The Minimum Wage: What's the Big Deal?

How does that square with GOP stance on abortion?

What I can't understand about some social conservatives is how they can claim one of their core values is family, yet, when you want to put something in place to help families, they give you the sad sack story of the lonely small businessman who can't afford to help his employees. Well, that may be the case, but I just don't understand why this only seems to be an issue in this country, among the rest of the developed world. Hell, numerous non-developed countries have paid maternity leave.
 
Your solution may be a good policy for you, but it is hardly a solution for a modern society to survive in perpetuity, especially since the wealthy don't reproduce and are too few in numbers even if they did. Even the middle-class, which can afford children for the most part, is too small to replenish our labor force, even assuming the entire middle-class of reproductive years went and got freaky and started spitting out young'uns. This, even if they wanted to do so, which most statistics show they currently do not - at least not the white middle-class.

As I told you the other day concerning Bismarck, Prussia, and universal healthcare, this is not a conservative v. liberal thing. That's a false dichotomy created in our American context to serve certain political ends, namely elections. This is a pragmatic thing. Of course we don't want people leaching, but there's also no reason why anyone willing to work - as many are - should struggle for basic necessities. They don't have to be rich, or even middle-class, but there's no reason why they should go deep into debt for having a child or for getting sick.

In a modern world, where we want large economies, women must also work. So how are you going to address the matter of balancing living costs with reproduction necessities?

I'm all about women working. I'm about everyone pulling their weight. If they can't afford to have a kid they don't need to be having kids. I can't believe people still don't understand that. I didn't make it so only women can have babies. You can hate God or nature for that one.

You're absolutely right about the classes and birth. The beginning of Idiocracy is spot on, and you openly support it. Right now the middle and upper classes are paying poor people to pop out kids and now you want to pay them even more to do that. This needs to stop. People need to start being responsible for their actions. Don't have kids you can't pay for. Taxpayers don't need to pay more to people staying home and popping out kids. Because that's what we're doing right now and you want to shell out even more for it. Makes no sense.


If companies want to do it then good for them. It should not be law and/or taxpayer funded.
 
Paid maternity/paternity leave has to be incorporated into Cost Of Doing Business, CODB. The whole CODB has to be incorporated into the product cost without blowing it out of the competitive market. Neither can expected profit be decreased or there is no incentive to run the business in the first place.

Current operating plans have a thin profit margin in the global marketplace, small changes can mean big risks. These plans in the US were developed without maternity/paternity leave. Big business is much more able to develop and fund a working changeover plan than the "lonely small businessman".
 
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What I can't understand about some social conservatives is how they can claim one of their core values is family, yet, when you want to put something in place to help families, they give you the sad sack story of the lonely small businessman who can't afford to help his employees. Well, that may be the case, but I just don't understand why this only seems to be an issue in this country, among the rest of the developed world. Hell, numerous non-developed countries have paid maternity leave.

"Helping" families by increasing taxes on already strained taxpayers isn't "helping" anything.

America should strive to be more like non-developed countries? Some countries don't have reliable electricity or clean, running water/sewage. We should try that too. You're awesome Volprof. Please don't change.
 
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Paid maternity/paternity leave has to be incorporated into Cost Of Doing Business, CODB. The whole CODB has to be incorporated into the product cost without blowing it out of the competitive market. Neither can expected profit be decreased or there is no incentive to run the business in the first place.

Current operating plans have a thin profit margin in the global marketplace, small changes can mean big risks. These plans in the US were developed without maternity/paternity leave. Big business is much more able to develop and fund a working changeover plan than the "lone small business".

I don't doubt for a second that there are numerous problems and numerous negative consequences to implementing such plans in our American context, which is why I also plead for caution.

What I don't understand, however, is why this mostly seems like a problem that only we face. Canada and many northern European societies are doing just fine as far as these policies are concerned. How come it works for them, but possibly not for us (which I don't dispute)? That tells me that something is fundamentally different about the structure of our society, economy, and political system, as far as these and related matters are concerned.

What I'm essentially asking is what is it about our current organization that means that the average American has lesser things (and works more hours on average) than his or her European counterparts.
 
"Helping" families by increasing taxes on already strained taxpayers isn't "helping" anything.

America should strive to be more like non-developed countries? Some countries don't have reliable electricity or clean, running water/sewage. We should try that too. You're awesome Volprof. Please don't change.

Yes, because this is exactly what I said.
 
I'm all about women working. I'm about everyone pulling their weight. If they can't afford to have a kid they don't need to be having kids. I can't believe people still don't understand that. I didn't make it so only women can have babies. You can hate God or nature for that one.

You're absolutely right about the classes and birth. The beginning of Idiocracy is spot on, and you openly support it. Right now the middle and upper classes are paying poor people to pop out kids and now you want to pay them even more to do that. This needs to stop. People need to start being responsible for their actions. Don't have kids you can't pay for. Taxpayers don't need to pay more to people staying home and popping out kids. Because that's what we're doing right now and you want to shell out even more for it. Makes no sense.


If companies want to do it then good for them. It should not be law and/or taxpayer funded.

Yes, talk about personal responsibility is nice. No sane person disagrees with you.

But what I'm not seeing here is how you're going to reproduce our society.

Sounds like you ought to take up my idea about moving into the central Alaskan woods, so that you can be alone and enjoy your freedom.
 
Its going to be hilarious to watch how this unfolds in these cities & states that have approved the $15 minimum wage.

Does anyone think its going end at $15? They walked out, marched & protested to get that just wait they will start begging for $18-$20 next.

Get ready as prices & unemployment will skyrocket!

You will see it happen at restaurants & fast food places first. Don't be surprised to see the privately owned/mom & pop eateries to go out of business or only open own certain days of the week. Then it will happen for goods & services at all other kinds of stores as well Walmart, Target & Best Buy among others just wait!
 
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Its going to be hilarious to watch how this unfolds in these cities & states that have approved the $15 minimum wage.

Does anyone think its going end at $15? They walked out, marched & protested to get that just wait they will start begging for $18-$20 next.

Get ready as prices & unemployment will skyrocket!

You will see it happen at restaurants & fast food places first. Don't be surprised to see the privately owned/mom & pop eateries to go out of business or only open own certain days of the week. Then it will happen for goods & services at all other kinds of stores as well Walmart, Target & Best Buy among others just wait!

You're absolutely correct. There are too many people that don't understand human nature. There are also too many people that don't understand even basic level economics either.
 
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I used the self-checkout at Walmart today. I looked over at my son and said, why pay a high school dropout $15/hour?
 
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I used the self-checkout at Walmart today. I looked over at my son and said, why pay a high school dropout $15/hour?

Wait until you pay for them to be off work to have a baby they can't afford. You're the scum of society sir... Haha
 
Somebody's gotta do it. Can't have only teenagers serving our smug faces our lattes, Whoppers, and merchandise. Wouldn't be enough laborers to meet our demands.

I'm not necessarily a $15 minimum wage guy, and I think regional costs differences should also play a part in this debate (rather than assuming it should be universal), but I don't understand how this is something that Europe does with relative success yet we somehow can't do it because we'll have to pay too much for services/goods and/or lose our jobs. Something just doesn't add up to me.

Minimum Wage should be state by state never should have been a federal issue.
 
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I'm all about women working. I'm about everyone pulling their weight. If they can't afford to have a kid they don't need to be having kids. I can't believe people still don't understand that. I didn't make it so only women can have babies. You can hate God or nature for that one.

You're absolutely right about the classes and birth. The beginning of Idiocracy is spot on, and you openly support it. Right now the middle and upper classes are paying poor people to pop out kids and now you want to pay them even more to do that. This needs to stop. People need to start being responsible for their actions. Don't have kids you can't pay for. Taxpayers don't need to pay more to people staying home and popping out kids. Because that's what we're doing right now and you want to shell out even more for it. Makes no sense.


If companies want to do it then good for them. It should not be law and/or taxpayer funded.
Spot on sir, but you are whizzin in a hurricane.
 
How come in societies in the past you could work your 20 hours a week of hunting or gathering, a woman could have a child, and everyone could be provided for, and no one today considers them all lazy, reprobate, or overly demanding? And yet, today, we have people who could work 80 hours a week and still barely get by and women who want to be a part of the labor force but also want to still provide us with our future generations, and half of us complain about what a bunch of lazy, stupid, and demanding people they are.

I don't want to go back to the past, but if you don't think this gap between the two in terms of perspective sucks, then, man, that sucks. In some ways, while we've largely improved our quality of life, we've just made things more difficult on ourselves and have isolated ourselves from a sense of what is required of us to function appropriately as a well-adjusted society.

We can't have our cake and eat it at the same time. We're going to have to decide what is more important to us: providing women with a means to work, have children, and still contribute another income to a family that now requires at least two incomes, or returning to gendered economic models before post-Industrial society. Our problem at the moment is that we're attempting to do both at the same time. This won't work forever.

how long ago are you talking? also the way it works is because the mothers got back out there and worked that day or the day after. and people living on hunting and gathering aren't expecting the lifestyle the 15 dollars an hour are. they expect to live like they make 60-70k a year. thats the problem. live within your means. make choices contradictory to that, thats on you. not society. I don't think its the US government's job, or any government, to follow behind everyone ready to pick up where they fall short.
 
I don't doubt for a second that there are numerous problems and numerous negative consequences to implementing such plans in our American context, which is why I also plead for caution.

What I don't understand, however, is why this mostly seems like a problem that only we face. Canada and many northern European societies are doing just fine as far as these policies are concerned. How come it works for them, but possibly not for us (which I don't dispute)? That tells me that something is fundamentally different about the structure of our society, economy, and political system, as far as these and related matters are concerned.

What I'm essentially asking is what is it about our current organization that means that the average American has lesser things (and works more hours on average) than his or her European counterparts.

as someone else said, the MIC. ours is so dang big they don't need em. so keeping the peace means we can't have the things others can. right or wrong doesn't come into it. also the combined economy of Europe doesn't match the US. easy to make things work on that smaller scale. fewer moving pieces, fewer slices of the pie and fewer outside interests. you see us drastically reduce our military you would crush European economies when they try to fill the void.
 
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I used the self-checkout at Walmart today. I looked over at my son and said, why pay a high school dropout $15/hour?

I used it one time and it was the last time I will use it! If you have one or two things it may be fine but I usually have buggy full.
 
I used it one time and it was the last time I will use it! If you have one or two things it may be fine but I usually have buggy full.

self checkouts are all I use. Heck of a lot faster than waiting in line at Kroger or anywhere else that has them.
 
Less than a million workers make the minimum wage.. It
R rally Geri f a wage increase for the union and spread between the to
 
as someone else said, the MIC. ours is so dang big they don't need em. so keeping the peace means we can't have the things others can. right or wrong doesn't come into it. also the combined economy of Europe doesn't match the US. easy to make things work on that smaller scale. fewer moving pieces, fewer slices of the pie and fewer outside interests. you see us drastically reduce our military you would crush European economies when they try to fill the void.

Perhaps this solely explains it all, but I am still doubtful that it explains it alone. For instance, it's not clear to me what exactly the relationship is between our defense spending, Europe's lack thereof, and northern European wage earnings. Northern European social programs and entitlements? Yes, it's clear to me what that relationship is with American military spending and defense subsidies, but not with wage earnings.
 
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