fortunate. Granted, it's Vandy so beating anyone should be celebrated by them.

I'm not dismissing anything. I'm saying it isn't apples to apples and does not always translate.
 
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