Butch says it takes 6 to 7 years to build a program in the SEC

Beating bama is necessary to accomplish the goals of winning rings. It should not be a requirement for Butch to keep his job. Say it's a rare belief all you want but I've seen it stated way too many times on here to believe that

i'm not sure what we're arguing over. in merit, i agree with you. on a singular basis, no single game should dictate whether a coach keeps his job or not, in a given year.

i won't speak for others, but i'm not putting CBJ and co. on a "year to year" based on the outcomes of that game.

it is, though, as you said most certainly a requirement for this program to achieve bigger and better things.

and that's what this staff was brought here to do.
 
I disagree. I think we need to beat FLorida to take the lead in the East but losing to Bama in a competitive game next year is not a deal breaker.

AGreed. in the current landscape, beating FL is more important to the season's goals than beating Bama.

and presently, seems to be more achievable as well.
 
AGreed. in the current landscape, beating FL is more important to the season's goals than beating Bama.

and presently, seems to be more achievable as well.

Yep... Alabama might be THE game, but in reality it's much more important to beat Florida and Georgia.
 
Very few in the entire country are beating bama yet it's now a requirement for Butch. This gets dumber by the day
"Entire country"???? Last time I checked we are part of the SEC. Is it too much to expect our team to win Our Conference after years and years of CBJ? I don't believe anyone has stated anything about teams from other conferences winning our conference, if they did, they need to put down their crack pipe. We need to "Tend to our own business", we don't play for, nor do I care, what teams are Champions in Other conferences. Let's stick to SEC play, CBJ is a coach in the SEC, we should be looking to win in the SEC. This concept is very difficult to some to grasp, it seems pretty simple to the rest of us.:crazy:
 
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Yep... Alabama might be THE game, but in reality it's much more important to beat Florida and Georgia.

and another thing...you can still win the SEC losing to Bama in the reg season, if you beat FL and GA.

which still clears a path toward the playoff and NT.

so really, beating Bama is what it is because it's Bama.....but relevant to what you can now accomplish...it doesn't mean much, if you handle business elsewhere.
 
"Entire country"???? Last time I checked we are part of the SEC. Is it too much to expect our team to win Our Conference after years and years of CBJ? I don't believe anyone has stated anything about teams from other conferences winning our conference, if they did, they need to put down their crack pipe. We need to "Tend to our own business", we don't play for, nor do I care, what teams are Champions in Other conferences. Let's stick to SEC play, CBJ is a coach in the SEC, we should be looking to win in the SEC. This concept is very difficult to some to grasp, it seems pretty simple to the rest of us.:crazy:

Looks like you've got the simple part nailed down
 
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UTVol pajamas.

It really is simple. Either you care about this team or you don't.

Desiring, expecting, demanding wins is a good thing. It shows that the program is becoming relevant again after your boy Dooley about killed it.

Accepting mediocrity, extending losing streaks to rivals, waiting till next year only hurts the program.
 
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UTVol pajamas.

It really is simple. Either you care about this team or you don't.

Desiring, expecting, demanding wins is a good thing. It shows that the program is becoming relevant again after your boy Dooley about killed it.

Accepting mediocrity, extending losing streaks to rivals, waiting till next year only hurts the program.
i hate it when people say this.

no one is doing that TG. asserting otherwise is no different when the other side says you're "not a real fan".

it's the absolutes so many people on this board deal in that make everything seem so unreasonable and antagonistic.

there's no room for error on either side, put your stake in the ground and defend it to the death.
 
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Yep... Alabama might be THE game, but in reality it's much more important to beat Florida and Georgia.

I think Mizzou and USC are gonna slip some.

For the next few years (thru this decade), it will be Tennessee, Georgia, and Florida in the East.
We have to beat at least one of them to be in the hunt.
 
Jake, they really are doing it (accepting mediocrity), and it is because (in a lot of cases) they never lived or were too young to, or just can't remember when fans expected Tennessee to win EVERY game. When our boys didn't win, it was heartbreaking and we all hurt.

I don't know if is they don't care or just have no frame of reference, but when we have a loss, especially in a game we should have won, it would do my heart good to see more people actually upset about that.

I also get that we now live in a society of participation trophies and moral victories, but this old school guy here just hasn't accepted that way of thinking.
 
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Vague question...and where are the paragraphs? And you didn't answer the question. BOTH this year? Or spread it out? :question:

Ask a coherent and meaningful question... and I may answer it. Keep acting (I hope it is an act) like an idiot... and I think I'll pass.
 
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Jake, they really are doing it (accepting mediocrity), and it is because (in a lot of cases) they never lived or were too young to, or just can't remember when fans expected Tennessee to win EVERY game. When our boys didn't win, it was heartbreaking and we all hurt.

I don't know if is they don't care or just have no frame of reference, but when we have a loss, especially in a game we should have won, it would do my heart good to see more people actually upset about that.

I also get that we now live in a society of participation trophies and moral victories, but this old school guy here just hasn't accepted that way of thinking.

Disagree entirely, Tall Guy.

You don't have to go apoplectic on the coach and/or players to prove your frustration or anger at a loss. The coaches and players don't benefit from it (they don't need you signalling like this to realize the loss was a Bad Thing to figure out ways to Avoid in the Future). It doesn't prove your fanhood, as you seem to be claiming. It only proves that you have limited control over your emotional outbursts.

As for supporting the coaches (and players), you don't have to approve of everything they do to offer your support. It's not an all-or-nothing game.

I think your assessment of the younger generation of fans is unfair to them, and wrong as well. They get winning, and they get losing. The majority of them simply have a better handle on their emotions than the "Fahr Butch! -- No, erect a statue for him! -- No, Fahr him!" mood swingers of VN.
 
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Jake, they really are doing it (accepting mediocrity), and it is because (in a lot of cases) they never lived or were too young to, or just can't remember when fans expected Tennessee to win EVERY game. When our boys didn't win, it was heartbreaking and we all hurt.

I don't know if is they don't care or just have no frame of reference, but when we have a loss, especially in a game we should have won, it would do my heart good to see more people actually upset about that.

I also get that we now live in a society of participation trophies and moral victories, but this old school guy here just hasn't accepted that way of thinking.

i'm old enough to remember. but i'm also smart enough to know what this program has been thru the past 8 years and where we are today is light years from where we were after the 2012. rudderless, captainless ship, w/no direction or hope.

i think this has nothing to do with participation trophies or new vs. old school.

this has everything to do with having the ability to understand where we are today has nothing to do with what happened 20 years ago, and 20 years ago is not the measuring stick this group of Volunteers should be measured against, at least as it relates to a single season.

in other words, it does no good to say that because we won 10 games every year in the late 90's i'm not going to accept NOT winning 10 games now.

with no regard or respect for how we happened to get where we are now.

we sucked out loud for a pretty good stint over the last decade.

you don't go from a perennial 5-7 team to play off contender in a year or two (spare me the jim mclewain comparison, FL wasn't a perennial 5-7 team, and they didn't have 5-7 talent).

i will still contend that with what CBJ had to work with when he set foot on campus, to what they are today, should not go unnoticed or unacknowledged.

we are though, now to that point where it is reasonable to expect a 10 win season...a legit shot at beating FL and Bama again....this team is now that good. it looks like this program is in full on rebuilding mode.

it's completely realistic to believe, expect, want.....whatever you want to put in here....that we can beat FL, can beat AL and can win 10+ games....

and that if we don't, that all that hurt you talk about is now real again. it was real again in 15.

it does not , however, mean that it's time to reboot the whole program again if we lose those games and only win 9 in 2016.

and that doesn't mean i'm accepting mediocrity. that's a ludicrous statement.

for those of you out there that "aren't going to accept mediocrity"...then you need to put your money where your mouth is....because as fans, the only thing you can do to "not accept mediocrity" is some form of the following, but not limited to:

1. cancel your dish network subscription
2. don't buy any TN gear
3. Cancel ESPN and SEC Network
4. Don't even think about buying season tickets or single game tickets.
5. don't donate to the VASF.
6. contribute in no way to anything that positively impacts the athletic or football programs financially.


and if enough of you start doing this, then you're officially "not accepting mediocrity".

coming on VN and just stating "i'm not going to accept mediocrity", well, just doesn't really matter.

i'm happy with 8-4. not because it's the "new standard" at ut. but because when you go 5-7 for frickin 4 years in a row, it feels good not to suck out loud.:thumbsup:
 
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Very few in the entire country are beating bama yet it's now a requirement for Butch. This gets dumber by the day

I actually agree with you. I think beating bama no matter how close the game was, was not going to happen. They look at us as a Kentucky probably. But I do think both OU and Florida were winnable.
 
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well, it's been four pages, but here goes...:

....in the context of the interview that was going on, the whole 6-7 years was brought up in direct response to a question or statement about having RS jr's and RS sr's on the roster. to that end, CBJ stated that it takes 6-7 years to build the kind of quality depth needed to maintain success at a high level. he DID NOT say it would take him 6-7 years to have a winning team at Tennessee. he didn' tsay it would be 6-7 years before we'd win the EAST or the SEC. now, carry on.
 
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I can't speak for anyone but myself, however...

I think folks who applaud this team's progress/performance are anything but accepting mediocrity. If anything, it is an acceptance of a prelude to greater things; one that hasn't been seen in a good little while.

2015 was a mediocre season, by Tennessee standards, and I'm OK with that. Does that mean I accept mediocrity? It does not, because I don't view this as the ceiling for the program under its current leadership.

Sunny days ahead...
 
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I can't speak for anyone but myself, however...

I think folks who applaud this team's progress/performance are anything but accepting mediocrity. If anything, it is an acceptance of a prelude to greater things; one that hasn't been seen in a good little while.

2015 was a mediocre season, by Tennessee standards, and I'm OK with that. Does that mean I accept mediocrity? It does not, because I don't view this as the ceiling for the program under its current leadership.

Sunny days ahead...

much simpler way of saying what i said, thank you for condensing it down in a one liner.:thumbsup:
 
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Uncontrolled emotional outburst? This is a fan message board. Can you tell me a better place to VENT your frustration as a fan?

Again...I have stated this many times...

No matter who is coach or what our record is, I will always love the Vols and be a Vol fan.

I will for d@mn sure voice my opinions as it is my right as a Vol fan to do so.

I will not be happy with 8-4 seasons or 9-3 when we lose AGAIN to FLA and/or bammer...I just won't and I will vent my frustration here. I will not accept moral victories or moral losses.

I will be a fan with GREAT passion and I will expect others to do so as well. They won't be, but I will still expect it. I will watch the games, wear my orange, and talk smack to any other college teams' fan...especially these chokies up here.

If you can't handle people expressing frustration or, on the flip side, those who are always sunshine pumping, maybe Volnation is not for you. I welcome your opinion...I may not agree with you and will likely argue with you, but as long as you are a Volunteer fan, you have every right to be on here and express said opinion.
 
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Jake, they really are doing it (accepting mediocrity), and it is because (in a lot of cases) they never lived or were too young to, or just can't remember when fans expected Tennessee to win EVERY game. When our boys didn't win, it was heartbreaking and we all hurt.

I don't know if is they don't care or just have no frame of reference, but when we have a loss, especially in a game we should have won, it would do my heart good to see more people actually upset about that.

I also get that we now live in a society of participation trophies and moral victories, but this old school guy here just hasn't accepted that way of thinking.

Unless you're a connected booster donating large sums, your heartbreak from a loss or joy after a win is inconsequential when it comes to the future of the UT program.
 
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Unless you're a connected booster donating large sums, your heartbreak from a loss or joy after a win is inconsequential when it comes to the future of the UT program.

I disagree. There was another thread on Tennessee being ranked #2 in merchandise sales. Do you think boosters were the only contributors. Look what happened to Dooley at the end of his last season. Significantly less people in the seats affects the economy of the university and the city. Vice versa for wins. Money talks and winning or losing speaks volumes. Jones is doing things correct now, but another loss to Florida will mean some bad things down the road.
 
Ask a coherent and meaningful question... and I may answer it. Keep acting (I hope it is an act) like an idiot... and I think I'll pass.

You're very personal and insulting. And you get away with it. :). What part of "does Butch have to beat them BOTH" next season has you so perplexed? Most "idiots" would be able to figure it out...after the THIRD issuance.
 
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